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Percival Merewether

Boarding + 'Determined Defender' suggestion

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 If you need Determined Defender removed to win a battle... you are a poor sailor.

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Historically, some vessels used nets to prevent the enemy ship from boarding it so you could only rename Determined Defender to Nets or whatsoever. Also, this prevents a sinking ship from boarding you, which IMHO is not OK if the enemy ship's main deck is almost underwater already.

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38 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

Several threads about the exact same subject, all in suggestions board, have been merged.

Please use Search and avoid creating multiple threads about one subject.

http://forum.game-labs.net/search

Also give feedback in this thread

 

Thanks for moving my post.

I'll follow you advice for my next posts.

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11 hours ago, Cabral said:

 If you need Determined Defender removed to win a battle... you are a poor sailor.

Would prefer less magic. The idea of a totally demasted can't get boarded until you have30%morecrew sucks. With DD people tack without worry. DD should only apply when you have 50/100 boarding prep

  • Like 1

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I  don’t like Determine Defender. It ‘s: “take this skill and dictate the boarders your playstyle.”

I think Boarding should be more implemented in the See fight action to make it more interesting instead of just give the people an option deny it. I’d like to see following changes. Especially I like to solve problems with realism ;)

First of all make graping effective against unprotected crew on the deck. Weather deck Gun crew, Sailing crew and boarding crew. So people can defend against a boarding attack with grape. A ship in full boarding preparation has a bunch of unprotected crew on the deck. The Potential crew lose without boarding prep should be no problem half the sailing crew should be on Sails and the other half on deck so the potential crew loss is more or less negligible.

Example: Sailingcrew Trincomalee 135 half of them 67 on deck. A perfect graping over the whole deck by potential lose rate of 25% would be around 16 crew member. Realistic an OK.

I’d also recommend that the Sailing crew required is reduced by the amount of set sail (Half Sails half crew or something like that). So you could further reduce your potential lose against this deck graping and it would make more sense to reduce sails in Battle, like it was in reality.

Implement Muskets into the sea fight.
There should be a button to Man musket positions in the sea fight. On short ranges about 30m they’ll shoot to unprotected crew on deck. An elevation bonus would be great. This will make pushing with smaller ships much harder. The whole pushing process will cause losses on both sides. With the elevation bonus a bigger defender will be in favor. And it helps against stupid situations where small ships stay below ship guns and continuously shoot.

Implement a pulling timer for boarding
If you stretch the time which is needed to pull the ships together there will be more time to react. Forbid the pulling ship to use canons to favor the defender.  And implement skills/upgrades for the defender to further increase the pull time (another bonus on Boarding Axes?). Maybe allow boarding only for ships which where recently in rigging shock.

Determine Defender could look like that in the future
50 Morale bonus when get boarded
Bonus against boarding attacks

Summaries: Just try to get out of the paper, Scissors, Stone into a skill based boarding. More fun for everyone.

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Sounds like DD is doing its job and giving us realism.  Historically, most boardings were successful only when the target was helpless and outnumbered.  That's realistic.  This meta of ramming a perfectly healthy ship and pushing it into the wing then boarding with all your mods has become a habit in this game and is nowhere near realistic.  People who practice this tactic hate DD.  Winning with mods is garbage.

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17 minutes ago, Ruben van Woltering said:

Maybe allow boarding only for ships which where recently in rigging shock.

This is actually a interesting proposal.

Remember the focal point of the moment is sinking as fast as possible ( if a fast boarding will do it the better) - little motivation to capture ships, especially traders and prized cargo. Sink all.

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I have an easy solution. 

1) DD active when boarding prep. is at least 50 (as stated before many times). If you are not prepared you can not be a determined defender. Grappling should require more time, to start the boarding.

2) To solve boarding game. Give actions preparation time and make it visible. Hey you can not order your hundred man  and they can not act in a second. You order them to prepare, they get ready, you give order, they attack. This is at best 5 second action. 

You have choosen ATTACK. There is visual bar or circle. It starts filling up and requires 4-5 seconds to reach %100. So defender will see ATTACK is being prepared. Commands also uses from your overal prep. If you pressed attack 4 seconds before round ends, it should not be a good attack, defend also needs to charge up to be fully effective. So no more last second button clicking. 

Commanding an action, getting ready should cost action points, executing the command should coast more points. Cancelling command should take some time, costing some action points. 

So the game becomes, effectiveness of your mods and soldiers plus very importantly number of you men and the morale. Not the last second button clicker. 

This is just some idea, I have also purposed the deck card game style boarding before. 

So this boarding game has to change. After ui patch, we are expecting content including a new and better boarding mini game. 

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I hope that the boarding mechanics will change more fundamentally than just little tweaks to the rock, paper, scissors game.

The emotional pacing of combat in NA seems backwards it me.

Maneuvering, getting the weather gauge, timing a rake, etc... should be a cerebral, strategic endeaver,  but because each Captain has to aim the cannons themself, it is turned into a fast-paced, action packed first person shooter.

Boarding, by contrast, really should be a visual, visceral, fast-paced, action packed game of firing flintlocks and crossing swords. Instead, it is a downright tedious game of waiting 15 seconds, pressing a little rectangular button, and then waiting another 15 seconds.

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Determined Defender should be removed or changed significantly. It makes no sense to me that someone can simply choose not to be boarded with a simple perk.

A ship that is well outfit for boarding requires multiple slots for boarding upgrades as well as a significant portion of crew permanently set aside as marines. Also boarding preparation must be built up before actually engaging which requires nearly half the crew.

All this can be shrugged off by a perk that requires no crew, no preparation, and only one perk slot.

I think that determined defender should either:

  • require preparation similar to boarding
  • require a percentage of crew
  • or just be removed
  • Like 6

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Agreed with Privateer and I am not a person that likes to board one bit, choosing to sink my targets with metal and fire. The determined defender perk is just too strong of a perk especially for how much it costs. It does need to be altered where it still helps in preventing rage boarding but is not a determining factor where it can prevent boarding as much as it currently does.

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34 minutes ago, Capn Rocko said:

This has already been argued to death. But I wouldn't mind a slight nerf 😉

I would not call it much of an argument when the majority of the participants agree. ;)

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Yesterday, i had a fight with and Endy attacking my fleet of indiamans, i could have boarded him if it wasn't for his determined defender perk. The perk is awesome for frigates because you do not have to care about being close and slow while manoeuvring. It is OP i have to agree. 

The perk is good, useful, maybe give it 3 points. Also make it so that you have to manually enable it like F10 brace. While it's enabled, there will be no gun reload.

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As long as we have a mechanic that magically allows ships to push you into the wind by delibaretly ramming you, I will use Determined Defender to avoid this stupid mechanic.

So Yes, I am using one broken mechanic to avoid another broken mechanic.

  • Like 5

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Gotta board em if you cant sink em

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17 minutes ago, Batman said:

As long as we have a mechanic that magically allows ships to push you into the wind by delibaretly ramming you, I will use Determined Defender to avoid this stupid mechanic.

So Yes, I am using one broken mechanic to avoid another broken mechanic.

What about ships going full sails and shooting broadsides? Normally ships would go battle sails.

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Threads about the same subject were all merged into this one.

10. Redundant threads will be locked.

Please use search find information you want to discuss. A lot of threads on the same subject delay the development and wastes resources causing lots of good ideas to be lost. Please keep discussions regarding a topic to a single thread.

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1 hour ago, Banished Privateer said:

What about ships going full sails and shooting broadsides? Normally ships would go battle sails.

Good thing Battle sails will receive a buff.

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