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Just now, Liq said:

"Traders" without escort carelessly moving crafting mats around because they cant be touched in their beloved safezone dont add anything to the game. Waste time sailing a trader where you cant get attacked anyway to craft a ship, or get ships through pvping. Some prefer the latter.

You could already get ships through PVPing by capturing them from players. Again, we don't need PVP marks.

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4 hours ago, Sento de Benimaclet said:

Gentlemen DEVS. today PVP if you are not an expert is losing the boat, because you do not have the experience of those who only do PVP and also are not available to all exclusive upgrades of PVP Marks. Or the Wasa.

To obtain that experience it is evidently achieved by doing a lot of PVP, and that is where I want to end up.

If you think that expierienced PVP-players dont sink, you seem to play a different Naval Action than I do.

It's just that you go out again and learn from your past mistakes.

Edited by Never Surrender
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1 minute ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

You could already get ships through PVPing by capturing them from players. Again, we don't need PVP marks.

I have seen some very weird builds, fir-live oak, sabicu fir, etc. 

IMO due to bad ballancing, anything other than teak - wo or wo - wo is not viable, so why would we have to depend on capping ships from players either not knowing the woods at all or just experimenting?

More ships should be obtainable through marks IMO. Economy is not working properly anyway (in a world where you are completely safe to any production ports and can buy them for cheap money); it's basically just a time waste ? After work I dont want to visit every port and get my mats to craft ships, nor have to PvE to buy them

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Just now, Liq said:

I have seen some very weird builds, fir-live oak, sabicu fir, etc. 

IMO due to bad ballancing, anything other than teak - wo or wo - wo is not viable, so why would we have to depend on capping ships from players either not knowing the woods at all or just experimenting?

More ships should be obtainable through marks IMO. Economy is not working properly anyway (in a world where you are completely safe to any production ports and can buy them for cheap money); it's basically just a time waste ? After work I dont want to visit every port and get my mats to craft ships, nor have to PvE to buy them

I understand where you're coming from. I honestly don't know. Devs need to figure out if they want an MMO or a sandbox arena. If every ship is to be made with PVP marks then we can get rid of crafting/trading. There's no reason for the game to pretend to be something its not.

If devs DO want an MMO where the world outside combat matters, then they should start with combining CMs and PVP marks, and making "ship notes" into "craft notes" that redeem for all necessary craft mats. That way players are free from the obligation of PVP marks, while solidifying the parts of the game that are so fractured they don't interact at all.

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10 minutes ago, Liq said:

More ships should be obtainable through marks IMO. Economy is not working properly anyway (in a world where you are completely safe to any production ports and can buy them for cheap money); it's basically just a time waste ? After work I dont want to visit every port and get my mats to craft ships, nor have to PvE to buy them

I think the idea is you're supposed to get your ship crafted by someone who likes to do those things, or buy crafted ships on the market.  If you have marks you should easily be able to buy crafted ships by selling/trading them? 

 

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Just now, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

I think the idea is you're supposed to get your ship crafted by someone who likes to do those things, or buy crafted ships on the market.  If you have marks you should easily be able to buy crafted ships by selling/trading them? 

According to game direction, no. You're allowed to be completely separated from crafting/eco/player interaction. This was intended by the developers, or else they would've kept the game in the realistic, world building direction.

But now we're stuck at the halfway point where we can have an MMO on one side, and an arena on the other. It's like there's 2 different games in NA rn and no one knows wtf this game is suppose to be.

Edited by Slim Jimmerson
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1 hour ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

Killing traders doesn't deserve a PVP reward.  It isn't PVP to club seals.  

A trader ain't a seal. A seal is a noob - hence seal-clubbing. I kill traders. Or rather I used to - back when it was actually possible to wage war on any countrys economy. Now PvP is meaningless other than for the fight. You go to a countrys capital - wait of a ganking squad - then kill the ganking squad and get berated in the global chat for killing seals in your Wasa.

Make PvP meaningfull again and more ppl will do it.

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15 minutes ago, Bearwall said:

A trader ain't a seal. A seal is a noob - hence seal-clubbing. I kill traders.

A seal is whatever can't fight back in any effective sense. 

 

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Just now, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

A seal is whatever can't fight back in any effective sense. 

 

I disagree. But it really doesn't matter - if a trader loses his ship today in the world of greenzones and magical reinforzements.. Well they've been watching TV too long then..

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4 minutes ago, Bearwall said:

I disagree. But it really doesn't matter - if a trader loses his ship today in the world of greenzones and magical reinforzements.. Well they've been watching TV too long then..

The point is it doesn't deserve "PVP" rewards.  You are welcome to capture the cargo and ship. We need to encourage people to fight actual warships, not get free marks by farming snows and trader brigs.

 

Edited by Barbancourt (rownd)
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1 minute ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

The point is it doesn't deserve "PVP" rewards.  You are welcome to capture the cargo and ship. 

 

Cargo and ship are worth nothing. 

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4 minutes ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

The point is it doesn't deserve "PVP" rewards.  You are welcome to capture the cargo and ship. We need to encourage people to fight actual warships, not get free marks by farming snows and trader brigs.

 

 

2 minutes ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

Then go find a warship to sink, scrub.

PvP is as broken as the economy. Go wait in a greenzone for someone to build enough of a ganking fleet to try to kill you, then wait for them to build up the courage to tag you and then kill them all because they are still thinking their ships are actually worth something. Remove the PvP marks entirely - make it all playercrafted or storebought. 

And remove the greenzones, reinforcementzones etc. - it is a PvP server and there are still, a PvE server.

Edited by Bearwall
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1 hour ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

According to game direction, no. You're allowed to be completely separated from crafting/eco/player interaction. This was intended by the developers, or else they would've kept the game in the realistic, world building direction.

But now we're stuck at the halfway point where we can have an MMO on one side, and an arena on the other. It's like there's 2 different games in NA rn and no one knows wtf this game is suppose to be.

The devs lost me when they spent weeks interacting on the great merge and other more trivial changes.  Then put PvP marks back in without a word or asking for anyone's opinion.  These guys are clueless and have been for so long I do not expect it to change.

The game will be NA legends.  This game will sink to the bottom of the sea.

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2 hours ago, Bearwall said:

 

PvP is as broken as the economy. Go wait in a greenzone for someone to build enough of a ganking fleet to try to kill you, then wait for them to build up the courage to tag you and then kill them all because they are still thinking their ships are actually worth something. Remove the PvP marks entirely - make it all playercrafted or storebought. 

And remove the greenzones, reinforcementzones etc. - it is a PvP server and there are still, a PvE server.

This is why I have and always will say that OW needs development. Pvp missions, raids, anything. The devs wanted to move PVP from capital areas and put it in freetowns. I'm telling you that's not a PVP focal point. No one wants to fight for nothing over nothing with random nations. This isn't Naval Duels, its Naval Action, we want OW PVP with RVR undertones. AKA if I want to go raid an enemies coast there should be real consequences to either economy, production or military strength. This needs to happen WITHOUT relying on other players. 

Why? Because as we saw before and as we still see now PVPers go where they know the best chance to find enemies. No one wants to trot on the sea for an hour looking for a lone ship. We want objectives, missions, quest, and we want to feel the weight of those things. You know what the only that that gives you that that ISN'T PBs?

Capital blockading.

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4 hours ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

Killing traders doesn't deserve a PVP reward.  It isn't PVP to club seals.  

Agree No PVP marks for traders just the XP. Unless you have 5 knowledge slots open as well dont bother as you will get outsailed and hit by those already loaded with the pvp rewards. Those players are just getting stronger and the gap is widening.

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2 hours ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

The point is it doesn't deserve "PVP" rewards.  You are welcome to capture the cargo and ship. We need to encourage people to fight actual warships, not get free marks by farming snows and trader brigs.

 

What about the people that hunt in "Traders"?
I can show many many screenshots of myself and friends getting significant kills (4th rates, even a few 3rd and 2nd) in the LGV, Pirate LGV, and even Traders Snow. 

What if people hunted more often in those ships, and then when someone finally manages to kill them, they don't get any PvP marks.. Would be frustrating if it was me. 

Also, I'd like to point out that using PvP marks to craft ships is much more expensive than crafting it with normal materials. Today I gathered 50+ marks, so yes it would be easy for me to buy a Bellona note, but those 30 PvP marks could also be sold for 7-10 mil in cash. Thats an expensive Bellona. Most people won't use this method, but people that actively PvP will be able to. 

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Motivation to do PvP?

Only motivation we need to do PvP is as follows. 

1) #MakeAllUpgradesCraftable 2) #NoModStacking 3) #RemoveSafeZones

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14 minutes ago, EliteDelta said:

Also, I'd like to point out that using PvP marks to craft ships is much more expensive than crafting it with normal materials. Today I gathered 50+ marks, so yes it would be easy for me to buy a Bellona note, but those 30 PvP marks could also be sold for 7-10 mil in cash. Thats an expensive Bellona. Most people won't use this method, but people that actively PvP will be able to. 

That's relative. Look at the top of the leaderboard, those people getting 100+ marks a day. At that point you're basically beyond the MMO aspect. You're completely self sufficient and outside factors like ports, nation income and economic strangle don't affect you.

The strong get stronger, the weak get weaker. No wonder we need safezones. You'd gank the people still crafting into nonexistence.

Edited by Slim Jimmerson

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16 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

That's relative. Look at the top of the leaderboard, those people getting 100+ marks a day. At that point you're basically beyond the MMO aspect. You're completely self sufficient and outside factors like ports, nation income and economic strangle don't affect you.

The strong get stronger, the weak get weaker. No wonder we need safezones. You'd gank the people still crafting into nonexistence.

I don't understand your argument. 

I would say the strong get to be self sufficient, and everyone else stays the same..  The safezone means it is always possible to craft ships with no risk, unless you play for a hardcore nation.
The only problem I have with the PvP rewards is that the Wasa is still massively OP. If it would finally be tuned, then there would be no problem in my eyes. 

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1 hour ago, EliteDelta said:

What about the people that hunt in "Traders"?
I can show many many screenshots of myself and friends getting significant kills (4th rates, even a few 3rd and 2nd) in the LGV, Pirate LGV, and even Traders Snow. 
 

Sounds interesting  :D  I've been curious about modding the LGV for offensive use since they are so easy to capture in large numbers and have a decent number of crew, and I remember the Trader Snow can put a hurt on little ships attacking it. 

 

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3 minutes ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

Sounds interesting  :D  I've been curious about modding the LGV for offensive use since they are so easy to capture in large numbers and have a decent number of crew, and I remember the Trader Snow can put a hurt on little ships attacking it. 

 

They can be potent adversaries when handled correctly. 

Also if they didn't give PvP marks when killed, I imagine that would give defenders less incentive to hunt down someone marauding their coast line. Yes they may be killing other people, but how many players would want to spent the time hunting one of these ships down, if they don't get much of a reward for it. 

I just want everyone to think about the ramifications of removing traders from giving these marks, I personally don't even attack traders very often, I typically look for warships :)

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5 minutes ago, EliteDelta said:

They can be potent adversaries when handled correctly.

 

It depends entirely on what is attacking it, but the LGV is a turd at turning and doesn't have many guns.  It looks large from the deck of a brig, and soft and yummy from the deck of a surprise.

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#WeNeedDuelRoomBack #WeWantMoreCompetiveTargets

The difference in skill, especially with the new sailing profiles got really large.
On top of that, one of the strongest PvP ships and the best modules are only available for those who know how to win anyway.
Duel Rooms would help getting a least the basic skill sets without getting demotivated before you ever reach a level you get an chance to compete.

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