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Chain shot limitations - advanced warning

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I remember once @admin told a story about wolf and sheps, when he argued about reinforcementzone. So we now are turning away form keeping the sheeps alive and just are happy with the wolf. 

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14 minutes ago, admin said:

PS. Patrol battles always end with death. 

Most of them; I had one case where a bunch of princes targeted and chained my belle poule - couldnt catch them.

Now that  should be partly solved with limited chain, so i like it.

(patrol battles still need a RoE overhaul tho :P )

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4 minutes ago, HachiRoku said:

But ships repairing from 10% hp to 100 in 30-40 min at sea is? 

your telling me a crew of 470 people cant swap out some ripped dirty rags for some nice white fresh sails. in 40mins. I could do it by myself in 5mins

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14 minutes ago, Jesper Dahl said:

 

You can cater for the 2% crowd as much as you want but your game is dead then.

http://steamcharts.com/app/311310

How many DLCs are you going to try sell to the same 25-50 people and their alts?

We doubt that chain shot has such huge correlation with online . I am sure you are just exaggerating because of passion

But  In fact online numbers are completely irrelevant for me during early access. 
They are going to continue going up and down between 200-700 during early access every patch

 

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7 minutes ago, admin said:

We doubt that chain shot has such huge correlation with online numbers. In fact online numbers are completely irrelevant for me during early access. 
They are going to continue going up and down between 200-700 during early access every patch

 

Having a decent chance in a PvP battle or not will affect player numbers. 

EDIT: Make all ammos limited so that there's different tactics to win a battle or make them unlimited.

Edited by Lars Kjaer
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1 hour ago, admin said:

Captains

Amount of chain shot carried by a ship will be limited next patch (so called tutorial patch)
No perk will be required for use of chain (at least for now).

Reasons

  • Historically ships carried A LOT less chain and grape compared to normal cannon balls. 
  • Gameplay wise we want to bring more skill into chaining and limitation of chain will force players to conserve it, pick proper angles to destroy more sail and in general think about its use instead of current chainshot clicker heroes
  • This also means that outnumbered players will have easier time fighting against bigger groups who rely on active chaining as the ONLY tactic. 

Please start thinking about new tactics and of course.... discuss. 

Why not introduce limited ammo at this point? This will even help Economy. In reality Captains could share ammunition with their fleet ships. You can make it happen as well. 

Edited by Project Pluto
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2 minutes ago, admin said:

We doubt that chain shot has such huge correlation with online . I am sure you are just exaggerating because of passion

But  In fact online numbers are completely irrelevant for me during early access. 
They are going to continue going up and down between 200-700 during early access every patch

 

The game is dead post early access unless something big happening. And that isn´t to cater to 25-50 people when they whine about being chained when they wanted easy kills.

And we all know from history how these kind of changes affects the game. then you can backtrack on the changes later while losing about part of the ever diminishing population and more complaints about not being able to find a battle.

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2 minutes ago, Capt Trashal Early said:

Just saying judging by the forums of late the combat models been pretty stable and acceptable. This rash change seems really ill thought out.

it necesarry becouse certain PvP-ers do not like when battle changes and they cannot run becouse they are constabtly chained

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11 minutes ago, HachiRoku said:

Naval action has been to casual for my taste lately. There is nothing hardcore about it. 

Because they are catering for both the carebears AND the PvP players.. Basically they are ensuring the carebears hardly ever experience PvP but when they do - the outcome is dictated beforehand in favour of the experienced PvP players.

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2 minutes ago, Capt Trashal Early said:

Just saying judging by the forums of late the combat models been pretty stable and acceptable. This rash change seems really ill thought out.

Its not ill thought out. It's the devs thinking it's unfair that a good players sinks to 10 people chaining. Guess what. I lost my favorite trinco to that on Sunday. Still here arguing in favor of it because 1 ship SHOULD NOT be able to fight many. This is not hardcore. This is the opposite of hardcore. 

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9 minutes ago, staun said:

I remember once @admin told a story about wolf and sheps, when he argued about reinforcementzone. So we now are turning away form keeping the sheeps alive and just are happy with the wolf. 

Can you elaborate in detail how does green zones relate to limited chain?

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Just now, HachiRoku said:

Its not ill thought out. It's the devs thinking it's unfair that a good players sinks to 10 people chaining. Guess what. I lost my favorite trinco to that on Sunday. Still here arguing in favor of it because 1 ship SHOULD NOT be able to fight many. This is not hardcore. This is the opposite of hardcore. 

 

FINALLY! Someone who understands. 

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8 minutes ago, traitorous mctraitoro said:

your telling me a crew of 470 people cant swap out some ripped dirty rags for some nice white fresh sails. in 40mins. I could do it by myself in 5mins

I'd like to see that - preferably while I fire my cannon at you...

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Just now, admin said:

Can you elaborate in detail how does green zones relate to limited chain?

 

2 minutes ago, Lars Kjaer said:

Because they are catering for both the carebears AND the PvP players.. Basically they are ensuring the carebears hardly ever experience PvP but when they do - the outcome is dictated beforehand in favour of the experienced PvP players.

 

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We want people to come out and fight. All ready player are complaining about ppl not want to come out and fight, but stay at there reinforcementzone. We think this change will get more players out to fight? We all ready had to invent a patrole area in a desperate try to get some fights.

 

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If you wish to fix something completely unrealistic, then start by removing the crew resurrection and cannon recreation with repairs.

And then remember the sniper cannon accuracy as well.

Edited by Jesper Dahl
Wording
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21 minutes ago, admin said:

We doubt that chain shot has such huge correlation with online . I am sure you are just exaggerating because of passion

But  In fact online numbers are completely irrelevant for me during early access. 
They are going to continue going up and down between 200-700 during early access every patch

 

Listen, you are doing the right thing, but do not just limit chain. You are making a mess. Limit all the ammo and add it to the production. Also, increase weight on Chain, and keep weight on Balls low. Make it available in every port from npc with +25% markup and let players craft/sell fro cheaper. 

-Iron, Forge and Add perk called 'Reinforced Ammo Crates' to add +5% ammo carry capacity for chain. 

(Frigate) Chain - 200, Balls - 2000 ratio ?

To stop people from complaining, add Ammo drops to npcs in case they run out and need to resupply. (Sink npc and steal their ammo). 

Edited by Project Pluto
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1 minute ago, Jesper Dahl said:

If you wish to fix something completely unrealistic, then start by removing the crew resurrection and cannon recreation with repairs.

And then remember the sniper cannon accuracy as well.

and masts reapearing during battle.

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Just now, Lovec1990 said:

and masts reapearing during battle.

 

2 minutes ago, Jesper Dahl said:

If you wish to fix something completely unrealistic, then start by removing the crew resurrection and cannon recreation with repairs.

And then remember the sniper cannon accuracy as well.

 

And sailors magically coming back to life with Rum

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1 minute ago, Jesper Dahl said:

If you wish to fix something completely unrealistic, then start by removing the crew resurrection and cannon recreation with repairs.

And then remember the sniper cannon accuracy as well.

Realism is a bollocks excuse. Most of the game is unrealistic and its fine the way it is. Minor tweaks are necessary to the combat model or a major overhaul. Not random rash changes like this. Concentrate on the important shit and get it done then come back and look at the combat model in the future. Take war thunders development as a example. They've gone back to the combat model time and time again but in big patches.

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10 minutes ago, Jesper Dahl said:

The game is dead post early access unless something big happening. And that isn´t to cater to 25-50 people when they whine about being chained when they wanted easy kills.

And we all know from history how these kind of changes affects the game. then you can backtrack on the changes later while losing about part of the ever diminishing population and more complaints about not being able to find a battle.

You are making a flawed statement. Think about it

You say limited chain will increase online drop.
There are two states of the game

  • One with limited chain
  • Another with unlimited chain

Something must be preferred by players and one is definitely better than another. We have not tested with limited chain and the only time to test is before release.

You post online numbers and say they are falling. But chain shot is not limited currently.
Inferring from your argument (using 1st year logic) this means Unlimited chain shot is the reason of online fall?
Using your logic further - limited chain will cause online to go up? Because it falls currently with unlimited chain

 

Lesson of all this.
I want more tactical depth in chain use and will add it to the game despite if some casual players want to keep brainless clicker heroes chaining with no thinking required.

Online will fluctuate and has no correlation with chainshot number. (+ it always fell in april may before)
Online is not growing because there is no advertising and random players who stumble to forums see hating posts from you and decide to wait. 

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Just now, admin said:

You are making a flawed statement. Think about it

You say limited chain will increase online drop.
There are two states of the game

  • One with limited chain
  • Another with unlimited chain

Something must be preferred by players and one is definitely better than another.
You post online numbers and say they are falling. But chain shot is not limited currently.
Inferring from your argument (using 1st year logic) this means Unlimited chain shot is the reason of online fall?
Using your logic further - limited chain will cause online to go up? Because it falls currently with unlimited chain

 

Lesson of all this. Online will fluctuate. I want more tactical depth in chain use and will add it to the game despite if you want brainless clicker heroes chaining
Online is falling because there is no advertising and random players who stumble to forums see hating posts from you and decide to wait. 
 

 

You really are not reading what he is saying, you are just trying to blindly defend the change.

He is saying that lots of changes like this, have caused the player base to fall. 

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