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1 hour ago, Percival Merewether said:

While the idea is pretty good on paper, I think it’s likely to completely ruin OW solo hunting. This will greatly benefit the gankers.

Just to point out that everything - really! everything ! - favours squadrons more.

While the immediate perception is that it lays an additional burden it can also be discussed that it creates a useful way of guaranteeing a balance of power, through logistics, to the ships we put at sea.

A frigate, with enough minor upgrades, mainly basic ones, will require just normal logistics. A truthfully major Grand Fleet, fully arrayed for war and invasion, requires immense logistics.

Funny thing is that this is simply put - repairs. There's no need to sail more, just to load more in the hold.

As a secondary effect that I notice, any stacking to achieve major results that might overpower any opponent in 80% of cases, and even ensure avoidance of combat in 99% of them, will be balanced by player own choice of sacrificing long cruise for performance - what you point out as returning to port all the time - or to setup for longer cruises with unknown encounters, in which you will sacrifice meta performance for the ability to survive longer at sea.

 

3 minutes ago, Percival Merewether said:

So no extra repairs if you're running, say: Caulking, Copper, Elite british rig?

That's non basic modules - 2 hull modules plus 1 rig, if I understood what Z explained above.

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10 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

That's non basic modules - 2 hull modules plus 1 rig, if I understood what Z explained above.

So running those mods on an Agamemnon with a basic repair consumption of 15:

  • Hull repair = 15 * 3 = 45 hull
  • Rig repair = 15 * 2 = 30 rig

That means in one battle you're likely going to consume around 150-200 repairs. With my current setup I usually carry 100 / 100 / 500 - this is to make sure I can fight 3 full battles (assuming I loot as well) when going out... With this change, I now have to carry 300 / 200 / 500

I will have repairs with me worth roughly 500k then... And imagine the effect on speed - From my point of view hunters like myself will have to use basic upgrades instead in order to stay at sea for prolonged periods of time. When hunting in french waters you usually get  a very big response when you try to kill them there - They can bring 5 x Copper plating, navy hull, bovenwinds Endymions with poods + 30 rig repairs and take turns in going broadside to broadside with me and I'll be unable to do anything about it with my low speed.

Like I said; the idea is good on paper - I just don't think it will have the desired effect in-game.

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If your values are correct it looks okay for such a heavily equipped ship designed for purpose. Just a matter of putting more repairs on hold ? While I suggested a counter to be 50% increase of cycle, by reading the examples being put out I say I start to understand the why of the 100%. 

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36 minutes ago, Percival Merewether said:

So no extra repairs if you're running, say: Caulking, Copper, Elite british rig?

Lets say:

base hull repair = 12 per cycle

base Sail repair = 12 per cycle

 

Result:

Caulking + copper + elite british rig are non basic mods

therefore:

Hull = 12 base + 12 Caulking  (100% of base) + 12 copper (100% of base) + 12 for two of the same kind (2 hull refits) = 48 hull repairs per cycle

Sail = 12 base + 12 elite british rig (100% of base) = 24 rig per cycle

Edited by z4ys

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7 minutes ago, Percival Merewether said:

I will have repairs with me worth roughly 500k then... And imagine the effect on speed -

 

Easy fix = use less high maintenance mods

And dont forget other will have to do the same.

Edited by z4ys

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4 minutes ago, z4ys said:

And dont forget other will have to do the same.

That exactly what I said they don’t need to... let’s say I’m hunting at Bridgetown/Kingstown - the french won’t need any repairs at all because they bring high numbers - I’m there alone.. that’s a death sentence

Edited by Percival Merewether

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French captains did plan for a short cruise in that case. And being close to home waters it is normal that they can field more ships with less strain on repair/provisions.

Let us focus on the suggestion not a particular playstyle. The mechanic affects solo and groups equally.

Edited by z4ys

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1 minute ago, z4ys said:

French captains did plan for a short cruise in that case. And being close to home waters it is normal that they can field more ships with less strain on repair/provisions.

Exactly.. good idea, but detrimental to gameplay... The only way that I'd see any of this work is to completely eliminate all communications with your nation when at sea.

I throughly believe this will lead to less OW hunting and limit PvP to the patrol zones + large gank-squads at capitals.

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36 minutes ago, z4ys said:

Easy fix = use less high maintenance mods

And dont forget other will have to do the same.

So you end up in a situation where everyone runs mods to where no one runs mods... So what have you changed? Faster ships are still faster, slower ships slower, tanky ships are still tanky. BUT now you just get less say in the diversification of your ship. Boring.

Basic carpentry tools then become the most OP mod in the game. Yay, basic mods for the win.

Then you also force the price of books up as people will look to planking/repair mods over perms. Then people complain when you pay 15 mill + for those. Wasn't that what the devs tried to avoid by making open world drops more lucrative so everyone could have access to them?

 

Edited by Liam790
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Right now "everyone" does not run mods.  Only the few.  What you would gain by taking away elite mods is a more level playing field where skill, not gear wins the day

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6 minutes ago, Oberon74 said:

Right now "everyone" does not run mods.  Only the few.  What you would gain by taking away elite mods is a more level playing field where skill, not gear wins the day

I don't think anything is being taken away, just requiring more stuff in the hold. At least that's what I start to understand from the suggestion.

The ship designs remain and can be fine tuned at will.

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I wish we could see what required hull and rig repair of our ships while in port. I know this is not exactly the original suggestion but not knowing how much your repair action takes until you're in a battle is really irritating.

As for the suggestion, I see the purpose of doing this to make players pay more for their actions/decisions but i don't know if i like the numbers.

Speaking when you get to heavy lineships, this could easily make a repair action use 60-100 repairs at a time. Maybe that's a good thing.....but the amount of money some people would need... it would certainly make people think first of what ships to sail or what mods to place.

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2 minutes ago, Teutonic said:

...it would certainly make people think first of what ships to sail or what mods to place.

Isnt that desirable?

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25 minutes ago, z4ys said:

Isnt that desirable?

So many aspects of shipbuilding / mods already have downsides that accompany the choices you make with the exception of a couple (Carta being the one that comes to mind). Not to mention the cost to actually get the upgrade!

So much tinkering has already occurred with regard to ships speeds, thicknesses and BR. I dont know about everyone else but I think how it stands currently works reasonably well. Of course things could change but you will never please everyone and I feel where we are currently pleases the majority. Further changes I feel are unnecessary in this area and certainly what has been suggested here is a very drastic change.

SMALL GRADUAL CHANGES ARE GOOD. Please let us not do a complete U-Turn.

Edited by Liam790

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59 minutes ago, Liam790 said:

Not to mention the cost to actually get the upgrade!

Just a off topic note regarding that. 

There's no cost other than playing the game at this levels

- kill AI in OW

- kill AI in epic events

- loot Treasure Fleet wrecks

- retrieve Empty Bottle ship wrecks

- loot them in PvP sinking player ships

Mechanics "is" a machine. Human concerns are not visible hence cost is technically = zero.

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6 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

Just a off topic note regarding that. 

There's no cost other than playing the game at this levels

- kill AI in OW

- kill AI in epic events

- loot Treasure Fleet wrecks

- retrieve Empty Bottle ship wrecks

- loot them in PvP sinking player ships

Mechanics "is" a machine. Human concerns are not visible hence cost is technically = zero.

We can get into the technicalities if you wish.

Cost is not zero. Even if you assume that the gold you pay is worthless, it is still a choice you make to trade that for the upgrade.
So at the very least (And going back to GCSE business studies here) there is an opportunity cost of one item over another.

Why we are even having this line of discussion however is beyond me... Of course it is a game and so there is no "Real value" but within the game that we all spend so much time in, there is currency. If we ignore the value of the currency then we may aswell all log out and get on with our actual lives as everything will just fall apart.

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I mean, the gold you pay is your ship, your repairs and play the game, pay in time.

Human made inflation of the modules prices player to player is of no consequence, machine wise.

It is our own doing so it is not quantifiable. It is zero, because statistically ANY player can, at any moment, get any module using the "play the game" mechanics in place.

Hence zero cost. Forget player made economy.

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