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Mr. Doran

Alternative to Cannon Grind

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20 hours ago, Norfolk nChance said:

@Mr. Doran

 

The Newbie can easily get lost into thinking he’s no chance because of the small starter guns. This is simply NOT true but hard to believe. It needs one of you guys to write a good beginners PvP guide.

You lie to yourself or do not understand the full extent of the disparity between the lowest and highest caliber guns. For the stock player to have a chance you are gambling on him consistently running into the most ass backwards incompetent players possible to have any chance in hell. Imagine a world in which you are forced to fight me and me only in a Con; you have 12s I have 24s. Every time you launch NAL I am waiting for you and every time you que I am the only person you fight. You crunch the numbers for yourself of how long you are going to be able to tolerate that. Imagine an alternative situation where you are qued against the best three players in the game every time all the time; your team is all stock while your opposition is grinded out. If you say the following situations of encountering the cream of the crop on such a regular basis is too statistically unlikely for such situations to ever be relevant then you acknowledge the fact you have to be fighting complete idiots to stand any legitimate chance with stock cannon. 

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Doesn't need to go into extremes. Best players, most incompetent players...

 

If we acknowledge underpoundage (is a word now) gets you to learn, that is still a problem. Guys in 24pd connies already learned. The playground is flat after that, the learning factor has no impact. Mathematically.

 

For "gun grind makes you learn" to be a balancing factor, you would need to unlearn whenever you move up. You dont. Guys with bigger guns learned too.

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@Mr. Doran

I believe my understanding the gun caliber disparity within the game is much better than most in my humble opinion. Every time I board a 24s Connie in my 12s still produces results more to my favor good bad or even a simple AI opponent. You are correct though I’m not the average Joe and a newbie wouldn’t pull this off against a good 24s user.

Using extreme grade-A opponents facing every time yes will skew anybody’s BATTLE log however unlikely the continuance happens. This again is just my personal observation and experience. This more likely if it (the game) became very popular for a good length of time?

The few alternatives offered here am not sure will solve or improve the grind that much better unfortunately. Tweaking is needed but I’m not sure really in all honesty what to tweak and by how much?

 

The “Gun Grind” doesn’t make you learn how to PvP better. I never said that @Galileus please re-read my post again. I may have not made that point clear enough but definitely never implied it, my bad.

It just seemed to “home in” or improve on my gameplay. This is what I’ve noticed from my experience when moving up the boat ladder into the gun grind…

This is why a beginner PvP Guide you may wish to write to help out disillusioned newbies when and if they start playing. Essential for the very early Cutter Brig N-Brig stages…

Edited by Norfolk nChance

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On 1/20/2018 at 7:58 PM, Norfolk nChance said:

(...) NA-L has definitely improved my PvP skills.

The gun grind actually improved my play. (...)

Starting with a weaker loadout made me focus more (...)

(...) but this Gun Grind helped tighten up my (...) technique

(...) If I could have had my desired loadouts from the start I definitely wouldn’t have improved as much as I have… 

 

13 hours ago, Norfolk nChance said:

The “Gun Grind” doesn’t make you learn how to PvP better. I never said that @Galileus please re-read my post again. I may have not made that point clear enough but definitely never implied it, my bad.

 

Yeah, I'm lost ^^' Sorry

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I can see where my poorly worded script implied the PvP learning… hands up

It improved upon my skills already in place. If taken from a new starter point of view, I don’t think it would have had the same effect. Sort of the reason for the PvP guide hint for beginners.

if that makes sense?

 

 

Edited by Norfolk nChance

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10 hours ago, Norfolk nChance said:

I can see where my poorly worded script implied the PvP learning… hands up

It improved upon my skills already in place. If taken from a new starter point of view, I don’t think it would have had the same effect. Sort of the reason for the PvP guide hint for beginners.

if that makes sense?

 

 

Shouldn't need a player made guide just to explain the game to new players, it should be built into the game play on how do i sail X ship or in a detailed encyclopedia that explains it in a simple terms for people not familiar with all the terms used in sail ships. 

But its the same as that tank game, you have no chance really until your gun is upgraded also players target the stock players more cause free easy kills.

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12 hours ago, Norfolk nChance said:

if that makes sense?

 

Yes, now I get it. Thanks for clarification!

2 hours ago, ironhammer500 said:

Shouldn't need a player made guide just to explain the game to new players, it should be built into the game play on how do i sail X ship or in a detailed encyclopedia that explains it in a simple terms for people not familiar with all the terms used in sail ships. 

 

It's EA.

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17 hours ago, Galileus said:

 

 

 

It's EA.

That excuse doesn't wash with customers anymore, people have gotten wise to this "Oh is EA" bs line for how long stuff takes or why stuff is missing, How long is ea going to last? 1 Year? 2 Years?

Also cant really call it EA once you bring in Micro transactions, by then its a sold product so then you must convince people its worth buying, if new players are just thrown into the game without help and have to self source it on forums they probably dont know exist then your player base will die out very fast.

 

Has the devs not learnt anything from the mistakes with Naval action?

The biggest killer of Naval action is the basic UI and lack of information in game no tutorials or nothing to help new players understand the game mechanics its just trial and error. UI been promised ever since NA was brought to steam and nothing have changed ill admit there has been a few nice changes but the basic shipyard UI puts people off the game.

Presentation is key if you have the basic place holder UI for dev purposes then people will think the game is not finished or still basic.

Edited by ironhammer500

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You are not a customer. You did not buy NAL, you got invited.

 

Yes, you can call EA an EA when it has microtransactions. Its a shitty EA, and its an EA still. Why the hell wouldnt it be?

 

There are no new players. Its a closed EA.

 

This game is not finished.

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18 hours ago, Galileus said:

You are not a customer. You did not buy NAL, you got invited.

 

Yes, you can call EA an EA when it has microtransactions. Its a shitty EA, and its an EA still. Why the hell wouldnt it be?

 

There are no new players. Its a closed EA.

 

This game is not finished.

I bought Naval Action and as a concerned customer im wonder where has the extra money and time go into investment of this game and would that of been better time and money invested into making Naval action better.

To be invited i have to of bought the game, lets not kid our selves here this is sort of a expansion or spin off game.

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4 minutes ago, ironhammer500 said:

I bought Naval Action and as a concerned customer im wonder where has the extra money and time go into investment of this game and would that of been better time and money invested into making Naval action better.

To be invited i have to of bought the game, lets not kid our selves here this is sort of a expansion or spin off game.

Yea I always thought NA-L was a expansion of sorts, but now to much of a deference between sailing in NA-Ow and NA-L. 

They not spent much time on this at all,  maybe 1 or 2 people a few hours a week.  The game has so much going for it. NA-OW or NA-L.  Just to many trolls in forums or forum whores that got them off track. Maybe they can fix it maybe not.

I been beta testing Skull and Bones for last 3/4 weeks.  They ask me to join them to do some testing never even heard of game before hand.  Granted its got bugs and a lot of them,  but my main (only reason) I joined the beta, was the forums are not full of cry baby's or Whiners. 

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2 hours ago, JobaSet said:

but now to much of a deference between sailing in NA-Ow and NA-L. 

Won't stay like that for long.

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2 hours ago, jodgi said:

Won't stay like that for long.

How long is long? 1 year? 2 Years, i think the sting of failed promises from naval action has left many of us skeptical of promises now. Not saying i want the game to fail, i love this game i just wish they would do more and listen to us.

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5 hours ago, ironhammer500 said:

How long is long? 1 year? 2 Years, i think the sting of failed promises from naval action has left many of us skeptical of promises now. Not saying i want the game to fail, i love this game i just wish they would do more and listen to us.

 

"I bought an EA and it went a different way than what I wanted, so now Im going to be grumpy and act betrayed"

 

And just to clarify, I'm disappointed in what NA turned into as well. But hey, I bought an EA and it went a different way than what I wanted, so...

Edited by Galileus

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2 hours ago, Galileus said:

 

"I bought an EA and it went a different way than what I wanted, so now Im going to be grumpy and act betrayed"

 

And just to clarify, I'm disappointed in what NA turned into as well. But hey, I bought an EA and it went a different way than what I wanted, so...

Reason many of us are annoyed and disappointed is this game took time and money from Naval action and gave us something that really feels just tacked on like it should be a mode in Naval action. Im not being grumpy just trying to give feedback and what i feel, but i your view is me being grumpy then i think you need to step down from testing as your not going to pass on constructive feedback. Also i know your one of the "hardcore" types who prefer the struggle, while im more concerned about what people would think if the game came out on steam today.

Edited by ironhammer500

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3 hours ago, ironhammer500 said:

while im more concerned about what people would think if the game came out on steam today.

Well, there it is! That's why it's not freely available on steam today.

11 hours ago, ironhammer500 said:

How long is long? 1 year? 2 Years

They planned to do it this month, it's prolly been pushed a bit as the implementation isn't complete in OW yet. In any case you may think in terms of weeks rather than years.

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I was just told to "step down from testing due to lack of constructive feedback" by a guy whose feedback is "why u take our NA:OW money!", "I feel betrayed and don't believe your promises" and "I wish they listened more". Which, let me explain - as my ability to believe in the alleged intelligence of human race is hurting now - is a feedback based on emotion, lack of knowledge and insight and generally the very opposite of constructive.

 

So yeah, im disappointed in how OW turned out. Sucks to be me, but I knew this is something that can happen when I signed in. There was no foul play, there was nothing to call out "broken promises", the game just went a different way than what I would want. Happens. Might be sour, but there is no bad blood. For what GL presented, I have trust in their ability to present solid mechanics and their implementation. Ain't calling names or pulling betrayal screams outta my bag.

 

Especially since one of the very first things they clarified is that NAL does not pull resources from NA:OW. Which is the no-foul consideration I needed. Studios work on multiple games, is what is.

 

And when it comes to NAL? I might be weary, was burned once expecting something else (again - my own fault, that), and with free invite I have no reason to stress over it. NAL is something I might be very interested in, depending on how it shapes out to be, so I take my time, keep my distance and engage in discussions where there is actual discussion. What I do not do is call out my distrust, do not scream "mistakes were made!", do not raise fires over things that are to be expected of EA - because I expected them when coming in. I do not dictate priorities, I do not pretend this is something I am entitled to shape, I mostly just bash assholes who do. Take my time, see how it shapes up.

 

Because if I felt like doing all that? Was the "perfect tester", har har, feeling like screaming how I don't like everything about the dev cycle, how I mistrust the devs, how A should be done now now NOW because reasons or fail? If I felt anything like that, I wouldn't be here in the first place.

Edited by Galileus
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Its your attitude, you have been steering this Naval action in the wrong direction, you also instantly hostile to anyone who doesn't agree with you, case point your post. How can we provide feedback when your instantly taking it as a negative and then being hostile towards that person instead of constructive.

 

Back on topic, hopefully in the next month a cannon grind change could be put into testing, something like modded cannons to unlock but you start with basic cannons that are the max equipped size, I.E Connie has 24s not 12s as stock but can get modded guns like Pellew sighted cannons or any other modded tech that improved cannons that is historical, i know there is tons of different ways people tweaked cannons to improve on the classic design.

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On 1/26/2018 at 5:29 PM, jodgi said:

Won't stay like that for long.

Going on a month now since last patch.  They also have 2 games that will compete against them this coming Fall.  Should be very interesting how it plays out. 

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