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1 hour ago, admin said:
  • BR of 1 (no rewards whatsoever for them) which will clearly identify them in the open world, also removing any attacking capability 

 

so we will see 25x npc capped santis in PBs of 2400 BR?

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58 minutes ago, admin said:

This will be a dramatic change as a last capture test before release finish line

All ships can be captured from the NPCs (awesome for pve players).
But those NPC captured ships will be mostly useless in PVP (on both sides) due to 2 things

  • Mast/Sail huge debuff (bots dont shoot sails)
  • BR of 1 (no rewards whatsoever for them) which will clearly identify them in the open world, also removing any attacking capability 

Slaughtering sheeps dynamics will change significantly and we believe to the better.

 

I'm not sure I like BR 1, look at the Basic cutter, even though it can't start PvP it is sitll being abused by joining low level missions and other things.  Basic cutter should not be a ship you can just jump into, with the return to closes Outpost added when you get sink you should only be able to use a basic cutter if you have no other combat ships in your docks (leave out trade ships).   Just like how POTBS had fallback ships up to a certain level.

Now what I would do with AI ships is have them only have 1-2 perm slots instead of 3 and have the only 3 Ship Knowledge slots.   I would not make them BR 1 cause folks can than use them to run things that are important thinking they won't get tagged or they will use them to annoy folks or join battles if it's going to be limited like the Basic cutters.  Maybe give half BR of the parent ship for rewards of it being sunk.  Other wise I'll take my 1 BR ship with a group of other players and get crazy PvP marks by singing low level players in them.  Cause if I sink some one in a basic cutter I still get rewards they just don't get any rewards.  So don't go to the no risk high reward thing again we had issues with basic cutters in the past.   

Now what I would do along with the slot limit on it is make them like the POTBS flallbacks.  captured ai ships have reduced stats from a built ship.  Hell just make all captured ships Oak/Oak Not a big fan of crewspace, but Oak/Crewspace could work too.  You can still grind AI with that, but it's crap to use for any PvP.  And mark them all so every one knows the player is in an AI ship...maybe just put the tag *BASIC* on there ship names in OW or some other mark. 

Navy Brig (B)  would be what some would see for a ship that is AI captured as the B would stand for basic ship.

 

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3 minutes ago, Liq said:

so we will see 25x npc capped santis in PBs of 2400 BR?

well BR of 1 should block them from joining. 2400 BR ports only allow BR 75 - 650 in.

 

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3 minutes ago, Liq said:

so we will see 25x npc capped santis in PBs of 2400 BR?

The one solution for that is capped ships can't be brought into PB's, but I kinda don't like this cause I think we should be able to use what ever we can.  Maybe have them keep there BR for tag purpose and PB entery but they have reduced BR for them to start PvP battles of there own.

 

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22 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

The one solution for that is capped ships can't be brought into PB's, but I kinda don't like this cause I think we should be able to use what ever we can.  Maybe have them keep there BR for tag purpose and PB entery but they have reduced BR for them to start PvP battles of there own.

 

PBs controlled by clans and clans reject any useless ships and players. Think what you are writing I thought you know this. If you bring NPC capped ship to PB you will see rotten tomatoes fly in your face. Port battles use only the best and most active ships and players. Bringing NPC capped ship to PB with paper thin masts will jeopardize the whole operation and you will be called a traitor. SO, just leave it be and let new guys enjoy this smart new feature. 

Capturing NPC ships is a big + to all who left the game and enjoyed safe game environment. Guys who like to just go pop few fleets and go do Econ can no longer care about being sunk and loose everything. 

Edited by H2O

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Just now, H2O said:

safe game environment. 

Just keep it out of PVP nations. Its gotten in the way as it is with greenzones killing the economy aspects of hitting a nations waters. Really tired of the attitude that PVP should only achieve in 1.removing the player of his ship) and 2. gaining PVP marks)

Where's the world around it?

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7 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

Just keep it out of PVP nations. Its gotten in the way as it is with greenzones killing the economy aspects of hitting a nations waters. Really tired of the attitude that PVP should only achieve in 1.removing the player of his ship) and 2. gaining PVP marks)

Where's the world around it?

You can practice pvp on players. Do you even read Admins post? Ships will not reward you with anything if you sink it and the baby seal who you killed will be angry at you and will call you on public chat - babyseal clubber. This will let all other players know that this famous pvp player fell that low. Unlike in real ship, baby seal will go and cap another ship and will continue his activities. Today when you kill a baby seal he can't afford to restore his loss and simply quit the game. Don't stress too much, NPC ship cap will maintain healthy numbers and will add new pvpers to our list. 

Edited by H2O

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13 minutes ago, H2O said:

PBs controlled by clans and clans reject any useless ships and players. Think what you are writing I though you know this. Capturing NPC ships is a big + to all who left the game and enjoyed safe game environment. 

Here's a short anarchist's manual for you:

  1. Attack Cartagena with 25 fireship "PvE" 1st rates and blow up enemy's 1sts, just to see them scream
  2. Attack a 2400 BR port with 22 PvE 1st rates and 3 standard ones
  3. Use 1BR ships to enter hostility missions and blow yourself up. Mix normal 1st rates with "PvE" 1sts
  4. Equip 1st rate in a way that it can still be a support ship in PvP, and enter PvP missions sometimes in a standard 1st, sometimes in a "PvE" first. This way you can get marks without any risks, and denying marks to enemy
  5. capture a trader and trade in a ship that doesn't give enemy PvP marks (as noone is interested in cargo itself)
  6. ...more ideas coming in :)
Edited by vazco

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3 minutes ago, vazco said:

Here's a short anarchist's manual for you:

  1. Attack Cartagena with 25 fireship "PvE" 1st rates and blow up enemy's 1sts, just to see them scream
  2. Attack a 2400 BR port with 22 PvE 1st rates and 3 standard ones
  3. Use 1BR ships to enter hostility missions and blow yourself up. Mix normal 1st rates with "PvE" 1sts
  4. Equip 1st rate in a way that it can still be a support ship in PvP, and enter PvP missions sometimes in a standard 1st, sometimes in a "PvE" first. This way you can get marks without any risks, and denying marks to enemy
  5. ...more ideas coming in :)

I think admin used word 'restricted' didn't he? I am sure he knows what to restrict. 

Edited by H2O

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Just now, H2O said:

You can practice pvp on players. Do you even read Admins post? Ships will not reward you with anything if you sink it and the baby seal who you killed will be angry at you and will call you on public chat - babyseal clubber. This will let all other players know that this famous pvp player fell that low. Unlike in real ship, baby seal will go and cap another ship and will continue his activities. Today when you kill a baby seal he can't afford to restore his loss and simply quit the game. Don't stress too much, NPC cap will maintain healthy numbers and will add new pvpers to our list. 

That's my point. Leave new players and people who want to PVE safely out of it. You're not helping either side having them get in each others way. Which I can see happening when PVPers who don't PVP solely for marks start attacking these weaker, less skilled captains in their debuffed boats.

Edited by Slim Jimmerson

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4 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

That's my point. Leave new players and people who want to PVE safely out of it. You're not helping either side having them get in each others way.

You are wrong here. You can't have 100% pvp server, they already tried it and look we are down to 180 players again us time. -150 players so far who do not play anymore. 

Edited by H2O

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5 minutes ago, vazco said:

Here's a short anarchist's manual for you:

capture a trader and trade in a ship that doesn't give enemy PvP marks (as noone is interested in cargo itself)

  1. ...more ideas coming in :)

Yeah, this 1 BR trash ship plan should not be applied to ships below 4th Rate...

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Just now, H2O said:

You are wrong here. You can't have 100% pvp server, they already tried it and look we are down to 180 players again. 

No, but you can have 100% of PVPers agree to the terms of PVP. What I mean is you can have PVE, you can have 100% safe PVE in the PVP server if you separate nations meant to do PVE and nations meant to partake in PVP, without having to compromise between the realness of less than safe PVP/RVR. and the less than safe-ness of..well less than safe PVE in areas where PVP is constantly happening around you and you can't avoid it.

Or even just an area of the map where once you enter you're 100% PVE safe until you leave. I don't see anything interesting happening at the gulf.

Edited by Slim Jimmerson

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2 minutes ago, maturin said:

Yeah, this 1 BR trash ship plan should not be applied to ships below 4th Rate...

Admin said all ships will be capturable with set restrictions (can't attack, can't enter PB, low mast health etc... ) what is wrong with this?

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11 minutes ago, H2O said:

I think admin used word 'restricted' didn't he? I am sure he knows what to restrict. 

Sure. Devs never had issues with introducing new exploits with new functionalities. Definitely it's not an issue of an IT project, escpecially a complex game. There's definitely no need to point potential exploits out.

Edited by vazco

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2 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

No, but you can have 100% of PVPers agree to the terms of PVP. What I mean is you can have PVE, you can have 100% safe PVE in the PVP server if you separate nations meant to do PVE and nations meant to partake in PVP, without having to compromise between the realness of less than safe PVP/RVR. and the less than safe-ness of..well less than safe PVE in areas where PVP is constantly happening around you.

Build a wall and remove a risk factor? NPC crap ships will be free , but the risk still be there to make sailing epic. Your strategy will cut customers in 2 types and eventually they will quit the game due to inability to enjoy the same content others enjoy. 

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Just now, H2O said:

Admin said all ships will be capturable with set restrictions (can't attack, can't enter PB, low mast health etc... ) what is wrong with this?

They'll still be attacked. There goes the idea of safely doing PVE. 

Unless I'm wrong and they can't be attacked. In which I wonder how long until they're used to troll the enemy?

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2 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

They'll still be attacked. There goes the idea of safely doing PVE. 

Unless I'm wrong and they can't be attacked. In which I wonder how long until they're used to troll the enemy?

Safety is in free ship capture. It's same thing as insurance , but requires work. Go out cap 5 ships for free and go enjoy what ever happens to you. You get me? For new guys this is perfect and they will experience that risk without risk.

Edited by H2O

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1 hour ago, z4ys said:

I recently expirenced that players use basic cutters to transport their treasures. Not because they are cheap the reason is while they think that people dont attack them when using a ship that offers no reward.

Most cutters without the recently killed flags are carrying something interesting if they are commandeered by rear admirals.

 

50 minutes ago, Liq said:

so we will see 25x npc capped santis in PBs of 2400 BR?

you cant enter the pb with BR of 1. Minimum requirement is above 40 i believe. You also cannot attack a player with the BR of 1. BUT YOU CAN attack any NPC fleet. 

 

18 minutes ago, vazco said:

Here's a short anarchist's manual for you:

  1. Attack Cartagena with 25 fireship "PvE" 1st rates and blow up enemy's 1sts, just to see them scream
  2. Attack a 2400 BR port with 22 PvE 1st rates and 3 standard ones
  3. Use 1BR ships to enter hostility missions and blow yourself up. Mix normal 1st rates with "PvE" 1sts
  4. Equip 1st rate in a way that it can still be a support ship in PvP, and enter PvP missions sometimes in a standard 1st, sometimes in a "PvE" first. This way you can get marks without any risks, and denying marks to enemy
  5. capture a trader and trade in a ship that doesn't give enemy PvP marks (as noone is interested in cargo itself)
  6. ...more ideas coming in :)

cant be done
except for point 4, which is fine because the such shabby support ship will only support until the first shot into the masts

 

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9 minutes ago, admin said:

Most cutters without the recently killed flags are carrying something interesting if they are commandeered by rear admirals.

 

8 minutes ago, admin said:

you cant enter the pb with BR of 1. Minimum requirement is above 40 i believe. You also cannot attack anyone with the BR of 1.

So I can take a pve santi make my hold full of teak logs and sail between my captial impossible to attack zone in a ship that cant even be attacked  when out of the zone?

 

Sounds broken to me

Edited by z4ys

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7 minutes ago, admin said:

you cant enter the pb with BR of 1. Minimum requirement is above 40 i believe. You also cannot attack anyone with the BR of 1.

So you can't PvP in a ship you captured from the AI. Which is something I spent time doing yesterday and the day before.

This is just another barrier to starting PvP, and further narrowing the scope of what kinds of PvP gameplay are possible and viable. Less of the sandbox remains with every restriction.

It's a high price to pay just to please a few players who want to capture AI 1st Rates. So why not apply it to Rates 1-4 only? Then no current gameplay is lost.

 

Quote

cant be done

Yes, at least #5 can be done. Most trade happens in capped AI trader ships. Now I won't get PvP marks for attacking a trader. And the trader will have even less chance to escape because of no counter-tag opportunity and weak sails. It's a lose/lose.

Doing missions already dwarfs the utility of trading when it comes to making money (for the average player who doesn't have fleets of 4 indiamen). So as a result we just further diminish the viability of trading.

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Just now, z4ys said:

 

So I can take a pve santi make my hold full of teak logs and sail between my captial impossible to attack zone in an ship that cant even be attacked  when out of the zone?

 

Sounds broken to me

You cannot attack anyone with the BR of one. You can be attacked though. 
br 1 will have BR  too high when trying to attack

 

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Just now, H2O said:

Build a wall and remove a risk factor? NPC crap ships will be free , but the risk still be there to make sailing epic. Your strategy will cut customers in 2 types and eventually they will quit the game due to inability to enjoy the same content others enjoy. 

How is it splitting the customers into 2 types? Let me spin you a yarn.

We already cut the servers into PVP and PVE. What keep the devs from ignoring the players who want100% safe PVE in a PVP centric server in favor of having a completely free, real, unfiltered PVP experience? Don't give me BS, no PVEr wants to be ganked by an experienced PVPer. 

Instead of having the devs drop the weight of PVE centrist, and pointing them back to THEIR server, they can be nice and give you guys your own area of the map, where you're free to craft, PVE, set up your own little mini economy within the safezone. Do everything you want without the interference of pesky PVPers. That way we don't have to accommodate your stay on the PVP side of things with limitations, AI, non taggable ships and whatnot.

Just don't hurt both sides by trying to keep these two very different sides of the game in the same place. PVP will still have PVE, but it won't be safe so PVE centrist wouldn't want to be a part of it.

 

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2 hours ago, admin said:
  • BR of 1 (no rewards whatsoever for them) which will clearly identify them in the open world, also removing any attacking capability 

 

So then we can remove the safezones?

Because PvE-players can be safe anywhere by sailing capped NPC-ships which will make it pointless to attack them or jump their battles. 

Sailing NPC-capped ships will be like a PVE-flag.

Edited by Anolytic
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1 minute ago, Anolytic said:

So then we can remove the safezones?

Because PvE-players can be safe anywhere by sailing capped NPC-ships which will make it pointless to attack them or jump their battles. 

I'm sure 1 BR ships will still get attacked for entertainment and practice.

Also when you screenshot the Tab menu of the 1st Rate you killed in a Surprise, it doesn't show the BR.

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