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Hi,

I like many of the updates coming in the new patch and I think the ROE changes are good.

I am still concerned though that the safe/patrol zone isn't actually as safe as it needs to be to help support new players.

A couple of issues spring to mind. I am in the NZ/Aus time zone so am generally sailing outside the main primetime. Over the past few months I have noticed a rapid decline in newbies in and around the KPR area. Its very rare to see anyone at Commodore level or below - so rare in fact that its noticeable when you do finally see one. I think one of the reasons for this is that in many ways, the game is very hardcore and merciless on newbies.

I'd really like to see a further update to the patch to support newbies in and around the nation's safe zones.

Example, last night I was carelessly sailing an LGV and got attacked off Morant. That is fair enough, I wasn't paying attention and was attacked by an enemy player doing his job. I called for AI reinforcements and one ship popped in miles away from the action. It proceeded to do essentially stuff all and was completely ineffective.  Now, for me it is only a mild annoyance to lose an LGV and cargo. I lost a ship I can easily craft and replace as well as some hemp - no big deal. What worries me is that a newbie if attacked isn't getting sufficient protection from the AI. I'd like to see additional protection bought in for new players so they get immediate & effective support as they are starting out. I'm talking a couple of hyper aggressive 1st or 2nd rates spawning right on top of the enemy attacker in active support with additional spawning in if more enemies enter the battle as well.

This is so the new player can safely "find their sea legs" in their nation's support zones and therefore support their introductory experience.

I have spoken on a number of occasions to ex players I come across in other games and the constant loss/grind to replace was a major turn off to them. Once players get to a certain level, the loss of a ship or a cargo isn't terminal - I fear for newer players it is. This isn't to smear the enemy players, they are doing their job i.e looking for combat and content. I think the game needs to alter  the balance to support our fledgling captains.

I'd be Ok if the protection level was on a sliding scale so at RA level for example you got a cutter and a "good luck mate" as support. I recall in an earlier post on this issue that someone mentioned High Sec space in (I think) Eve - if you attacked a player you got slammed by effective AI support. I haven't seen that in action but it seems like a good idea.

TLDR: new players need more effective support in safe zones to help grow the community.

Sail safe all.

 

 

 

Edited by Zorg the Merciless
syntax needed to be updated.
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Blame boredom. There's only 1 thing to fight for and that's PBs which isn't a regular event that everyone can participate in. You want to cause havok on the OW? Camp a nations capital. It's PVP mission #1 and has a real world effect on a nations ability to produce and travel, unlike freeport pvp which has no effect outside the battle.

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It's an ridiculous gank game now

NA needs more players?

@Devs 

Make game casual friendly then!

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One way to slow down ganking and attacking players in safe zones is for the attacker(s) to receive no marks of any kind. In addition, if you escape an attack in a safe zone you should receive an appropriate reward of marks.

Edited by Jack Spencer
misspelling

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Actually the easiest way for a player to feel safe is to play on the dedicated PvE server... Game is dying because of the safezones, not despite of them.. Along ofc with the multitude of roadblocks that has been introduced on the gameplay in general.

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Game is dying because there is nothing to do but gank newer and pve oriented players.  Not because of the safe zones.  If anything I’d say that until the safe zone nerf they were the only thing keeping players around.  Now we’re barely cracking 400 players during prime time.

The game is boring.  People stick around a bit, hit max rank, try some PVP and RVR and then totally get smashed due to the skill gap in players and then piss off back to warships or warthunder.  There simply is not enough diverse content to keep them interested and what content we do have is beyond basic and mundane. 

To put it simply, MMO players need goals to achieve. Quest lines, skill trees to master, elusive loot to find or cosmetic achievements or skins.  This game has none of these features and it suffers because of it.  Sinking players all day is fun, but not everyones bag.  Nor is RVR and taking ports you get penalized to own.  

Edited by Christendom
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4 hours ago, Lars Kjaer said:

Actually the easiest way for a player to feel safe is to play on the dedicated PvE server... Game is dying because of the safezones, not despite of them.. Along ofc with the multitude of roadblocks that has been introduced on the gameplay in general.

Basicly you are saying,we should reduce our Carrebean peak 350 players to 150 and remove the safezone, so game will not die? Did I understand you correctly ? 

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There is no 'the population is dropping because'. There are many reasons, different for different people. One thing for certain is the game is not good at retaining fresh blood, everyone will eventually reach the burnout point, the magic to keeping the population high is to replace the losses with new people. Keeping the safe zones safer would probably help up to a point but I think organized events that will gently introduce new players to PvP might or RvR might work way better. The safe zones don't offer much, grinding out missions over and over is not going to keep people in the game.

The game needs to guide new players better, the tutorial is a step in the right direction but I don't think that's just good enough. When I first started playing the game I had no idea what to do but grind over and over, it was the gankers coming into the safe waters that provided me with stuff to do. Not the ability to repeat the same task over and over without any danger.

Camping/defending capitals is the only thing that provides something that resembles instant action, the alternative is long sails, huge time investment for dubious rewards. Why do you think battle-royale kinds of games are so popular? Instant/guranteed action is important.

Edited by Le Raf Boom
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6 hours ago, Lars Kjaer said:

Actually the easiest way for a player to feel safe is to play on the dedicated PvE server... Game is dying because of the safezones, not despite of them.. Along ofc with the multitude of roadblocks that has been introduced on the gameplay in general.

Uhm ... let's see.

You first suggest to a casual player that is being concerned about not being protected enough in safe zones to just leave caribbean server ... and then - in the same sentence - you say that game population in caribbean server is dying because of the safe zones being "too safe".

Image result for spock meme

 

Edited by victor

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9 hours ago, Lars Kjaer said:

Actually the easiest way for a player to feel safe is to play on the dedicated PvE server... Game is dying because of the safezones, not despite of them.. Along ofc with the multitude of roadblocks that has been introduced on the gameplay in general.

 Nope, totally wrong the game is dying because of lack of content and new players getting ganked all of the time. New players lose everything with one gank, that is off-putting and they leave. I was lucky enough to have the shallow zone around West End as my starting point, it allowed me to get established and sucked me into the game. Make the safe zones safe and you will encourage the new chaps to stay. 

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15 minutes ago, seanjo said:

 Nope, totally wrong the game is dying because of lack of content and new players getting ganked all of the time. New players lose everything with one gank, that is off-putting and they leave. I was lucky enough to have the shallow zone around West End as my starting point, it allowed me to get established and sucked me into the game. Make the safe zones safe and you will encourage the new chaps to stay. 

 

Not that I disagree with your statement, but new players IMO should establish themselves AWAY FROM the capital, not at it.  They can go to any of several quiet places on the map and do their missions and trading and also do the tutorials.  Establish themselves, gain experience and gold, and then start expanding to new outposts or back to the capital and join a clan.  New players don't have to be established within 1 week to play this game.  No need to hurry.  If they do it this way then safe zones are irrelevant to them.

Edited by Jean Ribault

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5 hours ago, Jean Ribault said:

 

Not that I disagree with your statement, but new players IMO should establish themselves AWAY FROM the capital, not at it.  They can go to any of several quiet places on the map and do their missions and trading and also do the tutorials.  Establish themselves, gain experience and gold, and then start expanding to new outposts or back to the capital and join a clan.  New players don't have to be established within 1 week to play this game.  No need to hurry.  If they do it this way then safe zones are irrelevant to them.

You have to have the funds to pay for a base in the first place, not a lot, but more than a new chap has, they have to trade or PvE to raise the money first. Plus new folk won't know that unless someone tells them.

Edited by seanjo

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A new chap has 0, no need to state the obvious.  But it's like 10,000 gold for your first outpost, this is peanuts to every player.  You get more than that in a single cutter mission or a single trade run of worthless goods in the safe zone.  I can't remember but I think the first outpost permit is only like 5K gold.  So for 15K you can easily do what I suggested.  This is not a problem for anyone, not even a person who just learned how to WASD.  No need to argue about a suggestion for arguments sake, it's thrown out there as a quite viable option.

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@Hethwill

 

Nice try, but I prefer my idea...

Longer lead in time, PvE ladder that then allows PvP entry and AGONY tours with the exams.

 

This is an MMO and newbies should be encouraged to get in a group (not necessarily a clan). Sailing Solo tis a no no for the newbie and legend alike...

 

Norfolk.

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1 hour ago, Hethwill said:

A new chap doesn't have 0, a new chap has this:

image.png.123232b9f5881bdd285e4105073d0e4b.png

and this...

image.png.c3b30b30f71cf4c94b06f69cbc771083.png

 

Great, you just made my point for me!  Thanks.  So quite easy to take this and move to a quiet location to learn.

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safe zones have killed this game. period. no reason to hunt due to safe zones. no reason for coast guards due to safe zones. no reason to leave safe zones due to 98% of crafting mats available in safe zone ports. I dont feel like trying to fish out a fight  in front of a capital that can easily turn into a 20 vs 5. and may take 3 hours to never happen.  nowadays I just log on and sit infront of navase afk while playing another game just to do part part to keep the game alive by keeping that player count +1.= current state of naval action. 

Edited by King of Crowns

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30 minutes ago, King of Crowns said:

safe zones have killed this game. period. no reason to hunt due to safe zones. no reason for coast guards due to safe zones. no reason to leave safe zones due to 98% of crafting mats available in safe zone ports. I dont feel like trying to fish out a fight  in front of a capital that can easily turn into a 20 vs 5. and may take 3 hours to never happen.  nowadays I just log on and sit infront of navase afk while playing another game just to do part part to keep the game alive by keeping that player count +1.= current state of naval action. 

I've been missing you babe

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43 minutes ago, King of Crowns said:

safe zones have killed this game. period. no reason to hunt due to safe zones. no reason for coast guards due to safe zones. no reason to leave safe zones due to 98% of crafting mats available in safe zone ports. I dont feel like trying to fish out a fight  in front of a capital that can easily turn into a 20 vs 5. and may take 3 hours to never happen.  nowadays I just log on and sit infront of navase afk while playing another game just to do part part to keep the game alive by keeping that player count +1.= current state of naval action. 

The issue is not the safe zones. The game simply does not have content outside capital waters. If we had you would not be even thinking PvP in safe zones.

The game is not as good as it was. Have to wait that they fix it if they ever will. Then if starts are aligned perfectly, maybe we are lucky and get the rest.

 

edit.

Also, it would be more interesting to see devs actually implementing something outside safe zones instead of spending 100000000 days trying to tune perfect safe zone ROE.

Edited by Cmdr RideZ

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2 hours ago, King of Crowns said:

safe zones have killed this game. period. no reason to hunt due to safe zones. no reason for coast guards due to safe zones. no reason to leave safe zones due to 98% of crafting mats available in safe zone ports. I dont feel like trying to fish out a fight  in front of a capital that can easily turn into a 20 vs 5. and may take 3 hours to never happen.  nowadays I just log on and sit infront of navase afk while playing another game just to do part part to keep the game alive by keeping that player count +1.= current state of naval action. 

That's b.s. and you know it. Lack of content has killed this game, not lack of opportunities to kill players in non-consensual PvP. Perhaps you've played a part as one of the worst examples of poor losers and poor winners by creating toxic interactions that don't encourage those long time players and new players alike to stick around?  Win-at-all-costs attitudes causes attrition; concentrating a large  number of active players into one faction causes attrition; being a general hypocritical bastard to your fellow players causes attrition; etc.

With all of that attrition keeping an active player base can only be done by continually and actively recruiting new players. Some of those players will be PvP'ers, some of them won't but could still play a role in the overall game world. Safe zones create an opportunity for those players who don't want to PvP to still play, and provide areas for new players to get good enough they don't get their teeth kicked in by bored vets.

What you should be complaining about as @Cmdr RideZ points out is the lack of content outside safe zones, and the lack of content that encourages those new players to dip their toes outside the safe zones. But for a niche game you need to encourage all play styles not exclude them, and gently encourage players to feed the ecosystem instead of tossing them out there as chum all the time and then telling them to, "Git Gud."

Edited by Wraith
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23 minutes ago, Wraith said:

That's b.s. and you know it. Lack of content has killed this game, not lack of opportunities to kill players in non-consensual PvP. Perhaps you've played a part as one of the worst examples of poor losers and poor winners by creating toxic interactions that don't encourage those long time players and new players alike to stick around?  Win-at-all-costs attitudes causes attrition; concentrating a large  number of active players into one faction causes attrition; being a general hypocritical bastard to your fellow players causes attrition; etc.

With all of that attrition keeping an active player base can only be done by continually and actively recruiting new players. Some of those players will be PvP'ers, some of them won't but could still play a role in the overall game world. Safe zones create an opportunity for those players who don't want to PvP to still play, and provide areas for new players to get good enough they don't get their teeth kicked in by bored vets.

What you should be complaining about as @Cmdr RideZ points out is the lack of content outside safe zones, and the lack of content that encourages those new players to dip their toes outside the safe zones. But for a niche game you need to encourage all play styles not exclude them, and gently encourage players to feed the ecosystem instead of tossing them out their as chum all the time and then telling them to, "Git Gud."

salt...………………………………………. its not my job to keep players in this game. that's the devs job. good to know that you think we should only take "consensual" pvp. why even have the open world if that's the case? I defer back to my statement. safezones have killed the game. and I do believe you have misquoted me. my line is for them to "stop sucking". 

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I always love the folks that bitch and say RvR is dead....NEVER them attacking Little Habrour, Cart, Nassou, Estro's, Santo Domingo......the list can go on of ports that make over 1M or very importatn goods.  You want RvR/PvP I bet if you attack one of these ports you will get all the PvP/RvR you can dream of....oh way it's not easy farming to actually fight folks.  Instead they prefer to camp Capitals and kill casual/newbs all the while half the time sitting in the same battle with each other.   If they wanted PvP/RvR so much they would be attacking these key major ports weekly.   SOme of these ports have not had a PB in months since they where last taken.   

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12 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

I always love the folks that bitch and say RvR is dead....NEVER them attacking Little Habrour, Cart, Nassou, Estro's, Santo Domingo......the list can go on of ports that make over 1M or very importatn goods.  You want RvR/PvP I bet if you attack one of these ports you will get all the PvP/RvR you can dream of....oh way it's not easy farming to actually fight folks.  Instead they prefer to camp Capitals and kill casual/newbs all the while half the time sitting in the same battle with each other.   If they wanted PvP/RvR so much they would be attacking these key major ports weekly.   SOme of these ports have not had a PB in months since they where last taken.   

They’re all allied up is why.  Then they piss off because the game is “dead”

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14 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

I always love the folks that bitch and say RvR is dead....NEVER them attacking Little Habrour, Cart, Nassou, Estro's, Santo Domingo......the list can go on of ports that make over 1M or very importatn goods.  You want RvR/PvP I bet if you attack one of these ports you will get all the PvP/RvR you can dream of....oh way it's not easy farming to actually fight folks.  Instead they prefer to camp Capitals and kill casual/newbs all the while half the time sitting in the same battle with each other.   If they wanted PvP/RvR so much they would be attacking these key major ports weekly.   SOme of these ports have not had a PB in months since they where last taken.   

any port worth taking has a timer outside of our timezone.

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