Kutai Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 Hello, Fellow Captains and members of the Tribunal, I look to you for a sound judgement and ruling on the following issue. At approximately 22:20 hours UK, Myself and SirZech assaulted Captain Tommy Shelby in his Santisima off the coast of Cuba. We were in a Constitution and a Tricom so heavily out gunned. Two of his firends also joined but left shortly after while we concentrated fire on the Santisima to keep it in the battle. After 20 minutes of chasing, dodging and attacking we had discovered that Tommy had only brought medium cannons, so we massively out ranged him with our longs. Tommy put his sails up as if accepting defeat and we set about attempting to demast him. Tommy then began to complain that we were 'griefing' him. When we stated we would continue to fight and intended to sink him something very strange happened. With 1:20 seconds left on my leave timer from having just hit him, he dissapeared completely. He was unavailable in game just after also as if he has disconnected. I have this recorded on video and I will upload it when I can. (First time I used twitch video) I believe this was an intentional exploit of game mechanics in order for him to escape the battle and save his ship and or deny it from us. This has happened multiple times recently with US players from a specific group and I would not have believed it if I had not witnessed it myself and recorded it also. For the consideration of the Tribunal. If I am mistaken for some reason then I apologise. However with his comments, followed by him leaving and then being offline in game.. I can not think of any other way this could have happened. Thank you, Yours Sincerely, Captain Kuthara. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prater Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 This has happened multiple times recently with US players from a specific group and I would not have believed it if I had not witnessed it myself and recorded it also. Uhhh, details and evidence with clear and precise examples please. And please upload the recording. As part of the leadership of his clan, I certainly know nothing about this and surely I would have heard something if half of the clan is exploiting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kutai Posted January 7, 2016 Author Share Posted January 7, 2016 I currently have it recorded on Xsplit - I was streaming at the time. I am just trying to figure out how to upload it onto my Twitch now or onto Youtube. Sorry I am a bit of a rookie streamer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B4NGSPL4T Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 Proof or Poop (i.e a smear campaign).Don't make a Tribunal case without posting the proof initially, saying you have proof and actually producing it are two very different things. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kutai Posted January 7, 2016 Author Share Posted January 7, 2016 As I have stated. I am attempting to find a way to upload onto Youtube or onto Twitch in decent definition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyShelby Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 Wait, i am being tribunal'd for leaving the battle when i can? My leave battle timer ran out and i left the battle. On the other hand. You were straight up griefing. A few minutes ago the pirates were trying to attack Puerto Del Padre. Several US frigates bravely attacked the pirate main fleet to delay the attack long enough for the US main fleet to arrive. The US frigates were sunk but held out long enough for the main fleet to arrive. When the main fleets were about to face off (atleast that's what it looked like) several of the US ships were tagged independently by smaller ships. While the whole "Split up the enemy fleet if possible" is a valid strategy. Griefing is not. Imo. it's fine if someone splits up the enemy fleet and actually fight in these battle that they start. But if they have no intention of fighting but instead just want to sit far away and pepper you with shots that do no damage but keeps you tagged then that is what i see as griefing. We sent our frigates in to actually fight the Pirate Flag Carrier, they all sank, but they managed to fight for long enough to let our main fleet arrive. I was in my Santi and was tagged by a Connie and a Trinc. At first i sat there with my sails furled since i really just wanted to get out and help the main fleet. They stayed far away and downwind so that they could use the heel to have even longer range. After five minutes i got tired of them sitting there so i figured, i'll set sail and go towards them. As i started to come closer they immediately ran further downwind so that they again were at max range where they were unable to do any damage. Screenshot of chat before i left the battle; Oh, i should probably also add that i exit'd the game in the "battle result screen" as our main fleet was scattered around in several different instances, all of which were closed at the time. Edit; On another note, you come here to the tribunal suddenly saying you had intentions of sinking me? Yet you stayed at max range where you do not do any damage. I call bullshit. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B4NGSPL4T Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 Splitting up a fleet to attack them independently is a great tactic. Starting a battle just to sit on the edge of range and keep someone in battle with no intention of fighting is not.You can put a pig in a dress and makeup but it is still a pig. This is an abomination of a valid tactic and is in as many words, griefing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Black Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 I take it the people responding are from this players clan? If so, maybe you should do some investigating of your own and determine that as well and not to just jump on someone for reporting it, get your heads out of your arses and wait. If the evidence isn't provided within a day or two then obviously Kuthara needs to explain why, a reason along the lines of "I accidentally deleted it" will not do either. And a suitable punishment put in place for a false accusation but as a clan leader, if your guys are exploiting, then it's your job to know about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kutai Posted January 7, 2016 Author Share Posted January 7, 2016 How did we have no intention of fighting, we were hitting him consistantly. Sorry if we do not want to get in range of your Santis guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manuva85 Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 So you atacked him with a sole purpose of tagging him from max range in trincs while he couldnt do nothing. Than you failed in penetrating so he could exit... and now you made a Tribunal post. Sure why not.... If i found you in Open world im going to demast you and tag you fro whole timer.... let's see how you gonna like it... 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 I can understend usage of trinks in this way, but puting tribunal case against Tomy it is quite wrong way. Also it was a gammey not a proper way of fighting, so i see no case. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyShelby Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 How did we have no intention of fighting, we were hitting him consistantly. Sorry if we do not want to get in range of your Santis guns. Exactly how do you intend to sink me if your outside of effective range of your own guns? - All you could possibly achieve from the range you sat at, and stayed at, is to keep me tagged and in a battle instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Black Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 I have to agree, and recall my last comments gents, i was in the middle of posting when the accused posted In combat tactics are only limited by the mind of captains involved, yes, tagging to separate strength from a fleet there by depleating its effectiveness is a good tactic, but having no actual intention of fighting is not only wasting time of someone who wants to level up and fight, but it proves that you as a group can't handle fights with anyone above a cutter. I can't help but think you got pissed of when he left according to his time and left you in the instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prater Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 I take it the people responding are from this players clan? If so, maybe you should do some investigating of your own and determine that as well and not to just jump on someone for reporting it, get your heads out of your arses and wait. If the evidence isn't provided within a day or two then obviously Kuthara needs to explain why, a reason along the lines of "I accidentally deleted it" will not do either. And a suitable punishment put in place for a false accusation but as a clan leader, if your guys are exploiting, then it's your job to know about it. No, we need evidence. And he accused TDA of a serious crime of a serious exploit of a battle mechanic. I want clear and precise evidence of this, otherwise it is slander. I have not been aware of this nor have I heard anyone talking about it in our TS or forums. I want clear examples that I can investigate, or it is slander. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 Long range hit does not mean long range damage It is a common complaint that sometimes gave an impression that enemy exited even if it was hit at the last second - it happened due to non - penetrating hits or ricochets. If you hit you may see a hit particle but it does not mean you did damage. If you upload the video it would be great to see what happened. Also in the future please report such cases by F11 right from the battle. But based on your description we believe that you saw non-penetrating hits - as such tribunals or questions happened before. Regarding the in game chat questions on whether he (tommy shelby) Alt f4. Ship stays in battle if you alt-f4. There was a rare bug before that allowed you to lottery your durability and not lose it in some cases (but your ship still stayed in battle). It is fixed now 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kutai Posted January 7, 2016 Author Share Posted January 7, 2016 Right. Since you seem happy to jump on me even though I was asked to submit this onto the Tribunal by your own clan and the admins I will explain a few things. Firstly, I do have a video which I will be uploading. We were not intending to simply sit there and hold him in battle all day, we were attempting to demast him so that we can move in and begin to work on his armour. We had effectively kept him in battle for 30 minutes or so at this point, from this range, with our long cannons and he was unable to reach us. At the point of Tommy Leaving the battle, I had just landed several hits on him which ensured I was stuck in battle and he should have also been. I had over a minute left of my timer. The US fleet are the ones who initially attempted to split OUR fleet. We happened to be left out of the main conflict and pulled in Tommy in his Santi. He was supported by two frigates who then left. I am still attempting to upload the footage so that you can see what I mean. Admins are also reviewing the case as I put in a report as soon as it happened in the battle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prater Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 And also, chat violations are supposed to be reported in game with the Report function by right clicking the player name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Black Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 No, we need evidence. And he accused TDA of a serious crime of a serious exploit of a battle mechanic. I want clear and precise evidence of this, otherwise it is slander. I have not been aware of this nor have I heard anyone talking about it in our TS or forums. I want clear examples that I can investigate, or it is slander. I understand that, and yes providing proof is better, but I think giving the benefit of the doubt would not hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyShelby Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 The US fleet are the ones who initially attempted to split OUR fleet. We happened to be left out of the main conflict and pulled in Tommy in his Santi. He was supported by two frigates who then left. I am still attempting to upload the footage so that you can see what I mean. Admins are also reviewing the case as I put in a report as soon as it happened in the battle. The difference is that our ships actually engaged in combat and most of them sank after a short time fighting against bigger ships. You simply sat at range where your cannons are ineffective at doing damage yet are effective at keeping me tagged and stuck in the instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Black Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 Right. Since you seem happy to jump on me even though I was asked to submit this onto the Tribunal by your own clan and the admins I will explain a few things. Firstly, I do have a video which I will be uploading. We were not intending to simply sit there and hold him in battle all day, we were attempting to demast him so that we can move in and begin to work on his armour. We had effectively kept him in battle for 30 minutes or so at this point, from this range, with our long cannons and he was unable to reach us. At the point of Tommy Leaving the battle, I had just landed several hits on him which ensured I was stuck in battle and he should have also been. I had over a minute left of my timer. The US fleet are the ones who initially attempted to split OUR fleet. We happened to be left out of the main conflict and pulled in Tommy in his Santi. He was supported by two frigates who then left. I am still attempting to upload the footage so that you can see what I mean. Admins are also reviewing the case as I put in a report as soon as it happened in the battle. The problem is you haven't posted evidence of this, and although you give an account of it, until the video is linked you will be the one they attack because you posted a tribunal on the forums, it's a stupid way of behaving but that what people do who have a clan member blamed for something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 The difference is that our ships actually engaged in combat and most of them sank after a short time fighting against bigger ships. You simply sat at range where your cannons are ineffective at doing damage yet are effective at keeping me tagged and stuck in the instance. Lets not mix two different things here Please bring your questions passive aggressive pirates into a separate thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Black Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 I wouldn't say they are mixing anything, merely he is stating what they were doing. It's you who labeled it as passive aggressive pirates. You'll find most nations are passive aggressive due to the fact that they see an opportunity to use a method that works, no matter how pointless the method. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kutai Posted January 8, 2016 Author Share Posted January 8, 2016 Hello chaps. Please find my video. It is not perfect but it has been viewed by an admin who verified it. They will be looking into the F11 tomorrow to identify exactly what happened. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hZPpgqR8nY. I am still attempting to get a better res on it so you can see it clearer but I am not very technically minded and I can not figure out how to sort it. If you look between 10-13 seconds however you will see the red timer tick from 01:00 to 00:59. This timer had started from the last penetrating hit I had landed on Tommy. Less than a few seconds later he vanishes from the game causing the end of the match. Hope this helps shed some light on the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Black Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 Thank you for that Kuthara, I clearly see a timer with 40-50 seconds remaining, as far as I know that means the other player should have the same time limit. Care to explain that one, Tommy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyShelby Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 Long range hit does not mean long range damage It is a common complaint that sometimes gave an impression that enemy exited even if it was hit at the last second - it happened due to non - penetrating hits or ricochets. If you hit you may see a hit particle but it does not mean you did damage. If you upload the video it would be great to see what happened. Also in the future please report such cases by F11 right from the battle. But based on your description we believe that you saw non-penetrating hits - as such tribunals or questions happened before. Regarding the in game chat questions on whether he (tommy shelby) Alt f4. Ship stays in battle if you alt-f4. There was a rare bug before that allowed you to lottery your durability and not lose it in some cases (but your ship still stayed in battle). It is fixed now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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