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Patch 26. Spanish Frigate Diana, BR rebalance - Diana is a timed reward.

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2 hours ago, admin said:

Hello Captains
Patch will be deployed in the next day or two to live servers.

  • Diana wil be given out for testing to all captains in the Caribbean. 
    • It will be a timed reward - you will have to login and claim it within 15 days.
    • Spanish frigate Diana 
      • Spanish heavy frigate filling the gap between heavy and medium frigates
      • Gundeck - 24lb guns 42lb carronades
      • Upper deck - 9lb guns 32 lb carronades.
  • Major BR rebalance
    • We are gradually moving away from the static BR based on HP and DPS characteristics and will also consider several other factors including battle performance data. 
    • How it will work
      • Ships with much lower performance statistics will have lower BR even if they are a higher class vessel. For example 2nd rate pavel having a much worse battle performance than 3rd rate Bellona will have a lower BR than Bellona. 
    • The changes will be applied gradually as full performance based BR is currently impossible as it will break old mission system. Once new mission system is added in September we will let battle performance influence the ship BR slightly more.
    • This will mostly affect the port battles and will require captains to recalculate their battle plans for future conquests.
  • Speed changes
    • Wind curves slightly tweaked for
      • Hercules
      • Privateer
    • Speeds slightly increased for
      • Mercury
      • Niagara
      • Lynx
      • Privateer
      • Prince
    • Keep in mind that this speed change is a temporary fix to provide more options in the 6th rate category - all ships speeds, turning, and heel performance will be updated after port ui patch based on battle performance with the goal to increase gameplay depth. Current historical wind curves (fully based on sail plans) have been found to reduce gameplay depth instead of improving it, and will be adapted this autumn. 

 

Diana Screenshot

Q3dRLoW.jpg

Admin great changes this new system of BR based on ship performance is great idea. 

As for Diana can you tell us after this 15 days will she become craftabe or imported ship?

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11 minutes ago, Lovec1990 said:

Admin great changes this new system of BR based on ship performance is great idea. 

 

Remember that this first change is gradual and is not final - importance of performance and other data will increase over time. Initial tunes will be slight to not break mission balance. Once old mission system is removed we can expand the influence. 

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2 hours ago, admin said:
  • Speed changes
    • Wind curves slightly tweaked for
      • Hercules
      • Privateer
    • Speeds slightly increased for
      • Mercury
      • Niagara
      • Lynx
      • Privateer
      • Prince
    • Keep in mind that this speed change is a temporary fix to provide more options in the 6th rate category - all ships speeds, turning, and heel performance will be updated after port ui patch based on battle performance with the goal to increase gameplay depth. Current historical wind curves (fully based on sail plans) have been found to reduce gameplay depth instead of improving it, and will be adapted this autumn. 

 

 

I love the patch notes so far, BUT! :P The requin will still not have a 6th rate counter if you want to generate pvp action unless you open up the possibility for more vulnerable crew health at the weatherdeck. My live oak/white oak requin goes 15.5 with elite pirate and with the speed cap it wont help much to boost the other ships speed other than you can build it with heavier wood and maintain the same speed. Yes i remember the days when grape brawl was the thing in shallow water, but it only makes sense to blast an open deck ship with grape broadside to prevent boarding

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56 minutes ago, Christendom said:

Whatever happened to the port UI and ship flags patches?  

This will be in big patch mate. (at least port UI)

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2 hours ago, admin said:

Diana wil be given out for testing to all captains in the Caribbean. 

  • It will be a timed reward - you will have to login and claim it within 15 days.
  • Spanish frigate Diana 
    • Spanish heavy frigate filling the gap between heavy and medium frigates
    • Gundeck - 24lb guns 42lb carronades
    • Upper deck - 9lb guns 32 lb carronades.

 

So will this be just a one time redeem during the testing period like it was for the Le Requin and Hercules? If so you are making a mistake as limited supply does not allow for proper testing. Like with the Le Requin and Hercules a lot of things were not noticed or reported till the ships had been released as DLC and people were able to try out different variations and loadouts. With a single try redeem many people will be too cautious and it will not get tested properly and if this ship becomes a DLC then you will face the same complaints as you did for the Le Requin and Hercules after full release.

To properly test you should allow unlimited redeems during the test period, but only allow one per character at a time and at the end of the test period all are deleted so people do not just save them up. It may cause some disruption with people just using them as throwaway ships, but at least they will get used and we are here to test things out anyway.

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Just now, Archaos said:

So will this be just a one time redeem during the testing period like it was for the Le Requin and Hercules? If so you are making a mistake as limited supply does not allow for proper testing. Like with the Le Requin and Hercules a lot of things were not noticed or reported till the ships had been released as DLC and people were able to try out different variations and loadouts. With a single try redeem many people will be too cautious and it will not get tested properly and if this ship becomes a DLC then you will face the same complaints as you did for the Le Requin and Hercules after full release.

To properly test you should allow unlimited redeems during the test period, but only allow one per character at a time and at the end of the test period all are deleted so people do not just save them up. It may cause some disruption with people just using them as throwaway ships, but at least they will get used and we are here to test things out anyway.

i agree, but first im not sure Diana will be DLC ship

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the br change is intresting and i'd have to see how it will work since raising the br of certain ships wil simply degrade their overall performance just so they get lowered back down in the future? i guess i'll have to see what kind off effect it has i'm still hoping they'll just limit the types of ships you can take and thus making frigates matter again

Edited by Lord Amplify of Key West

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Will mods/knowledge influence BR as well?

In my opinion an elite modded ship shouldn't have the same BR as a basic modded ship.

Edited by z4ys
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1 minute ago, z4ys said:

Will mods/knowledge influence BR as well?

interesting thought 15br for northern master carps etc people would be forced not to stack all the rarest mods to be able to use the ship for a pb

Edited by Wyy
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6 minutes ago, Lovec1990 said:

i agree, but first im not sure Diana will be DLC ship

Even if its not a DLC ship it should still be properly tested. If the Le Requin and Hercules had to be crafted you would still see just as many of them as you do now, probably more even as people would craft them and sell the basic ones off cheap.

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So am I crazy, or are the other API data users out there not actually seeing any changes in the ship data for this patch?  Nothing has been updated as far as I can see in the ship information with regards to speeds, BR, etc.?  Has the API data just not been updated since yesterday?

(DERP, saw patch notes, read it as already applied. Nevermind, nothing to see here.)

Edited by Wraith
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1 minute ago, Wraith said:

So am I crazy, or are the other API data users out there not actually seeing any changes in the ship data for this patch?  Nothing has been updated as far as I can see in the ship information with regards to speeds, BR, etc.?  Has the API data just not been updated since yesterday?

we know you're crazy... 😜

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9 minutes ago, z4ys said:

Will mods/knowledge influence BR as well?

In my opinion an elite modded ship shouldn't have the same BR as a basic modded ship.

I agree to the extent that a well modded ship has better combat capabilities... but how can you plan a PB if every ship has different BR based on their mods?

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1 minute ago, Havelock said:

I agree to the extent that a well modded ship has better combat capabilities... but how can you plan a PB if every ship has different BR based on their mods?

All go out at once and click at the same time to join and who gets in gets in.

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44 minutes ago, Hethwill the Harmless said:

Why is the Diana so nicely low in the water but the Trincomalee and L'Hermione and Le Gros Ventre stand so high ?

To be fair if the game modeled heavier seas and thus more water intake via gunports, sitting low would not quite be so nice^^ One of the greatest advantages of frigates constructed in the second half of the 1700s was the higher distance between waterline and main gundeck.
But yeah there are some ship who sit a bit excessively high *coughVictorycough*
Overall I very much like the Patch notes, we shall see how the BR adptations will play out.

Edited by Tom Farseer
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7 minutes ago, Havelock said:

I agree to the extent that a well modded ship has better combat capabilities... but how can you plan a PB if every ship has different BR based on their mods?

If BR is affected by performance (and adjusted monthly until it stabilizes) - then mods indirectly affect the BR: better mods influence - better performance
upgrades are already rebalanced in internal builds - 23 unique groups for upgrades, some books changed or removed based on logic (hand combat book is knowledge, boarding ax is not knowledge but an item(upgrade))

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6 minutes ago, Havelock said:

I agree to the extent that a well modded ship has better combat capabilities... but how can you plan a PB if every ship has different BR based on their mods?

set the amount of BR you want each ship to have and go from there.

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18 minutes ago, Archaos said:

If the Le Requin and Hercules had to be crafted you would still see just as many of them as you do now, probably more even as people would craft them and sell the basic ones off cheap.

I really hope you're right as that would kill off the "DLC ships ruined the game" argument.

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Just now, admin said:

If BR is affected by performance (and adjusted monthly until it stabilizes) - then mods are indirectly affect the BR: better mods influence - better performance
upgrades are already rebalanced in internal builds - 23 unique groups for upgrades, some books changed or removed based on logic (hand combat book is knowledge, boarding ax is not knowledge but an item(upgrade))

Yeah sure but i think what z4ys meant was that for every mod you install/select the BR goes up by x amount. That would make it way to hard to set up a team composition.

Offtopic: Some upgrades dont really make sense though; why is Extra Planking a knowledge? Do they add planking from the inside temporarily or what? Im not asking to have it changed, i think its good to have HP upgrades for both knowledge and permanent slots. Other example is Nassau Borders/Fencing Masters. I mean, these are actual humans with special professions, right? Why are they permanent?

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8 minutes ago, admin said:

If BR is affected by performance (and adjusted monthly until it stabilizes) - then mods indirectly affect the BR: better mods influence - better performance
upgrades are already rebalanced in internal builds - 23 unique groups for upgrades, some books changed or removed based on logic (hand combat book is knowledge, boarding ax is not knowledge but an item(upgrade))

Isn't that system only fair to the player who has all the fancy stuff that was used to create that br?

For example let's look a prince that was a highly specialized ship used by minority of players that knew what they were doing. 

Regarding to data it's need an updated br. Now place an average player in that ship. It will underperform.

Edited by z4ys
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3 hours ago, admin said:
  • Major BR rebalance
    • We are gradually moving away from the static BR based on HP and DPS characteristics and will also consider several other factors including battle performance data. 
    • How it will work
      • Ships with much lower performance statistics will have lower BR even if they are a higher class vessel. For example 2nd rate pavel having a much worse battle performance than 3rd rate Bellona will have a lower BR than Bellona. 
    • The changes will be applied gradually as full performance based BR is currently impossible as it will break old mission system. Once new mission system is added in September we will let battle performance influence the ship BR slightly more.
    • This will mostly affect the port battles and will require captains to recalculate their battle plans for future conquests.

 

please, explain more.

you talk about ''performance statistics'' so i can understand they are speed,thickness,turn rate ecc ecc? for example, does a basic bellona have a lower BR than a basic Pavel but puttin some mods on bellona, her performance get better and her BR raise up? so will be the BR based on ''mods''?

or the ''other data'' are intended as how many times you used that specific ships in battle, how many pvp you earned in that ship (that ship intended as class of the ship or that specific ship named Mary that is better than the same class ship Berta but never used in battle?)?

 

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8 minutes ago, Havelock said:

Offtopic: Some upgrades dont really make sense though; why is Extra Planking a knowledge? Do they add planking from the inside temporarily or what? Im not asking to have it changed, i think its good to have HP upgrades for both knowledge and permanent slots. Other example is Nassau Borders/Fencing Masters. I mean, these are actual humans with special professions, right? Why are they permanent?

officers and specialists will come back after release - and will fix most of the problems with strange books, strange perks, etc.

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