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maturin

Suspected Glitch: Unsynchronized shots are mast-murderers

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I have anecdotal evidence of a very serious glitch, and I hope that other players will help me in gathering evidence to test this hypothesis.

 

The hypothesis is this:

 

Shots marked 'Unsynchronized' in the L log have an extremely high likelihood of destroying masts.

 

I often attempt to dismast NPCs with roundshot, and very rarely do I destroy a mast in a broadside that doesn't have at least one unsynchronized shot in it.

 

This makes sense on a technical level. Because if the server fails to track a shot, it doesn't know where the shot hit, and assigns the damage through a different means. This would also explain why ships sometimes take 15 broadsides to take down a single mast, while others lose a mast in the very opening shots of the game.

 

 

This may be a shot in the dark, but if I am right, then the glitch would have serious ramification for mast damage resistance (namely, that it is too high, and we can only successfully dismast because of laggy shots).

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Every mast that has fallen for me has had unsynchronized listed.  My testing earlier on the victories when demasting was introduced to sea trials is evidence of this.  It is the same thing in every match.

I think we first need to know what the unsynchronized shots mean in the log.  Perhaps it is working as intended and the damage to masts a long range needs to be reduced or masts strengthened.

  When going for demasts and firing into the enemy rigging, I know I'm probably not going to demast until I start to see several unsynced.   If I get 5+ on a single broadside I know that I am getting really close and it will be within the next broadside or two.  This is how in team speak I can predict to Northern Wolves or others when an enemy mast that I have been shooting at is about to fall.  I've done it several times and can always predict it.  It only works when you are the only one shooting at the masts of the enemy ship because you can't see the unsynchronized hits that your allies do.  I usually know when I am about to lose a mast by watching how much damage I am taking mast wise.  I dont know if I have ever seen an unsynched hit on me.

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My de masting shots have a 5-8 unsync shot designation for first salvo long range shot resulting in instant de mast.

The 1-4 unsync shot took more than one salvo of  shots to de mast and that is if memory serves correct.

Also had impact whether ship was broadside or bow on. Bow on or slight quartering away ( The most likely for me ) I can de mast quite regular.

 

Yea I know but I have a book I keep track of these things. I tend to write things down how it happened and what I did to cause it to happen.

Comes in handy at times when someone sinks me I get in battle with them again I just look them up and see their habits like chaining my masts and things like that.

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Yes, I recommend pressing L every time you see a mast fall.

 

 

My idea is this: Unsynchronized shots have their damage assigned randomly to both sails and mast.

 

It is also possible to destroy masts with shots that only do sail damage in L log. I did this to a Lynx today in Bellona. One big broadside only hits canvas, but the foremast goes down.

 

Thanks for the input, Prater. I hope the devs show up soon and look into this.

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And then again, I could be totally wrong. I just dismasted a Bellona without a single unsynchronized shot (internet must have been fast for a change). And it took about the usual amount of time.

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From what I've read about naval combat in the 18th-19th century we shouldn't have the ability to target masts at all. Any shot fired from a smoothbore cannon using black powder was notoriously inaccurate. Just hitting the hull was an art in itself, a combination of skill, timing and intuition. No sane gunners mate would ever have told his crew to 'aim for the mast ye buggars'.

Not to say dismasting didn't occur, but it was infrequent and random chance. Also, because of the complexity and interaction of the rigging, if dismasting did occur it took most of the stays, shrouds, yards etc. from all the other masts down with it; obviously a disastrous result for HMS Bad Luck. :rolleyes:

I've completely stopped sailing the rates because many players have found this to be very effective at turning anything from a frigate to a Santi into a well-armed barge. Once you've weathercocked and without the ability to drop anchors and use them to turn in place you don't have many options. All they have to do is stay out of the cone of fire from your broadsides and pound you into toothpicks.

This one needs a serious nerf.

 

Rgds:  Jeff 

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You don't aim for a mast though. You aim above the deck and hope with all your might that you hit a mast, and if not, at least the sails.

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Dismasting was in fact done on purpose and was a very popular tactic as it allowed the ship to be captured rather than sunk. However it was done at close range and with bar shot. Which is a type of round we are currently missing in-game.

 

 

126_l.jpg

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Is it possible that real-world dismasting was the result of the supporting rigging being shot away first? Fore and aft stays which counterbalanced sail force, and shrouds for lateral stability... Upper masts, of course. Lower masts could hold themselves up, since they were ultimately fastened to the keel, and probably never broke off at deck level (supposition).

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OK, I'll change that to 'aim above the weather deck ye buggars and pray to God and King'. :)

Like you say SP, we don't have bar shot and it was no great shakes as an armament anyway. It's shape didn't improve accuracy and with the limited elevation and depression available on the the cannon at that time could only be used under certain circumstances. If I remember correctly, it also had an annoying habit of blowing up the gun and killing crew by jamming in the breech. Must have been 'interesting' living in times when your weapons were almost as much danger to you as to the enemy. :wacko:

 

Rgds: Jeff

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...

 

In the real world I see dismasting as a gradual process. The rigging was blown away to bits and you had sails, ropes and the horizontal planks all over the deck weighing it down, or even dragging in the water around. Combine that with some damage from grazing shots to the mast itself and I could see it breaking down due to the weight and pull of the wreckage hanging of it and the force of wind pushing into the still functional sails without the rigging to support. Personally I don't think the masts were often simply shot in half, that would require multiple hits and that would require tremendous luck.

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I dont remember my source but i was under the impression that chain and bar shor first target was the riggins and not the sails or mast per se. Not sure how much difference a 10" hole in a sail would do. On the other hand if some rigging is cut the sail could lose stiffness or operable. A line splice can take quite some time to do. Now once the rigging that hols the mast (sorry forgot the name) is done im pretty sure the forces on the sail alone would be enough to bring the mast down. The key here is equilibrium.

The hole in the sail i think is purely a gaming depiction of the damage to the sails, not sure you would see such damage to canvas in a real fight.

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....

 

Chain shot was indeed for the rigging. Bar shot was for the sturdier parts of it and for the weaker parts of the mast I believe. And I aggree the mass is more likely to go down to the wreckage hanging on it and to loss of support rather than to a direct hit.

 

One 10 inch hole maybe wasn't much, but 90 plus of them... Plus I think the chain shot probably tangled into the sails and tore them, rather than just made holes.

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The hole in the sail i think is purely a gaming depiction of the damage to the sails, not sure you would see such damage to canvas in a real fight.

 

Canvas would be fairly battered at the end of a fight.  HMS Victory's fore topsail from Trafalgar has been preserved; see below...

 

foretopsail.jpg

 

post-3035-0-22811500-1421000287.jpg

 

"Aside from HMS Victory herself, the fore topsail is recognised by experts and historians worldwide as the largest single original artefact from the Battle of Trafalgar.

 

Covering an area of 3,618 ft, it was the second largest sail on board HMS Victory and would have been one of the main targets for French and Spanish guns as HMS Victory approached the enemy line. It is battle-scarred and pock-marked by some 90 shot holes, although a few squares were cut out by 19th century souvenir hunters." (From Portsmouth Historic Dockyard webpage)

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yeah, mast's usually came down as a combination of the standing rigging being severed and ball or bar shot weakening the mast itself. Although I'd like to point out that ships could and did lose masts without suffering any damage from carrying too much sail in the wrong weather conditions. It's also possible to dismast yourself whilst having no sail up nor damage sustained. It was entirely possible for a ship to "roll her mast's out" ;) In battle though, the main reason any ship would have lost any part of any of her masts would be down to damage to the standing rigging rather than damage to the actual mast itself. This is one of the main reasons that ships reduced to fighting sail when practical.

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That is entirely my own assumption, but I would be surprised to hear that I was wrong.

You know, now i had 2nd game in Santisima where i lost my mast 4 times, in 1st game i lost it 5 times. and i noticed 2 or 3 times i lost my mast whit no visible shots being fired at me, and there was no sound of wood cracking and splinters flying all over the place, nothing, just smoke of dust and my mast fell. As i said, i have seen this multiple times! one of those times mast fell good 0.5-1 seconds after the initial cannonballs hit me.

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Well that's probably just a latency issue, as described by the devs on this subforum. If you have tried to fire your guns at that moment, you would have found yourself unable.

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