Jump to content
Game-Labs Forum
admin

Patch 26. Spanish Frigate Diana, BR rebalance - Diana is a timed reward.

Recommended Posts

another thing id like to see for the next patch gameplay wise is that once one side of a ship is down completely (0% HP left), sternraking should deal way more damage to the internal strucutre. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Liq said:

another thing id like to see for the next patch gameplay wise is that once one side of a ship is down completely (0% HP left), sternraking should deal way more damage to the internal strucutre. 

I think in general - as your broadside hps lower you increasingly lose more crew and internal structure with each cannon ball.

It should create an incentive to repair early and discourage those who repair (late) when they lose all their hps to trick the opponent that you have sunk (when in reality repairs essentially bring you back to life). A person throwing a beatdown on someone should still feel like they did significant damage even if they repair those HPs again.

Maybe repairs should only be 50% effective for your internal structure? 

 

Edited by Teutonic

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Teutonic said:

 

Maybe repairs should only be 50% effective for your internal structure? 

 

in general i tend to think that more damage should go to internal structure than now.. to often ships end up with no planking on one side and almost intact structure.

  • Like 12

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, admin said:

in general i tend to think that more damage should go to internal structure than now.. to often ships end up with no planking on one side and almost intact structure.

is there a possibility to let the structure damage start in the center and go outwards? like you have several structure hitboxes, so we can see which part of the ships broadside has a weak spot?

Edited by Wyy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
53 minutes ago, admin said:

in general i tend to think that more damage should go to internal structure than now.. to often ships end up with no planking on one side and almost intact structure.

I agree with this. Protecting your weak side is more important than protecting your ship.

I also feel bow and stern tanking is way too effective against ball as it barely scratches your structure to get raked.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, admin said:

in general i tend to think that more damage should go to internal structure than now.. to often ships end up with no planking on one side and almost intact structure.

To many people give up the stern to protect the side armor because ball raking is marginally effective. There's a happy medium between the initial rake damage changes we had 8-9 months ago and where it is now. Having it do significant structure damage would be a step in right direction

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Le Raf Boom said:

And while we're at it, let's limit the amount of grape a ship carries, kind of like chain. Nobody should be graped for 1hr30mins.

Oh boy... i know this one :D  and I will agree.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Le Raf Boom said:

And while we're at it, let's limit the amount of grape a ship carries, kind of like chain. Nobody should be graped for 1hr30mins.

hmmm

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Naval grape was bigger than what was used to clear infantry, its purpose was to cut up rigging, puncture sails etc by the way. So please portray it correctly not as some sort of projectile that decimates crew. Swivel guns were used for this purpose, and they, you know, swiveled.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, admin said:

in general i tend to think that more damage should go to internal structure than now.. to often ships end up with no planking on one side and almost intact structure.

I agree and would encourage a change. 

I am all for tanking through damage and having fights that last a while. But it is equally frustrating to see hard fought damage amount to very little once someone repairs. I am not against repairing multiple times in battle - i just hate seeing that i spend effort in taking down hps to get into their structure only to have them heal their structure just as effectively as side armor (or all armor in general).

I advocate that structure damage can certainly be healed - but there should be some feeling of 'permanent' damage to structure. Again, we should be encouraged to repair earlier to keep our ship structure safe, instead of using it as the indicator of when to repair.

47 minutes ago, Le Raf Boom said:

And while we're at it, let's limit the amount of grape a ship carries, kind of like chain. Nobody should be graped for 1hr30mins.

 

36 minutes ago, admin said:

hmmm

I am inclined to agree. And rum action has such a long cooldown that it probably wouldn't bother me if grape was limited. 3-4 shots per cannon?

Edited by Teutonic

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The amount of scope creep is astounding.

Let's recap a sec. We have:

- 1 brand-new ship (Diana) that is neither craftable nor purchaseable.
- 1 brand-new ship with an old ship's stats (Connie Classic)  that is neither craftable nor purchaseable, and also (according to admin) is due to have a stat buff to be a proper super frigate.
- Oh and by the way Connie Classic MAY or MAY NOT be a DLC (even though devs know that fools like me will run out and buy it within seconds of release).
- Herc and Requin that may or may not be properly balanced yet (?), and require delicate touch because people paid real $$$ for them.
- Port UI waiting in the wings.
- Economy patch waiting in the wings.

That's a SHEDLOAD of work. Devs, I get you that y'all are supermen, but even Superman has only 24 hours in each day and 7 days in each week. Maybe, sort out the things that are already in the pipeline and people have been waiting for before even more mechanic tweakage (like structure damage, grape, major boarding changes)? Especially since the more visible changes like port UI will have a noticeable impact on how newcomers perceive the game; and the economy patch has a good chance to turn the whole world on its head because that's what economy patches do more often than not.

Just sayin'. Not doubting y'all's abilities to deliver here, just questioning the focus.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Ahoy H.R. Matey said:

-1 brand-new ship (Diana) that is neither craftable nor purchaseable. She will be craftable acording to devs
-Oh and by the way Connie Classic MAY or MAY NOT be a DLC (even though devs know that fools like me will run out and buy it within seconds of release).I would buy her too
-Herc and Requin that may or may not be properly balanced yet (?), and require delicate touch because people paid real $$$ for them. true

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, Le Raf Boom said:

And while we're at it, let's limit the amount of grape a ship carries, kind of like chain. Nobody should be graped for 1hr30mins.

RN loadings per ordnance were typically 60-70 rounds of ball, 7 of Grape (9 shot variety), 7 case (dozens to hundreds of small shot or musket balls) and 7 chain - with the exception of the lower deck of line ships (which tended to not get case or chain). For foreign service an additional 30 rounds of ball would be added. Lagrange was discouraged as it destroyed the milled bore far more rapidly than properly formed shot.

Some variations existed in other nation's policy, but the proportion of specialist ammunition to ball would almost always be a minority. The French trained/influenced crews preferred to fire to the sails and some additional dismantling shot would be carried, but I don't really see a lot of evidence of large proportions of grape/case for guns. (Perhaps for obusiers while they had no provision of 'unsafe' explosive shells, prior to the demonstrations by Paixhains in the mid 1820s).

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
59 minutes ago, admin said:

hmmm

I told you limited chain would be a disaster and it is. Havelock and I can 1v1 for 3 hours with our reps. Same goes for rum. Unlimited vs limited does not work. Common sense....  To this very day I have not heard a solid argument for repairs. You yourself told me it's a goldsink and adds nothing to the game. 

Make NA hardcore again! 

 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, HachiRoku said:

I told you limited chain would be a disaster and it is. Havelock and I can 1v1 for 3 hours with our reps. Same goes for rum. Unlimited vs limited does not work. Common sense....  To this very day I have not heard a solid argument for repairs. You yourself told me it's a goldsink and adds nothing to the game. 

Make NA hardcore again! 

 

Dont be fallacious. You stated chain being limited is a failure and its not, thats a fallacious arguement. Chain is in a great place right now.

However limited grape is a terrible idea because first rates can rum up hundreds of crew and grape damage is very unreliable. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, admin said:

to often ships end up with no planking on one side and almost intact structure.

I've attributed that to carronade usage. But I support this, especially with longs it would be cool to see more internal damage. Maybe it would bring about more even balance between carronade and longs fits?

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, HachiRoku said:

I told you limited chain would be a disaster and it is. Havelock and I can 1v1 for 3 hours with our reps. Same goes for rum. Unlimited vs limited does not work. Common sense....  To this very day I have not heard a solid argument for repairs. You yourself told me it's a goldsink and adds nothing to the game. 

Make NA hardcore again! 

 

I'm in agreement about unlimited ammo, I feel like either it should all be limited, or all be unlimited. It should all be crafted and needed to be purchased, or not at all.  Repairs actually offer up a dynamic gameplay element that makes hunting and raiding interesting... Without them there's nothing to stop you from raiding far away from a place with repairs, it takes away any use for a ship like LGV Refit, etc., it's just a nice trade-off mechanic for weight/speed vs. survivability on long raids, etc. So I'd argue for repairs to stay.

What I would argue for is scrapping the stupidity of repair mod stacking and make their use far less effective, perhaps by implementing one of the suggestions above of reducing any effectiveness of repairs on internal structure, etc.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Wraith said:

I'm in agreement about unlimited ammo, I feel like either it should all be limited, or all be unlimited. It should all be crafted and needed to be purchased, or not at all.  Repairs actually offer up a dynamic gameplay element that makes hunting and raiding interesting... Without them there's nothing to stop you from raiding far away from a place with repairs, it takes away any use for a ship like LGV Refit, etc., it's just a nice trade-off mechanic for weight/speed vs. survivability on long raids, etc. So I'd argue for repairs to stay.

What I would argue for is scrapping the stupidity of repair mod stacking and make their use far less effective, perhaps by implementing one of the suggestions above of reducing any effectiveness of repairs on internal structure, etc.

Upgrade stacking is going to get a nerf soon.

Buying ammo is a very interesting concept. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Flinch said:

Dont be fallacious

It's one thing to be wrong, it's another matter that you happen to believe in different things than him.

I believe hachi is right. I fought Ram recently, there is a definitive potential for everlasting fights given skill, books and mods. I don't know how that is a good thing ..

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Flinch said:

Upgrade stacking is going to get a nerf soon.

Buying ammo is a very interesting concept. 

I honestly....fear limited ammo. Please, if we get on that dicussion we should be extremely caustious about how we approach it.

My initial reaction is to ask we don't create ammo. I'd only be willing to agree to ammo if certain measures were taken.

If 60 ball per cannon, 7 chain, 7 grape, and we use the current 2 charge and double.

A 40 gun frigate would have 3,120 rounds of various shots. 

A 12 gun privateer/pickle would have 936 rounds of various shots.

My biggest concen would be that we'd have to go back to port after every battle. Or rather - a lot of players would do that regardless of whether they need to or not and it would create more irritation towards sailing.

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, jodgi said:

It's one thing to be wrong, it's another matter that you happen to believe in different things than him.

I believe hachi is right. I fought Ram recently, there is a definitive potential for everlasting fights given skill, books and mods. I don't know how that is a good thing ..

Begging the question is a fallacy. He stated that limited chain is a failure therefore limited grape would be a failure.

 

The fallacy is that limited chain HAS NOT been able proven a failure and therefore we cant infer that limited grape would be bad.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Flinch said:

Begging the question is a fallacy. He stated that limited chain is a failure therefore limited grape would be a failure.

 

The fallacy is that limited chain HAS NOT been able proven a failure and therefore we cant infer that limited grape would be bad.

Fine!

Limited chain is by some viewed as sub-optimal, limited grape would work out similarly.

Notice how his focus isn't chain/grape but rather the primary and side-effects to (relatively speaking) unlimited repairs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 hours ago, Intrepido said:

What we need is musket fire from decks so a small ship cant do so much damage to line ships from stern rakes or sailing in close paralel, in front or behind. 

Many captains dont want to engage in a boarding because other ships will come closer and sink him.

alternatively fitting ALL ships with swivels would be a more active solution that you can aim and fire, something we're all use to.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×