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J & P Rebalance Mod by JonnyH13 and Pandakraut 6/14/18

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CSA up to antietam on MG

1. Since getting a few batteries of 10lbers up to 2 stars and a battery of napoleans up to 10lbs I am pretty much just bringing the bare amount of infantry and as much arty as I can. The infantry hold off the chargers while the artillery destroys their arty then destroys their units. Since adding the 20lbs during the last campaign season it has been even easier. 2nd Bull run was K/D ratio of 50,000 to 4000. The long range canister shot is really crazy IMO is there any way to limit the distance of canister so it doesn't get so long with the long range cannons?

2. 200 men with whitworths/scopes(also 2 stars) are getting kill ratios like 6k-8k to 1 pretty commonly

3. The much longer ranges of units is making it more difficult to maneuver cavalry on many of the smaller maps don't know if that's bad or good just an observation.

 

Edited by madmatg

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9 minutes ago, drhay53 said:

This is where you should copy the files from the mod release, as far as I can tell. However, as I said, upon starting the game, it freezes at the initial loading screen and won't continue loading. 

The mod relies on a game data path to find the Mod folder. It looks like on a mac that points to /Contents? Can you try copying the Mod folder into that directory and see if the game loads to the main menu?

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5 minutes ago, pandakraut said:

The mod relies on a game data path to find the Mod folder. It looks like on a mac that points to /Contents? Can you try copying the Mod folder into that directory and see if the game loads to the main menu?

I tried putting the Mod folder in Contents (and in several other places) and I couldn't get it to load to the main menu.

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4 minutes ago, drhay53 said:

I tried putting the Mod folder in Contents (and in several other places) and I couldn't get it to load to the main menu.

Does this help at all? Without a mac I'm basically just doing google searches and guessing.

As shown in here https://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/Application-dataPath.html, the datapath points inside the app-file. You can right-click the app-file and click "show package contents". All the files are in there.

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27 minutes ago, madmatg said:

1. Since getting a few batteries of 10lbers up to 2 stars and a battery of napoleans up to 10lbs I am pretty much just bringing the bare amount of infantry and as much arty as I can. The infantry hold off the chargers while the artillery destroys their arty then destroys their units. Since adding the 20lbs during the last campaign season it has been even easier. 2nd Bull run was K/D ratio of 50,000 to 4000. The long range canister shot is really crazy IMO is there any way to limit the distance of canister so it doesn't get so long with the long range cannons?

With siege and 20pdrs things just get worse. The artillery changes were focused to much on trying to increase damage for large units and are far too good for normal sized units. After we get things updated for the hotfix we'll try and find a better point for the artillery damage.

Canister range is .45 of total weapon range. Normally this should be a bit further than rifle range, but with the 1200 range cannon and extra range perks it gets a bit egregious. As a temporary fix you can change canisterShotEffectiveRangeModifier in the unitModifiers file.

32 minutes ago, madmatg said:

2. 200 men with whitworths/scopes(also 2 stars) are getting kill ratios like 6k-8k to 1 pretty commonly

That sounds a bit high for snipers. I'm assuming you are stacking general and unit accuracy mods? Around 2nd bull run everything just starts dieing to artillery so I'm not sure how much damage anything else is doing.

33 minutes ago, madmatg said:

3. The much longer ranges of units is making it more difficult to maneuver cavalry on many of the smaller maps don't know if that's bad or good just an observation.

Ranges overall should be shorter or equal to the base game. I have found it hard to use cavalry because of how quickly any kind of fire damage will cut through them though.

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1. I'll check that out for the canister, but it's not something that can be set for each type of cannon so it may just kill the usefulness of the napolean and howitzers, but it would be a good stopgap for now instead of just blowing everyone away haha

2. Yes, stacking the accuracy mods, I send my sniper unit out with the scout skirmishers and he is pretty difficult to spot by the enemy so I'm able to have him picking off a lot of enemies without ever being seen while the arty does it's work.

 

3. Maybe it's just the increased lethality yes, before I could scoot past taking a few casualties and now I'm taking 30-40 or more and routing while trying to sneak past at the outer range of a unit

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20 minutes ago, pandakraut said:

 

Does this help at all? Without a mac I'm basically just doing google searches and guessing.

As shown in here https://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/Application-dataPath.html, the datapath points inside the app-file. You can right-click the app-file and click "show package contents". All the files are in there.

Unfortunately, no, when I put the Mod folder inside the /Contents/ folder it doesn't work. 

I have no real Unity knowledge so I've just been dropping the Mod folder in random places, and unfortunately not seeing any that work.

 

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@drhay53 Can you try the attached Assembly-Csharp.dll? This has some extra debug logging that will run before the configFile tries to load. It should write a JPReblanceLogFile.txt to two different locations. One is the game data directory, the other is the local user directory where the game stores its save files. The file contains the paths to each location, so if you can find one of them it will point you to the other. The Mod folder needs to go into the directory listed after dataPath:

RebalanceMacInstallTest.zip

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6 hours ago, pandakraut said:

@drhay53 Can you try the attached Assembly-Csharp.dll? This has some extra debug logging that will run before the configFile tries to load. It should write a JPReblanceLogFile.txt to two different locations. One is the game data directory, the other is the local user directory where the game stores its save files. The file contains the paths to each location, so if you can find one of them it will point you to the other. The Mod folder needs to go into the directory listed after dataPath:

RebalanceMacInstallTest.zip

Ok, the dataPath directory in the log file is the /Contents folder, which is where I have been placing the Mod folder. So there must be something else going on.

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9 hours ago, drhay53 said:

I figured out how to install on Mac, however, the mod doesn't seem to work. The game goes to the loading screen and just freezes. 

Yup, can't do anything - for me it didn't just never load, no buttons worked. Is that what you found as well?

If you ONLY install the resources.assets file, that works, but the rest does not.

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7 minutes ago, pandakraut said:

@drhay53 and @quicksabre  Can you try new attached dll? It has a file exists check which looks for /Contents/Mod/ConfigFile.csv and will write the results to /Contents/JPReblanceLogFile.txt. I made some other changes to how the file paths are built so it may actually work now.

 

RebalanceMacInstallTest.zip

Works now! Nice. The instructions then become:

1) In Steam, right click UGCW and select Properties. 

2) Click local files, then select browse local files

3) right click 'Ultimate General Civil War' and select 'show package contents'

4) navigate (relative path) to /Contents/

    a) Place the 'Mod' folder in Contents/

5) navigate (relative path) to /Contents/Resources/Data/

    a) Copy the resources.assets file into /Data/

    b) Copy the /Managed/Assembly-CSharp.dll file from the mod release into the /Managed/ folder, overwriting the existing file

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Having completed Fredricksburg as Union, the increased timers combined with slower speeds are starting to become more noticeable. The battle took me the better part of 4 hours, with the last hour me being AFK because I had already accomplished my objectives.

The major battle after, stones river, took about 2 hours with the last hour being AFK. The ability to micro with slower default speed is nice, but it makes battles where as a player you have already won drag on.

Edited by chemical_art

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I'm going to look into changing the x3 fast forward into around an x8. Will probably be to fast to play on, but it'll help with waiting for timers to run out or early parts of battles where you are just watching a column march somewhere.

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8 minutes ago, chemical_art said:

Having completed Fredricksburg as Union, the increased timers combined with slower speeds are starting to become more noticeable. The battle took me the better part of 4 hours, with the last hour me being AFK because I had already accomplished my objectives.

The major battle after, stones river, took about 2 hours with the last hour being AFK. The ability to micro with slower default speed is nice, but it makes battles where as a player you have already won drag on.

+1

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Just played a historical battle with the mod, Antietam as Union. Can confirm current version doesn't allow achievements to be unlocked, though as posted before, that's expected.

The battle was a blast. We were even on casualties at ~22,000, but because of the superior Union numbers, I won easily. Being able to have time to maneuver on the battlefield, change strategies where necessary, etc. is so huge for me. With the time constraints of the base game it can be very unforgiving, making it feel like you have to adopt the perfect strategy right away, or you'll never have time to win the battle.

I really hope achievements can be unlocked while using the mod, because this is really how I'd like to play the game, but I also have a long list of games to get through and I like to finish achievements where possible.

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Presumably once we get the mod updated for 1.11 the achievements should start working again. The current plan is to just copy paste the previous version changes in instead of doing a balance pass so we should have it ready in less time than the update to 1.10 took.

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Supply depot is really out of whack on the Union side. Stuart rolls in with 1.5k 3 star melee Calvary which alone is enough to wipe out the entirety  of the player's forces, let alone the struggle that it takes up to that point.

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I think a quick fix for the artillery is to remove the accuracy perk stats on perks that have other perks. Accuracy increases damage based on the damage formula, and then you get something that also increases shot/canister/grape in the same perk. Accuracy is > Canister since Accuracy increases damage of all shot types while Canister only increases canister. A second consideration is the AI cannons need to focus more on using canister shot rather than their current shot. The AI has more cannons than you do so if it does decide to bring up their cannons it's VERY hard for a player to deal with. Most of the time the AI likes to keep their cannons far away though.

Vs high number of men: don't know if it is possible to make large units more vulnerable to artillery and small units less vulnerable.
____
I had a 100 melee stat 2 * cavalry unit get out-meleed (with a Pelmetto) by a 1* skirmisher brigade that was smaller on the latest patch. Idk how it happened. By out-meleed I mean both my cav and the skirms were taking 1-1 kill/casualties, so 300 skirms were fighting 300 cav and taking 1-1 damage. Given the cost of cav to skirms this is not worth it to use cavs then. It was the start of battle so both sides were fresh. It was in a forest though. Is this intentional? I think the skirmisher might have had Lorenz rifles with high melee stats. I think the melee stats on some of the higher end rifles need to be brought down a bit as you can hand it to skirmishers and make them not worry about melee. I didn't dismount my cav.

Edited by limith

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35 minutes ago, limith said:

It was in a forest though

Cavalry will always be more effective in open terrain. as any kind of cover will drop melee kill rates considerably. A lot of the value of melee cavalry is in their morale shock. They inflict kills very quickly, which drops morale, which in turn causes the melee value to drop further. The faster you break the unit the fewer casualties the cavalry will take. In cover the kill rate gets slowed down enough that they trade kills more evenly, the longer the battle lasts the worse it will go for the cavalry.

The melee value of palmettos was reduced in the last patch so you will need to upgrade to better pistol/saber weapons for the same results as before. Most rifles have melee values around 65 though they are some specialized rifles with higher values.

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On 6/6/2018 at 5:57 PM, pandakraut said:

 Most rifles have melee values around 65 though they are some specialized rifles with higher values.

 

I do not know if this was intentional or not, but a very cool thing about this mod is that logistics is important due to this fact. At the start of the campaign units might be given melee perks because muskets are cheap. But things turn around eventually and suddenly a melee unit is a fragile creature, needing special "rifles" that have better melee stats which are not common nor cheap. Melee units may need extra special care on the strategic level to give them rifles with good melee values, but you as a leader have to accommodate them. Why? Because there will always be a time where you need to send 2k hard hitting chargers to:

Take.

The.

Point.

Now.

 

You can only get enough guns if you invest in logistics. Otherwise, your poor melee chargers will be gimped by their equipment.

Edited by chemical_art

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I'm finding I don't really care what half my infantry are armed with. I'm spending most of my early points in logistics and econ. Buy 3in Ords and Napoleons, pick Horse Artillery, pick reload buffs. Go accuracy on the general, and push that grand battery right up behind the PBI for maximum shotgun. If above-ground terrain were destructible, vast swathes of forest would be mulch in my current game. Even in '64, there is literally nothing that can stand against 72 guns spewing canister. 36 Napoleons, 36 3in Ord, in two lines of three batteries. Have two brigades of cav for 1,500 to run down the terrified remnants, and enemy brigades just vaporize.

The funny part is I didn't even realize that I didn't need to be as close as I usually am until panda's excellent UI changes were added.

Half my infantry are using Springfield '61/'63s, and the other half are using... rebored muskets. :lol:

Edit: Naps and 3in Ords for the reload. 24lbers and 20lbers take way too long to set up, reload, and fire to be effective like that.

Edited by killjoy1941

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Enjoy the overpowered artillery while you can.  It will be "fixed" in the next update (probably going to be underpowered again...).  

We have some fixes in the works but right now I am a bit busy with Real Life issues so the update may be delayed a bit.  

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I don't know that you can really avoid this without changing the accuracy traits. I built my first corps specifically to cause and maintain rolling routs, and it does just that every time. My artillery is literally on the ass of my infantry the entire time because I built it for speed and reload, so the earlier discussion about canister and shell ranges being changed will do absolutely nothing.

I was deliberately testing the hypothesis that rolling routs are in fact much less expensive over time than force preservation ever was, and it's worked very nicely, though it might prove invalid on Legendary since the AI artillery would be just that much more effective. Then again, the player could probably just concentrate even more batteries, so I can't say for certain unless I step up from MG on the next run.

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