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Masts made of glass?


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Hats off to the Developers for wind and leeway mechanics. I think this has helped to slow down rage boarding that would end a battle in 90 seconds. All recent changes have been great improvements to the realism of the game and gameplay mechanics!

Sometime ago the developers introduced demasting which was very easy. It was unpopular and unrealistic and and so they made necessary tweaks which perfected it. But for some reason we went back to the old system of "Toothpick thin masts". I don't understand why we went back. Is there a better solution than keeping the current mechanic?. Would it be possible to cause the sales to stick in a tacked position (like a damaged rudder)?

There are very few flaws left in the game PVP wise but this is definitely one of them in my opinion

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19 minutes ago, Odol said:

Well there is your trade off.  Go fast and be fragile, or go slower and survivable. 

Life is full of choices.... 

It's not about survivability. It's about a game of demasting you don't have to sink, grape ,chain or board you just demast then do whatever from there. Was in a battle the other night in an oak frigate and got demasted by a fir endy before I could sink it. Now I did have his hull down to nothing.... That was through skill his demasting is through flawed game mechanic. He didn't even try to cover his Stern. He did not even try to avoid getting broadsided. He sailed without a care in the world because he knew he could take out my masts. 

 

Edited by Sea Fox
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10 minutes ago, Batman said:

Elite French Rig + Winged Out Ballast gives you 25% thickness + 36% Mast HP without any speed penalty.

Thank you. I have winged out ballast book (although I'm not sure if it's available on all ships) and as far as mods go, I like them. I'm all for mods. But they should be there to help in one way or another they shouldn't be nessecary to overcome a broken mechanic...(also they are rediculously over priced and way too hard to get)

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2 hours ago, AeRoTR said:

I do not think it as realistic. Imagine 6 vs 6 ship combat, everyone shooting at the masts :) . I do not think this would be the real deal back in time.

When we are growing up we accumulate brain patterns. Patterns that we like and recognize and if something does not fit the pattern we think that something is wrong.

But in this case your brain pattern is wrong. Somewhere in the past you read something or played something where ships only shot at hull and that was it. Maybe it was total war or age of sail 2 where they had minimal demasting due to old tech and conservation of fps. That pattern stays and its hard to defeat it. But with time it will change. Like accepting the fact that age of sail ships could sail backwards. Or accepting demasting as one of the key tactics (which could be countered)

Demasting was one of the main tactics
from small action 
a64MKC7.jpg

to large 50-60 ship battles
Fd9R4pH.jpg

 

We have no desire to fight with your brain pattern, but please STOP posting your ideals as facts.

  • Say it as it is: you hate (dont like) demasting, 
  • dont say its unrealistic and it never happened.

ps

You can counter demasting making it impossible, but you dont want it, because of that brain pattern. Learn to overcome it Captain and you will do better. Equip upgrades to masts, speed does not matter since couple of last patches. 4 mast upgrades slow you down but make demasting impossible, you will enjoy those battles immensely - laughing when enemies spend half an hour trying to get your masts down while you sink them all. 

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Gotta agree with admin here. Yes 32s and 42s and deadly against most ships mast, but frigate v frigate a few buffs will render your mast pretty sturdy. Demasting only goes so far, I'd like to see an example of someone getting canoe'd in an even fight before having any chance to respond. Until then demasting is in a pretty good place imo.

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Dear @admin,

15-20 charged shots is enough to take a mast atm.  Less than a full deck.

For example Bellona:

Has 2 decks of cannons that can penetrate bottom section of 4th rates mast.

56 cannons, charged damage 45 on average?

Miss rate 33% = 40 cannons will hit.

40*45 = 1800 mast sniping damage from one broadside.

Miss rate 50% = 28 * 45 =  1260 dmg

A good mast sniper will take 2 masts with one broadside of charged shots?  Am I calculating this correctly?  (Are good snipers even better?)

This kind of accuracy has been achieved in your pictures?  Were they shooting more than one broadside?  Were they sniping?

With hull you took more arcade point of view, we have all protecting hull sides.  You are not balancing the rest with this.  If masts go down in 5-10 minutes and shooting at hull does nothing...  I really dont know what the F you are thinking?

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8 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said:

Dear @admin,

15-20 charged shots is enough to take a mast atm.  Less than a full deck.

 

we are not saying demasting is fully balanced. In previous post we just responded to captains who claimed that demasting is unrealistic and not historical (never happened)

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Remember what happened when we had crew & cannon damage from hull side hits?  It did not really matter were you stern raking or sniping masts, it was deadly to sail a side and have a faster reload time than your enemy.  Then just hammer s out from your enemy.  Sounds like a war winning tactic?

Doubling is a real naval tactic if I remember correctly.  This does not really work like it did IRL.  Hard to make working with 0 "internal" damage. Side internal damage will make community unhappy, so probably making masts to have equally arcade damage model than sides would be better.  Stern crew damage should follow the same arcadeness btw.

Accuracy and mast hp have similar effect btw.  Also not sure how big hit box ball and masts have, are those realistic? If you make hitboxes smaller you basically decrease accuracy and may fix everything by just doing that.

You could also consider this..  Further from mast hitbox center balls hit, less damage those do.

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1 hour ago, admin said:

You can counter demasting making it impossible, but you dont want it, because of that brain pattern. Learn to overcome it Captain and you will do better. Equip upgrades to masts, speed does not matter since couple of last patches. 4 mast upgrades slow you down but make demasting impossible, you will enjoy those battles immensely - laughing when enemies spend half an hour trying to get your masts down while you sink them all. 

Fantasy. With a ship that slow (all 4 mast mods), you lose most maneuverability. A nimble surprise wont need to crack your mast. It can just stern camp and kill crew. Boom...mast upgrade become worthless. I really think masts need to be strengthened a bit where 1, maybe 2 mast mods are sufficient - instead of needing 4.

Edited by Guest
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1 hour ago, admin said:

When we are growing up we accumulate brain patterns. Patterns that we like and recognize and if something does not fit the pattern we think that something is wrong.

But in this case your brain pattern is wrong. Somewhere in the past you read something or played something where ships only shot at hull and that was it. Maybe it was total war or age of sail 2 where they had minimal demasting due to old tech and conservation of fps. That pattern stays and its hard to defeat it. But with time it will change. Like accepting the fact that age of sail ships could sail backwards. Or accepting demasting as one of the key tactics (which could be countered)

Demasting was one of the main tactics
from small action 
a64MKC7.jpg

to large 50-60 ship battles
Fd9R4pH.jpg

 

We have no desire to fight with your brain pattern, but please STOP posting your ideals as facts.

  • Say it as it is: you hate (dont like) demasting, 
  • dont say its unrealistic and it never happened.

ps

You can counter demasting making it impossible, but you dont want it, because of that brain pattern. Learn to overcome it Captain and you will do better. Equip upgrades to masts, speed does not matter since couple of last patches. 4 mast upgrades slow you down but make demasting impossible, you will enjoy those battles immensely - laughing when enemies spend half an hour trying to get your masts down while you sink them all. 

Although I feel I must add that speed does matter because otherwise you will never catch anyone to have a battle with.

Or you sit outside a capital in your big fat mast modded, pen modded , carta equipped ship and wait and hope.

Just sayin.

Edited by Tac
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37 minutes ago, Tac said:

Although I feel I must add that speed does matter because otherwise you will never catch anyone to have a battle with.

 

It is different now - you can debuff the speed through structure, its easier and more effective than mast shooting. Lose half structure and you lose up to 70% speed ;)

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As someone else said in another thread, gun accuracy is the issue, not the damage they do or the thickness of masts.  Right now we have guns that can be fired like they are being shot out of a gun on the Leopard 2E tank.

 

Most masts fell back in the day due to stays and lines being shot out, not to direct mast hits.   Hence why chain and bar shot was so dangerous.   The French would intentionally give up the wind t get elevation to fire into the masts and rigging of the enemy ship.   

Right now you dont need to give up the wind to shoot up into the rigging of another ship.  You you dont have to use battle sails because ships are to stable at full sails and the damage done to the masts under full sail is the same as the damage done under battle sails. 

 

My suggestion is reduced damage to masts or increased resistance to masts while at battle sails.

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