Jump to content
Game-Labs Forum

Recommended Posts

Whilst trying to screen at Bahia Escocesa (14/11/17) the Danish BF clan and friends avoided the Russian screening fleet by creating a fake battle with a Pirate right outside the PB port. Shortly after the PB started the Danes exited the fake battle and ran the short distance to the port to enter the PB unmolested; apart from two Danish screening Wasa's seen in first spyglass view of video who were not part of the PB fleet.

The Pirate player involved, qw569 from KIWI clan (sailing a shop bought Essex, I am sure of this because when sunk he had no repairs or rum of any sort on board; video available upon request). The entire Danish fleet entered the PB and won the port (good fight apparently, no complaints there). 

I want to know if this method of avoiding a PB screen is considered acceptable. Having been demoted once, following the "Gunless French PB at Cap Francais", I do not wish to endure another keel haul for another exploit if the Russians use the same method. Could I add that If it is NOT an exploit, can you please bring back logging off outside the port so we don't have to go through the farce of bringing out a friendly nation to create a fake battle for what is the same effect

Video below is a clip which is self explanatory, fortunately I was scouting from a balloon so caught the Danes emerging red handed.

Looking forward to a response.

 

Buster (Tarantino eat yer heart out)

Edited by Busterbloodvessel
I always edit on principle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said:

Just like logging out before PB was 100% legal, so is hiding in battle instances. It would be hard to find a solution for that or to make it an illegal action. 

Not really just make a CD of 30 mins after exiting a battle before you can join a PB.. Problems from that would be aplenty tho..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Bearwall said:

Not really just make a CD of 30 mins after exiting a battle before you can join a PB.. Problems from that would be aplenty tho..

What if enemy screening fleet would attack me before PB (screening fight) and I would get away? Am I now sentenced to the death outside PB, because I cannot join it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

oh wow - isn't this the reason they removed pirate outlaw battles?

(ironically at least in a pirate outlaw battle you could still join and see who was in it, what ships they were sailing etc - with this method the entire fleet goes invis when the battle closes with defenders having no idea of numbers/BR)

@admin - to be consistent, please either make it so that one nation cannot tag another nation to prevent this same abuse that pirate outlaw battles were removed for, or bring back pirate outlaw battles

ty

(yeah i know it sounds ridiculous, however so was the pathetic excuse for removing pirate outlaw battles)

Edited by ShroudedRecluse

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  It's another simple fix. They must have tagged the pirate, as he wouldn't have had the br to tag the battlegroup in. So if your battlegroup tags, you get a pb timer on exit, if you're tagged by the screening fleet you don't get one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, FurQ said:

  It's another simple fix. They must have tagged the pirate, as he wouldn't have had the br to tag the battlegroup in. So if your battlegroup tags, you get a pb timer on exit, if you're tagged by the screening fleet you don't get one.

so it will just take a few more pirates to tag their fleet, just a bit harder and more complicated solution that can affect other game aspects too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, ShroudedRecluse said:

oh wow - isn't this the reason they removed pirate outlaw battles?

(ironically at least in a pirate outlaw battle you could still join and see who was in it, what ships they were sailing etc - with this method the entire fleet goes invis when the battle closes with defenders having no idea of numbers/BR)

@admin - to be consistent, please either make it so that one nation cannot tag another nation to prevent this same abuse that pirate outlaw battles were removed for, or bring back pirate outlaw battles

ty

(yeah i know it sounds ridiculous, however so was the pathetic excuse for removing pirate outlaw battles)

Exactly the problem I was seeing on our server was never the Pirate outlaw battles as you can position join them, they are open the whole time and any one can join.  WIth these other battles it's very exploitable.

My solution is make zones. 

  • You have your safe zone that is around capitals.  Are set up like our normal battles, but you get reinforcements and they close after a set timer. Normal green on green rules.
  • You have your  normal zones.  These are any National owned waters that isn't a capital safe zone.  They have the normal circle and than they have the big circle that you have the option to join (remember when we had two circles).  The window to join/option remains 2.5 mins but this are positional join only if your out side the normal pull circles.  This will allow you to join from any direction and you don't have to turn around an. Normal green on green rules.
  • Than you have your PvP hotzones.  These are certain areas of the map that are unsafe for traders and nothing but PvP is expected in these zones.  It's Pirate Free For ALL BATTLES in these zones. There are only two ways to have this zone.  One any port in AGRO for a port battle turns into a PvP ZONE until the Port Battle happens.   This is a war zone after all.  Make it a small bubble that only covers that port and have it shown red on the map all ports in this contested zone.  Any battles started are positional join and you can fight any one in the battle except your own nation. The other way is Clans can actually set there ports to be hotzones.  Green on green rules will only apply to your own nation.
  • Last we have the TRUE PVP ZONES.  These are perm zones on the map (kinda like the old PvP Events).  The ports are neutral around them or free towns so no one can capture them.  They have a perm red zone around them.  Any combat in this zone will be the free for all mechanics.  Any thing goes in these areas La Mona, La Navasse, Tumbabo, La Tortugas ports that are a bit from other ports but in the middle of areas.  Prob some other better picks out there.  Pretty much all the free towns are these zones, but we can rename these ports to Outlaw Havens.  There is no Green on Green in these ares anything can go.
Edited by Sir Texas Sir

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Funny i was pretty shure i saw the same thing from the russians when they conquered Bermudas. Yes it was not nessesary, but you had a pirate with you wich you tagged or he tagged you but then all of you jumped south of flatts into the battle. So now somone other uses your tricks now its a bad thing and goes to the tribunal? Or am i mistaken? :) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, Lonar said:

Funny i was pretty shure i saw the same thing from the russians when they conquered Bermudas. Yes it was not nessesary, but you had a pirate with you wich you tagged or he tagged you but then all of you jumped south of flatts into the battle. So now somone other uses your tricks now its a bad thing and goes to the tribunal? Or am i mistaken? :) 

Yep your mistaken, I looked in my diary of misdemeanours.

If permitted, I am reluctantly willing to use the BF tactic on you next PB though! 

 

Buster (looking over top of specs)

 

 

 

 

Edited by Busterbloodvessel

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Busterbloodvessel

Why you didn't write about PB for Port-de-Paix? Especially about how attackers enter to PB.

Could they be intercepted?

maybe because Russian Empire was attacker

 

 

 

Edited by qw569

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, qw569 said:

@Busterbloodvessel

Why you didn't write about PB for Port-de-Paix? Especially about how attackers enter to PB.

Could they be intercepted?

maybe because Russian Empire was attacker

 

 

 

They left la tortue and used the timer as far as I know?

I dont think you can compare that to alts/friends being tagged to run away or teleporting away after battle is over

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, qw569 said:

@Busterbloodvessel

Why you didn't write about PB for Port-de-Paix? Especially about how attackers enter to PB.

Could they be intercepted?

maybe because Russian Empire was attacker

 

 

 

 

@qw569

Thank you for your response.

I will not defend the heinous act of travelling from La Tortue to Port-de-Paix without allowing an opportunity of being screened by Pirates! I didn’t actually do it, but I would, I am so condemned! It’s rather different to a fake battle instance though isn’t it.

I take a couple of things in evidence from your post:

1.       You don’t deny that you were party to the BF arrangement as I claim.

2.       You cite game play by others as being your motive.  I take this to mean that you would also prefer not to see this in the game.

@admin 

To me the evidence is clear. The video shows what happened. By qw569’s mail it is more than reasonable to conclude a fake battle instance was used. BF and qw569 colluded in this ploy. The only defence, if you decide that a defence is needed, seems to be that others did or would use it.

I haven’t seen a single post that applauds this means of entering a PB. The method is open for use by anyone who cares to use it. I fear it will become standard practice unless you declare against it and enforce abstinence. If not, it’s going on my to-do list tomorrow.

What say you!

 

Buster and Buster (Attorneys)

Edited by Busterbloodvessel
I always edit

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

@qw569 sailed both WITH and AGAINST the BF (all on live streams) so its hard to make a decision in this particular case as:

it is allowed to attack other players
it is allowed to stay in battle until battle is over
formally no rules were broken but the intent was clear
qw is clearly not an alt and is an active player for a pirate nation

Players should stop discussing BF or RUS or RED. The discussion must focus on where should we stop letting players using allowed mechanics to their benefit because there are lots of rules that can cause such concerns (for example shooting enemy sail with single shots for 1.5 hours).

Basically should we punish players for staying in battle because it gives them advantage and if yes should we then punish players for using yards because it gives them an advantage in turning)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, admin said:

 

@qw569 sailed both WITH and AGAINST the BF (all on live streams) so its hard to make a decision in this particular case as:

it is allowed to attack other players
it is allowed to stay in battle until battle is over
formally no rules were broken but the intent was clear
qw is clearly not an alt and is an active player for a pirate nation

Players should stop discussing BF or RUS or RED. The discussion must focus on where should we stop letting players using allowed mechanics to their benefit because there are lots of rules that can cause such concerns (for example shooting enemy sail with single shots for 1.5 hours).

Basically should we punish players for staying in battle because it gives them advantage and if yes should we then punish players for using yards because it gives them an advantage in turning)

So it's a grey aera. Perfect. No need for screening pb either delene or offensive, glad you clear this up. Now we can use screeners to make 2 pb  at same time and hide in battle so we dont need screening. 

Edited by North

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, North said:

So it's a grey aera. Perfect. No need for screening pb either delene or offensive, glad you clear this up. Now we can use screeners to make 2 pb  at same time and hide in battle so we dont need screening. 

I like it north.  Starting to think like a night flipper  :-)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, North said:

So it's a grey aera. Perfect. No need for screening pb either delene or offensive, glad you clear this up. Now we can use screeners to make 2 pb  at same time and hide in battle so we dont need screening. 

Incorrect.

The screening fleet must start looking for the enemy before 1h30min +15 min (duration of battle)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, North said:

So it's a grey aera. Perfect. No need for screening pb either delene or offensive, glad you clear this up. Now we can use screeners to make 2 pb  at same time and hide in battle so we dont need screening. 

Several nations hid in battles before.  hundreds of times. several nations logged off before the PB (which caused us to add a 30 min pb timer log off timer) several nations teleported to battle using TP to regional capital forcing us to change the tp city.. all those were allowed valid mechanics, but were used to get to PB without interference.

 
But this one is hard because we can't remove attacking other players :). Also if a screening fleet is attacking a port battle fleet does it in reality also keeping them in battle (sometimes with no intention of fighting)? 


Maybe players can just relax and play normally instead of turning into trash asshole dickmans?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What game should do is kick out players from a fight if they don't get any hits for 10 minutes. Of course there can be friendly fire or simple tagging, but it will fix a small % of griefing when someone tags NPC and runs away fro 1:30h

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, admin said:

Maybe players can just relax and play normally instead of turning into trash asshole dickmans?

+1

I'm not sure why there is a need for screening in most cases, why not have a good fight in the PB? I do understand some ports are more strategic than others and may warrant defending at all costs, but I suspect in the majority of cases port ownership is not as important as some make it out to be...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, admin said:

 

Maybe players can just relax and play normally instead of turning into trash asshole dickmans?

Proberly not possible, you read forum so you proberly know this allready:(

Tribunal was posted to get a answer, and without all the other things written. It is basically allowed, but not good game play.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, North said:

Proberly not possible, you read forum so you proberly know this allready:(

Tribunal was posted to get a answer, and without all the other things written. It is basically allowed, but not good game play.

we have not yet said it will be allowed in the future - its under investigation.
investigation goal is to maybe find the way to block it by design. but as you understand its very hard to remove attack :)  Any combat NPC could be attacked and a fleet can sail away from him for 1.5 hours.

to fix this invisibility and speed boost must be removed. but i think its generally a very much liked feature

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×