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PIerrick de Badas

French Frigate L'Hermione

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In French only:

https://youtu.be/CO1jiW53BZM

Arrived after the return of the transatlantic in 2015:

https://youtu.be/4x0LRztOEwc

At the end of June 2016, anchorage in Royan (France), the day before l'Hermione had breging to on the plateau du Four to greet several guns to the "original" l'Hermione:

https://youtu.be/p7M8Fqth3Sc

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1 hour ago, William the Drake said:

So in-game L'Hermione does not have figurehead or nameplate, any reason for this?

I read somewhere that there are no plans or documentation on the original figurehead. I could be wrong, there are a number of ships in game that don't have figureheads.

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Okay.
Indeed there is no drawing of the figurehead for l'Hermione. But one can reasonably think that it is a lion; because it is the style of the period in France. La Concorde (the first frigate in the series of which l'Hermione is a part) has a lion as a figurehead.

So I think is the same figurehead. But no proof, no certainty.

Edited by Surcouf

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For those interested, how L' Hermione´s figurehead was designed and carved is described en détail in 'Ship Decoration 1630 - 1780' by Andrew Peters. The author of the book got the contract to make the figurehead, if I remember correctly.

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Are you talking about today's Hermione?

Because before the Hermione de Latouche Treville there were two other frigates of the same name.

One of 1748-1757 and another one of 1756-1761. And finally the one that interests us from 1779-1793.

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4 minutes ago, Surcouf said:

Are you talking about today's Hermione?

Because before the Hermione de Latouche Treville there were two other frigates of the same name.

One of 1748-1757 and another one of 1756-1761. And finally the one that interests us from 1779-1793.

Andrew Peters made the figurehead of the replica :

https://www.hermione.com/en/2011/846-the-figure-head.html

https://www.amazon.fr/Ship-Decoration-1630-1780-Andy-Peters/dp/1848321767

Edited by LeBoiteux

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24 minutes ago, Surcouf said:

JC Leumineur chose to treat his monograph with another figurehead. Everything is debatable.I do not have the monograph and I can not say why he chose another figurehead.

https://ancre.fr/en/monographies-en/78-hermione-monographie-9782903179908.html

Hermione is a mythological figure so the choice of a feminine figurehead is understandable.

o5391fU.png?1

Lemineur's choice for L'Hermione

But in 1777, Antoine de Sartine, Secretary of State of the Marine, prohibited (or was it only discourage ?) allegorical figures as figureheads for the French Navy, right ?

However, such naval sculpture were still made by the Arsenal de Toulon in 1779 :

145.jpg

djfP8dc.jpg?1

Antoine Gibert, for the frigate La Naïade (186 x 55 x 68 cm). Paris, musée national de la Marine, Inv. 9 OA 17 [39 OA 16]

Could it be a private order for a privateer ? Or is it for the French navy ? Did the Arsenal work for individuals ? 

I do not have the complete details...

 

Edited by LeBoiteux

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24 minutes ago, Surcouf said:

Tanks!!!!

:)

You, Surcouf, want "Tanks" in NA ? What happened to that Naval expert I've admired so ? :P

Edited by LeBoiteux

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The figureheads is a French bazaar !

It is a costly sculpture, many people find it totally useless on a ship. Others see the greatness of the nation. As always there are pros and detractors.

The mythological theme is privileged, but the lion is cheaper and more generalist. Ships offered to the King usually have a lion.

In 1777 a text imposes the lion as sole figurehead. But this is not followed properly.

In 1786 the figure of prow is replaced by a simple escutcheon with the arms of France. Not always respected either. And the already prominent figureheads on ships are rarely replaced. At the Restoration (1814) the figureheads are abandoned to be replaced by a simple bust.

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38 minutes ago, LeBoiteux said:

You, Surcouf, want "Tanks" in NA ? What happened to that Naval expert I've admired so ? :P

Nothing happened. I do not know everything and I know how to say "thank you" when others know and teach me things. ;)

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On 30/09/2017 at 10:49 AM, Surcouf said:

The figureheads is a French bazaar !

It is a costly sculpture, many people find it totally useless on a ship. Others see the greatness of the nation. As always there are pros and detractors.

The mythological theme is privileged, but the lion is cheaper and more generalist. Ships offered to the King usually have a lion.

In 1777 a text imposes the lion as sole figurehead. But this is not followed properly.

In 1786 the figure of prow is replaced by a simple escutcheon with the arms of France. Not always respected either. And the already prominent figureheads on ships are rarely replaced. At the Restoration (1814) the figureheads are abandoned to be replaced by a simple bust.

I guess that another important year for figureheads is 1789 (till 1804 and the 1st Empire) with the French Revolution and the come-back of allegorical figures embodying the new political ideals that are also visible in the name of the ships (The Revolutionary, The Human Rights, The Tyrannicide, The Unity...). For example :

TDiRCx5.jpg

La Poursuivante, 1796

So the decree in 1777 by de Sartine imposing the lion as the only allowed figurehead had a limited practical effect in the French shipyards and didn't lasted long (12 years till 1789).

51 minutes ago, DeRuyter said:

It should be on the ship in game IMO.

I guess there should be a figurehead on L'Hermione : a lion or an allegorical figure. I'd prefer the latter, for no historical reason, but just because there's already been a lot of lions as figurehead in game and I favor feminine figure. And Hermione is a mythological figure. :)

However, I guess that a 3d figurehead needs a lot of work and is costly. I don't know whether or not copying/rescaling/pasting a preexisting (in-game) lion figurehead on the Hermione is doable/desirable.

Edited by LeBoiteux

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On 10/2/2017 at 8:09 PM, LeBoiteux said:

I guess there should be a figurehead on L'Hermione : a lion or an allegorical figure. I'd prefer the latter, for no historical reason, but just because there's already been a lot of lions as figurehead in game and I favor feminine figure. And Hermione is a mythological figure. :)

However, I guess that a 3d figurehead needs a lot of work and is costly. I don't know whether or not copying/rescaling/pasting a preexisting (in-game) lion figurehead on the Hermione is doable/desirable.

I shall use this opportunity to remind that there should be mods in the steam workshop that allow anyone to do anything, thus you could make a custom figurehead of your choice, or download one made by someone else, although it would only be visible by yourself or other people using the same mod.

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