On PVE server, NPC ships and fleets should, by option, be able to ATTACK YOU

[Cetric de Cornusiac]

I understand the value of the PVE server for beginners to feel safe and make their experiences with everything.

However, once you feel a bit advanced and still don't want to move over to PVP, you should be given an option which teaches you more respect of NPC fleets nearby.

As it is now, you can completely ignore them and crossing course with them with no fear whatsoever, no matter how strong the task group is and how weak you are.

I wish I would have to avoid them.

Make it so, that when starting a game or when organizing the game options, players can chose if NPC ships can attack them or not.

I don't think this is much of a programming effort, as there is already an AI directing NPC ships in battle when you attack them. However, the feeling of a real open world is much better if you have to watch out for stronger opponents and avoid them if possible. This does not mean ALL NPC ships will ALWAYS attack you. AI needs to compare strengths and battle ratings and decide on those grounds if it should dare fight or not. So you won't get attacked with your frigate all the time by tiny Lynxes seeking suicide.

No frustration potential, because if you find it too hard to sail in an open world with aggressive superior NPC fleets, you simply uncheck their battle initiation capability in your options and you are safe as before.

[LeBoiteux]

Once upon a time... a long time ago... there was AI aggressiveness.

Its coming-back was (is ?) expected.

 

 

Edited January 12, 2018 by LeBoiteux

[Haratik]

8 hours ago, LeBoiteux said:

Once upon a time... a long time ago... there was AI aggressiveness.

Its coming-back was (is ?) expected.

 

 

 

6 hours ago, Coraline Vodka said:

They mentioned it coming back but it would be pretty lame

 

Meanwhile in another universe, not so far away, this still happens!

[z4ys]

For a PVE sever it would be nice. On pvp not really.

[Sunleader]

Why do I have the Feeling that you in essence just want to Force People to Switch over to the PvP Server......

 

And No.

Sorry but NPC Aggressiveness is simply annoying. And would result in the Game being a Pain.

 

Most PvE Players moved away from the PvP Server because the Constant Ganking Annoyed them so much that the Game was no longer Fun to them.

So the last thing they want is to now be Annoyed by NPC Gankers.

 

If you want Aggressive NPCs feel free to Suggest them for the PvP Server.

The PvE Server does not want them.

[z4ys]

2 hours ago, Sunleader said:

 So the last thing they want is to now be Annoyed by NPC Gankers.

AI gankers. You made my day

[Sunleader]

3 hours ago, z4ys said:

AI gankers. You made my day

Well Mate.

I dont know if you Checked the Fleets Driving around there *gg*

But if your in a 2nd Rate and get Jumped by an NPC Fleet with 6x 3rd Rates and 6-10x Frigates I would call this Ganking

 

TLDR.

Pls keep your PvP Suggestions on the PvP Server.

As Part of the PvE Server Community I can Guarantee you we are not Interested in you trying to Ruin our Server.

[Cetric de Cornusiac]

12 hours ago, Sunleader said:

Why do I have the Feeling that you in essence just want to Force People to Switch over to the PvP Server......

And No.

Sorry but NPC Aggressiveness is simply annoying. And would result in the Game being a Pain.

Most PvE Players moved away from the PvP Server because the Constant Ganking Annoyed them so much that the Game was no longer Fun to them.

So the last thing they want is to now be Annoyed by NPC Gankers.

If you want Aggressive NPCs feel free to Suggest them for the PvP Server.

The PvE Server does not want them.

So you speak for the whole PVE server? Of whom I am a member as well, and I assure you, you don't speak for me.

Actually your chain shot goes straight into the water, because you missed the fact I spoke about an option for PVE players.

Meaning, who wants to stay safe in a disney-kind of fluffy pinky parallel world where "enemy" fleets wave friendly at you and look on while you pass right before the nozzles of their gun decks with an inferior vessel, can do so all the time to his liking.

You switch AI attacking you on and off, also to your liking. That's my vision and I like it. You evade stronger fleets or risk getting chased. It's simply essential for the credibility of such open world where every other nation is your enemy except the 'neutral' ports. You learn even better to survive this way for the day you want to fight human players on PVP.

[Sunleader]

1 hour ago, Cetric de Cornusiac said:

So you speak for the whole PVE server? Of whom I am a member as well, and I assure you, you don't speak for me.

Actually your chain shot goes straight into the water, because you missed the fact I spoke about an option for PVE players.

Meaning, who wants to stay safe in a disney-kind of fluffy pinky parallel world where "enemy" fleets wave friendly at you and look on while you pass right before the nozzles of their gun decks with an inferior vessel, can do so all the time to his liking.

You switch AI attacking you on and off, also to your liking. That's my vision and I like it. You evade stronger fleets or risk getting chased. It's simply essential for the credibility of such open world where every other nation is your enemy except the 'neutral' ports. You learn even better to survive this way for the day you want to fight human players on PVP.

 

Mate no Offense.

But you can Stick in your Insults right back into that Hole in your Rear where they came from.

Your absolutely and clearly not someone on the PvE Server. I never saw or Read you there. And the way you Talk proves beyond doubt that your an PvP Player who consider the PvE Server an Hindrance.

 

So again. Feel Free to Suggest this Rubbish for PvP Server. But stop with the meaningless attempt to Force People over to PvP Server.

[Cetric de Cornusiac]

Suppose I have to knock on your cabin door and announce my presence on PVE server each time, as you see yourself as the king of PVE? Otherwise I am not participating rightfully on your holy realm?

Sorry but I have to laugh at your funny presumption. Even more so as you have not been "insulted" anywhere, just shown you missed the crucial point.

But relax, even when my suggestion becomes true, you are still safe from me on PVE, as I don't see how I could disguise myself as a NPC ship.

Edited January 14, 2018 by Cetric de Cornusiac

[Sunleader]

5 hours ago, Cetric de Cornusiac said:

Suppose I have to knock on your cabin door and announce my presence on PVE server each time, as you see yourself as the king of PVE? Otherwise I am not participating rightfully on your holy realm?

Sorry but I have to laugh at your funny presumption. Even more so as you have not been "insulted" anywhere, just shown you missed the crucial point.

But relax, even when my suggestion becomes true, you are still safe from me on PVE, as I don't see how I could disguise myself as a NPC ship.

 

[GrubbyZebra]

Just move to the pvp server.

[Norfolk nChance]

@Cetric de Cornusiac

 

Originally [ELITE] started on PvE and I felt quite strongly on parts of AI aggression in regards to the server. In particular I wanted the Smuggler Flag to actually mean something. You use it and if a Patrol AI fleet coming within a certain range would go for you.

At the time @Ink was quite adamant PvE is PvE only with no duels or FORCING a player into any form of combat they do not wish to do. This extended out to Co-Op attacking AI fleets. Only the EPICs and Fleet Missions were Co-Op. Passive.

I argued that by the very nature of ticking the smuggler flag box you are willing to expose yourself to risk. This just wasn’t going to sway. The AI was tweaked up in EPICs etc but that was it.

Difficult to program…?

The programming effort you mention I was also told would be a nightmare. Right now, in OW you drop into a smaller BOXED universe or BATTLE screen, just five square miles. This gives the AI logic parameters to work within tactically and aggressively.

For the AI to attack you in OW its reference world is the Caribbean or at least its Patrol Area. Think about K/PR to Port Antonio and back is a massive area. This the AI would need to calculate constantly. So was told be impractical to implement. This might have changed now…

The EPICs now are VERY aggressive AI bots…

The PvE server has huge un-tapped potential in my opinion. The EPICs are a challenge indeed. I’d like to see some roving AI Black Beard Pirate fleet that you can attack. Port Battles and the list goes on. Too many PvPer are quick to dismiss PvE or Care Bears and like wise PvE dread the thought of PvP. Its just a different style of play, and I can talk from both Camps.

But the over all view is “PvE is PvE you cannot force any player into any form of combat they do not wish to do”. This means AI aggression can and only be triggered by a “Drop-In” scenario and not an AI forced attacked. This I don't agree with.

 

 Norfolk.

[Cetric de Cornusiac]

On 16.1.2018 at 7:24 PM, Norfolk nChance said:

For the AI to attack you in OW its reference world is the Caribbean or at least its Patrol Area. Think about K/PR to Port Antonio and back is a massive area. This the AI would need to calculate constantly. So was told be impractical to implement. This might have changed now…

I imagine the AI fleets or single ships will have a couple of preset behaviors, some of them chosen by chance (so it does not become too predictable).

-1- First and most important, they compare your strength against theirs. They won't attack when you are stronger. Or there is a very small chance (this simulates a stupid captain or over-ambitious zealot), they will attack anyway. After all, history is full of mistakes.

-2- I imagine AI fleet will not chase you all over the whole map as you indicated. Parameters will determine how long the chase run will last (simulating patience of that NPC captain or his resolution, his other plans he has to pursue and don't allow him to play with an opportunity target like your ship for too long). They could try to overtake you for a certain distance like a dozen km only, for half a day, or whole day, or (rarely) endlessly. Depends what the program choses as behavior pattern for this singular event. Of course every chase would stop under the gun nozzles of your nation's port defenses. And there you'd be safe. I am not thinking of more elaborate behavior like waiting in an ambush until you come out again of that port. That goes too far.

-3- So that limits the calculation efforts for AI. No calculation as long as you don't get into range for identification and battle rating comparison. Limited calculation for the time the AI captain keeps interested in running after you. Ceases with calculation the moment he gives up.

-4- All other calculation, about the behavior inside battle instance itself, is already present as it is used when you attack NPC fleets all the time.

[maturin]

This was removed because the AI doesn't know how to chase, making it something of a fake feature.

Also then we'd have to reckon with the fleet of 3 Pirate SoLs and swarm of smaller ships that for some reason tries to dock at Port Royal every morning.

[Norfolk nChance]

@Cetric de Cornusiac

 

Has @maturin said the AI found it difficult to chase.

Your idea…

In practice Pre-set behavior triggers on the PCs condition or level again means a circle of influence continually assessed on the AIs patrol. This I believe would be a data crush continually “packeting” back and forth from server to clients. This multiplied by all AI fleets...

I would like to learn or know more on how the battle AI is written. Great topic, I use algos for work in finance and their behavior analysis is fascinating.

The idea I wanted above the roaming Black Beard fleet needs you and friends to attack it still, but having it attack openly would be funny but I doubt the PvE guys would like it…

 

Norfolk,