Instance Exit Tweaks

[DazednConfused]

Hi All

 

I have, over the past months noticed a concerning flaw in the instance.

 

Scenario 1. The 1v1.

 

Two players are in an instance. For whatever reason one of the players decide they need to bug out. To do this they either juke away and run at best speed, or are straight out faster than their opponent. To escape two things need to happen. The runner needs to put distance between him and his enemy and he cant get hit or the escape timer resets.

 

He escapes.

 

Scenario 2. 2v1 .

 

2 players have managed to tag a solitary ship due to teamwork (or the cunning solitary ship has allowed them to) the battle ensues. As one of the team is closer or is the more dangerous target the solitary guy decides to focus on him first. Due to good positioning and skill the solitary ship succeeds in killing the greater threat, he turns to engage the other ship. It promptly teleports out of the battle.

 

Eh?

 

Scenario 3. Fleet Battle

 

Lets say its a 5v5 SOL battle. SOL's are now sluggish to turn and can get very slow with some sail damage. If one team focus fires on only one ship, then as long as the other team holds fire they can teleport out. Or a player resets his position in the battle by pulling out and sailing upwind unnoticed to attack from another vector. since he hasn't fired due to poor shot angle he can jump out of the battle if the tide turns on his mates.

 

My problem with the 2nd and third scenario is the ships jumping out of the instance have not escaped. They are perfectly within range of the ships around them, but for whatever reason they have escaped fire. You should not be able to leave an instance in the middle of an engagement.

 

My solution is simple. you should need to satisfy two things to be able to leave an instance.

 

1. your escape timer runs out.

2. you have sailed 1000m away from enemy combatants.

 

I think this is entirely reasonable.

 

Discuss

 

 

[TommyShelby]

I think this is entirely reasonable.

+1  

[akd]

I had a player ship in combat broadside to broadside with me that disappeared right in my face, an instant after I fired into him (apparently the damage takes a moment to reset the timer). That situation shouldn't have happened at all.

[Guthwait]

Basically like a modified combat ring. Like it.

[admin]

Basically like a modified combat ring. Like it.

 

Seems that combat ring that was implemented 1 week after Sea trials opened in november to eliminate running was one of the best features and is getting more and more support to return to the OW in some form.

[DazednConfused]

Seems that combat ring that was implemented 1 week after Sea trials opened in november to eliminate running was one of the best features and is getting more and more support to return to the OW in some form.

 

Too true. Sometimes when attacking others i feel like calling the game Naval Avoiding Action.

 

 

But the massive ring around the instance is not what i'm after.

[mirror452]

Well... In my opinion you SHOULD be able to run away. Just in a reasonable way, like DazednConfused said.

[NorthernWolves]

I absolutely loathed that ring. I can speak for 20 TDA members who all breathed a huge sigh of relief when it was removed. Dazed has brought up some real issues, but please no, not the ring, that's not a solution.

 

Didn't we have a poll that overwhelmingly showed that the ring was unpopular? Please, let's not bring that thing back. 

[TommyShelby]

I absolutely loathed that ring. I can speak for 20 TDA members who all breathed a huge sigh of relief when it was removed. Dazed has brought up some real issues, but please no, not the ring, that's not a solution.

 

Didn't we have a poll that overwhelmingly showed that the ring was unpopular? Please, let's not bring that thing back. 

Very true. And while i'd hate to see the old "combat ring" come back i feel like the solution Dazed is proposing might be the best solution there is.

- Ships that are close enough for you to shoot at shouldn't be able to magically pop out of battle just because noone have shot at them for a while. Therefore combining the current system with a modified "combat ring" seems reasonable to me. At the very least i'd like to test Dazed's proposed system; 

1. your escape timer runs out.

2. you have sailed 1000m away from enemy combatants.

[NorthernWolves]

I am not against a distance requirement for exiting, but that and a ring, a visual ring, even if it can be turned off, are two different things and it is a massive visual and mental immersion killer. The old instances with the islands, where it gave you a feeling of movement and a dynamic OW battle, were the best. Those months with the ring were the worst.

[Young]

Agreed the white combat ring should stay in dry dock but the 1000m range before leaving the battle and not getting hit during the count down seems like a very fair balance. 

[TommyShelby]

I am not against a distance requirement for exiting, but that and a ring, a visual ring, even if it can be turned off, are two different things and it is a massive visual and mental immersion killer.

Very true, you have brought up some stuff that i didn't think off and i'm 100% with you on this one. We don't want the actual ring back. Instead, we want a distance requirement of some kind.  

 

- I'm against the "ring" so to speak. 

- I'm all for a distance requirement of some kind.

[maturin]

Seems that combat ring that was implemented 1 week after Sea trials opened in november to eliminate running was one of the best features and is getting more and more support to return to the OW in some form.

[DazednConfused]

To confirm i don't want a visible 'ring' around an enemy that you must escape.

 

 

The ring in sea trials was a looong distance away and took some time to sail to. If we put 1000m rings around everybody it would look like an abstract art painting in no time.

 

No. All i would like is the 1000m distance from any enemy combatant before being allowed to gap it. You could even have fulfilled the time requirement before you reach that distance and leave immediately.

 

While the distance meter hovering above people is still there you can still know with reasonable accuracy when somebody will leave but hopefully that will be taken out in one of the coming patches.

 

1000m is pretty reasonable too - longs can still reach past that to mabie 1500m but don't do much at that rg.

[ObiQuiet]

Seems that combat ring that was implemented 1 week after Sea trials opened in november to eliminate running was one of the best features and is getting more and more support to return to the OW in some form.

 

No, what was popular was keeping people from running and wasting everyone else's time.   The visible white line was not popular.   

 

Dazed's proposal is a good one to fix a problem with the current logic.

[Chromey]

Im with dazed where having an area limit to where you cannot dissapear into thing smoke during a naval battle should be required.. I dont think ships should have David Copperfield'esk captains who can make ships do that!

[akd]

No, what was popular was keeping people from running and wasting everyone else's time.

And of course that was in the context of an arena where there was no reason to run but to waste time. Otherwise, the ring was horrible.

Reasonable distance from enemy (1000m is probably about right) plus current combat timer when beyond that distance (i.e. 1:30 countdown starts when you cross the range threshold and gets reset if you are hit even if you are out of range; returns to cannot leave if range falls back under threshold) would work very well.

[eken]

One nice thing about battles in sea trials was that, if sunk, you did not lose a durability on your favorite ship. You just lost that match.

One possibility is to have different player options. One could be for single players who only want to fight the AI. Another for something like an improved version of sea trials; another for OW as it is developing now.......etc.

[Jeremiah O'Brien]

Dazed has a very good idea here. The ring is unnecessary, it's simply an eyesore that doesn't need to be there.

[Macjimm]

No circle. Range should not apply to AI.

I appreciate that our hunters may feel a little cheated if players can quickly disappear in the situation described.

But I would hate to be trapped inside a shrinking circle just to satisfy other player's desire to see me fight. It eliminates the option to flee.  The ring could be invisible and it is still gamey.  It imposes an artificial fight pen that completely changes the game.

The range and timer seems like a reasonable compromise against players only. There should be no range imposed from AI. I can imagine it would be frustrating if I was slowly sailing along and a couple of AI pirates come racing up upon me in a few seconds from miles away. Then when I am forced into the instance and if the range limitation is imposed I have to wait even longer to achieve an escape.  This  may have serious implications later.  This is just a little extra time now but if the game progresses so that diminishing food and water will impact crew fatique/morale/health the additional delay could be significant. Especially considering how the OW time progression keep ticking even when waiting for the battle instance to load and unload. I've notice that battles can eat up days of OW time.

[Prater]

Seems that combat ring that was implemented 1 week after Sea trials opened in november to eliminate running was one of the best features and is getting more and more support to return to the OW in some form.

What we need is distance exit "timers" instead of time. Or maybe both. You have to get to 1,000-1,5000 meters from an enemy, and then the timer counts down. As long as you stay that distance away, you can escape after the timer.

[Guthwait]

Not a ring in the literal sense, but needing to be a set distance from the enemy before you can hyper out.

[Flavalicious]

I like the idea of leaving it as is vs AI, for when your traveling and some annoying as hell lynx, lynx,lynx, privateer, cutter, fleet magically has the same BR as your consti and pulls you into a waste of time battle, lol.

 

VS players i like the dual requirement, super goofy when the ship 100m away from you warps out of the battle because no one grazed him with a canon ball in the last 1.5 minutes lol.  Realistically the full solution is a mix of making escaping harder then it is, while offering surrender as a viable option for negating some of the consequences of sinking.  

[Chustler]

Yep timer and distance is a solid idea. The arena ring would be horrible.

[akd]

Thinking about it further, I'm not sure a fixed distance (or fixed distance plus timer after passing threshold) quite works, as you can end up in a situation where two closely matched for speed ships will be in an unending chase because the distance is just under the threshold. Probably there needs to be a system to modify the clock based on distance from enemy, so that your no combat timer is long at short distances and short at very long distances.