A few suggestions, almost got it devs... almost.

[Hodo]

Ok with the new sail physics plan going in, this is good... now to fix other issues.

First, no need to increase the thickness or hit points on the masts, just decrease the accuracy of all of the guns.   Currently you can get that accuracy down to the accuracy of a M256 on the M1A1 Abrams... and that is stupid for smooth bore ball shots fit in the barrels with wadding.

 

Next for the sails, or sailing, is fix the crew requirements for sail crews.  If you are sailing around at full sails you need a FULL sailing crew.   Thus more of your men are on deck, and exposed to incoming shots, higher crew casualties.  A deck sweep with grape would be devastating to a ship with full sails going. 

 

Now with that said, you will now have more uses for battle sails and other sail settings as it would reduce the amount of crew on deck.  

 

Lastly.... repairs and rum.

Repairs should be VERY crew intensive.  You pop a repair, 90% of your crew should be on that task, and during this time crew damage should be doubled.   Rum should not restore 100% of losses, at best it should be 50%.  It is meant to get you able to get out of the fight, not stay in the fight forever. 

[Custard]

Accuracy and sailing = spot on

Repairing - I am unsure

Need balance between realism and gameplay, I am not the best judge of this 

[TheHaney]

Is there currently a mechanic that redistributes crew "hit boxes"? It sounds like that's what you're asking for in regard to sailing.

I definitely agree with making guns less accurate but the degree to which that is done would drastically affect the usefulness of long guns compared to medium/carro so I'd hope to see a crew requirement reduction for them.

I'm still in the camp that in-battle repairs should just be done away with entirely, or limited to one use.

[DeRuyter]

There were good reasons ships did not normally go into battle under full sail. Battle sails were the easiest sails to trim when most of your crew was on the guns being one of them. @Hodo suggestion is a good one.

Add in weather effects and you'd have another reason not to sail around at full sails depending on the ship ofc. Heeling would have a more detrimental effect on shooting when at full sail.

I am for limited repairs.

[George Washington]

20 minutes ago, Hodo said:

Ok with the new sail physics plan going in, this is good... now to fix other issues.

First, no need to increase the thickness or hit points on the masts, just decrease the accuracy of all of the guns.   Currently you can get that accuracy down to the accuracy of a M256 on the M1A1 Abrams... and that is stupid for smooth bore ball shots fit in the barrels with wadding.

 

Next for the sails, or sailing, is fix the crew requirements for sail crews.  If you are sailing around at full sails you need a FULL sailing crew.   Thus more of your men are on deck, and exposed to incoming shots, higher crew casualties.  A deck sweep with grape would be devastating to a ship with full sails going. 

 

Now with that said, you will now have more uses for battle sails and other sail settings as it would reduce the amount of crew on deck.  

 

Lastly.... repairs and rum.

Repairs should be VERY crew intensive.  You pop a repair, 90% of your crew should be on that task, and during this time crew damage should be doubled.   Rum should not restore 100% of losses, at best it should be 50%.  It is meant to get you able to get out of the fight, not stay in the fight forever. 

90% crew? Jesus. What did I pay my carpenters for? Fk it, marines get the fkn planks and start rebuilding the ship, drop your muskets and remove your red coats. All to work! You are out of balance a bit here. 

Edited November 21, 2017 by George Washington

[Hodo]

2 minutes ago, George Washington said:

90% crew? Jesus. What did I pay my carpenters for? Fk it, marines get the fkn planks and start rebuilding the ship, drop your muskets and remove your red coats. All to work! You are out of balance a bit here. 

My reasoning for the massive crew hit on repairs is to simulate you have all available hands on the task of emergency repairs.   Something like that isnt something that is normally done in combat situations.  There is usually damage control to stem leaks and fires but not rebuild the ship while it is under fire.  

So you have a choice, fix the ship OR continue to fight. 

[Jarlath Morrow]

I kind of like the idea of having repairs be more taxing, either in crew or time or both.

And maybe we can rebalance the "Survival Books" type of upgrades while we're at it. I don't think anyone uses those but it could be interesting.

[Hodo]

1 hour ago, TheHaney said:

Is there currently a mechanic that redistributes crew "hit boxes"? It sounds like that's what you're asking for in regard to sailing.

Yes there is.  It happens now when you go to prep for boarding.  It moves crew to the deck, which increases crew casualties from grape shots to the open weather deck on the ship. 

 

[Cmdr RideZ]

If rum does not fix the crew back to 100%, why repair kits should repair the ship back to 100% ?  Maybe none has to fully repair?  Repair crew requirement based on % to be fixed vs repair efficiency.

When hit with full sails, there could be a high change that sails start to burn.  Or hitting the hull could send wooden pieces to fly all over and harm your lower sails as well.  Or firing your own cannons, especially on the weather deck, could increase sail fire change.

Faster you go, less accurate your cannons are.

[Hodo]

21 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

Repair system should be, at least, a bit tweaked.

We dont need dramatic changes, just something to avoid that a captain can spam repairs in one battle.

I agree... but I do think it should be something to prevent people from trying to fight AND repair that just didnt happen.

 

[HachiRoku]

2 hours ago, Hodo said:

Currently you can get that accuracy down to the accuracy of a M256 on the M1A1 Abrams... and that is stupid for smooth bore ball shots fit in the barrels with wadding.

how is a new player going to deal with a cutter and less accurate guns. Stay in battle for 1.5 hours? Accuracy wasn't so much the guns but the rolling of the ships and that would be a pain in the ass I promise you, if they tweaked that. If anything I would say buff carros again but that is a different topic.

Edited November 21, 2017 by HachiRoku

[Hodo]

Just now, HachiRoku said:

how is a new player going to deal with a cutter and less accurate guns. Stay in battle for 1.5 hours? Accuracy wasn't so much the guns but the rolling of the ships and that would be a pain in the ass I promise you, if they tweaked that. If anything I would say buff carros again but that is a different topic.

I would make the waves a little less..... MASSIVE.   Right now we sail on "calm" seas in battle, with 7-15ft swells.   Any time I can see the keel of a 5th rate as it crests a wave, there is an issue.

The Lynx in game, should have its guns a bit higher off the water than what they are.  Right now every ship is to small for the waves we are dealing with.  Even the scale for the crew on deck is off.

In game the men loading the guns, would be about 2.2m tall if you were to compare them to the guns they are loading.  That or the ships themselves are TOO small.   Average man back then was barely 1.6-1.7m (5'4"-5'8")

[George Washington]

I think turn force should be stronger is waves are larger, and little less if sea is calm. We need weather adjustment.

Heavier seas = stronger winds = better turn force.

Edited November 21, 2017 by George Washington

[Hodo]

10 minutes ago, George Washington said:

I think turn force should be stronger is waves are larger, and little less if sea is calm. We need weather adjustment.

Heavier seas = stronger winds = better turn force.

And higher risk of capsizing the vessel while under full sail.

[Malachy]

Mast hits should not be pinpoint accuracy. In ten broadsides you should be lucky to get one or two balls to hit. Again smooth bores  on  an unsteady platform. Hitting broadsides seems pretty good right now, but demasting should be more about luck than anything else. Also chain seems way to effective as well. Drop that down to even less accuracy or less damage and I think we will be pretty close to good. 

Edited November 21, 2017 by Malachy

[Malachy]

1 hour ago, Intrepido said:

Repair system should be, at least, a bit tweaked.

We dont need dramatic changes, just something to avoid that a captain can spam repairs in one battle.

If mast hits were rare and chain severely nerfed, we probably could get by with just one sail repair. Right now rigging damage is way out of whack. Hull repairs seem to be in a good place right now. Crew damage is also way too high currently. I'm all for removing crew repair if crew damage went way down. Being able to cripple someone on one rake is bullshit imho. Rum mitigates it a little bit but crew damage is still extremely high.

Edited November 21, 2017 by Malachy

[CaptVonGunn]

3 hours ago, Hodo said:

Ok with the new sail physics plan going in, this is good... now to fix other issues.

First, no need to increase the thickness or hit points on the masts, just decrease the accuracy of all of the guns.   Currently you can get that accuracy down to the accuracy of a M256 on the M1A1 Abrams... and that is stupid for smooth bore ball shots fit in the barrels with wadding.

 

Next for the sails, or sailing, is fix the crew requirements for sail crews.  If you are sailing around at full sails you need a FULL sailing crew.   Thus more of your men are on deck, and exposed to incoming shots, higher crew casualties.  A deck sweep with grape would be devastating to a ship with full sails going. 

 

Now with that said, you will now have more uses for battle sails and other sail settings as it would reduce the amount of crew on deck.  

 

Lastly.... repairs and rum.

Repairs should be VERY crew intensive.  You pop a repair, 90% of your crew should be on that task, and during this time crew damage should be doubled.   Rum should not restore 100% of losses, at best it should be 50%.  It is meant to get you able to get out of the fight, not stay in the fight forever. 

Huh? I get the Gun and mast thing but disagree about thickness and HP.. Thickness is silly.. it should just be HP and MUCH higher combined with less accurate guns.

if your at full sail not a lot of men would be out and about.. all you would have is the ones adjusting and tweaking as the Sailing master required.. The biggest use of men in sailing is the changing of sail states... when you need men on the stays and lines every where.. Full sail should be BAD in combat.. very bad.. It should make mast damage more of a worry and should have a chance of fire from deck guns firing... If you get a Fire  from incoming fire there needs to be a increased chance of the sails catching at full sail vs Battle,.

 If your on Fire and in Fire shock the Morale of an Attacking ship trying to board you should be Awful.At the same time if you have fire ship skill and fittings on a ship you should only be allowed to have a minimum crew..(like 10% f max....) Because Fire-ships were not supposed to maneuver in combat. Saying that the entire "Survival Mode is silly" What do you think the odds are that in a fight the damage control crew are going to listen to an order to Not Put out the fire or Not plug the holes in the ship?  

 I disagree with 90% of the crew to repairs.  Maybe 30% for each type(you should be able to do both but the cool down needs to be a bit longer if you can).. the increased damage shouldn't happen unless you are repairing sail and get chained. Guys below deck plugging holes and nailing planks wouldn't be any more likely to get hurt from gun fire then gun crews would.. Now you have Hull repair going and a open stern and get raked:) that is different as those guys are not taking cover unless you hit Brace.

Mast should never be repaired fully ever best you should get is a spar as a mast with a small sail on it. Ships did not carry spare masts

 

  I think you are being overly generous with 50% on the Rum

[CaptVonGunn]

22 minutes ago, Malachy said:

If mast hits were rare and chain severely nerfed, we probably could get by with just one sail repair. Right now rigging damage is way out of whack. Hull repairs seem to be in a good place right now. Crew damage is also way too high currently. I'm all for removing crew repair if crew damage went way down. Being able to cripple someone on one rake is bullshit imho. Rum mitigates it a little bit but crew damage is still extremely high.

Huh? 1 rake could and did cripple ships

[Malachy]

4 hours ago, CaptVonGunn said:

Huh? 1 rake could and did cripple ships

It wasn't nearly so easy to get that rake. They way the sailing profiles were in game prior to today, you could rake the piss out of someone and he could do nothing to prevent it especially in bigger ships. In game raking is overpowered and needs to be toned down. No one enjoys losing on the first pass and that's what happens a lot of time in game. That rarely happened in real life. Many times battle took days to conclude and not a single rake occurred. Small ships couldn't even elevate their guns to do much damage to a ship of the line, yet in game a snow can rake 100 crew from a victory in one pass. How? A snows shots wouldn't even hit the gun deck, they would be hitting the hold. So no, the raking we have in game is not even close to realistic. 

That said, it seems right now that raking is going to be a lot harder to accomplish with the new sailing profiles. I am still testing and we won't know for sure until all the ships are upgraded, but it's looking like broadside duels may become more prevalent and raking end up something that is more of a rarity due to the fact ships turn a lot better now, so getting that good shot is going to be a lot harder. Again, we shall see. A lot of discussions here need to be shelved until we see how the new sailing profiles shake out.

  

[Yngvarr]

10 hours ago, Hodo said:

Next for the sails, or sailing, is fix the crew requirements for sail crews.  If you are sailing around at full sails you need a FULL sailing crew.   Thus more of your men are on deck, and exposed to incoming shots, higher crew casualties.  A deck sweep with grape would be devastating to a ship with full sails going.

so you mean that the number in the "Crew" box gets higher the more sails you raise?

[Hodo]

14 hours ago, CaptVonGunn said:

Huh? I get the Gun and mast thing but disagree about thickness and HP.. Thickness is silly.. it should just be HP and MUCH higher combined with less accurate guns.

if your at full sail not a lot of men would be out and about.. all you would have is the ones adjusting and tweaking as the Sailing master required.. The biggest use of men in sailing is the changing of sail states... when you need men on the stays and lines every where.. Full sail should be BAD in combat.. very bad.. It should make mast damage more of a worry and should have a chance of fire from deck guns firing... If you get a Fire  from incoming fire there needs to be a increased chance of the sails catching at full sail vs Battle,.

Mast should never be repaired fully ever best you should get is a spar as a mast with a small sail on it. Ships did not carry spare masts

Actually you do need more crew on sails with more sail being carried.   So if you have full sails on the ship, you begin to tack through the wind, you need to change all of the sail positions to do it.  You will need EVERY able bodied sailor on sails to do it, because you have on some ships, several acres of sail to move, adjust, turn and re-set the ropes.   Turning a main sail is not as easy as pulling two ropes with 2 men.  

And some ships did carry a spare mast, while not a main mast, they may have had a spare top-mast or mizzen,  just look at some of the models in game.  I think the Belle Poole is a good one, it has a few spare mast parts in it.   The Renomee is another.

8 hours ago, Yngvarr said:

so you mean that the number in the "Crew" box gets higher the more sails you raise?

Yes.  Just like when boarding prep is activated.   Normally the crew is spread out based on the crew setting and gun crew requirements.   So if you have a gun deck, and it needs 80 men and you have 100% on guns, then you will have 80 men spread out over the crew hitboxes on the gun deck.

But if you go to boarding prep, and you turn off gunnery, then you will have all 80 men move to the weather deck for boarding.  

[Lz3]

How about possibly killing crew when you shoot at sails? When increasing/decreasing sails you can kill more crew while that happens. This would prompt battle sails even more

[Hodo]

16 minutes ago, Lz3 said:

How about possibly killing crew when you shoot at sails? When increasing/decreasing sails you can kill more crew while that happens. This would prompt battle sails even more

While this is a good idea, the issue is I dont think there are any crew hitboxes in the rigging.  Then you have the added fact the really experienced captains in game dont change their sail settings that often.   I learned to stop a long time ago at full sails just by lufting my sails with the wind.

[George Washington]

19 hours ago, Hodo said:

My reasoning for the massive crew hit on repairs is to simulate you have all available hands on the task of emergency repairs.   Something like that isnt something that is normally done in combat situations.  There is usually damage control to stem leaks and fires but not rebuild the ship while it is under fire.  

So you have a choice, fix the ship OR continue to fight. 

There is a thing called get distance and repair. 

[Hodo]

22 minutes ago, George Washington said:

There is a thing called get distance and repair. 

Yes.  But that means you have to get out of effective gun range and repair.   Which can be nearly impossible if being attacked by a dedicated foe.