Jack Jones Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 (edited) 8 hours ago, Hodo said: HMS Speedy vs El Gamo HMS Speedy 14x 4lb guns 90 men vs El Gamo - 5th rate Xebec 32 gun ship with 22x 12lb guns, 2 24lb carronades, and 8 8lb guns. 319men. Results... HMS Speedy victorious, 3 men killed, 9 wounded. El Gamo, 14 killed, 41 wounded, 261 captured. La Concorde- 5th rate converted frigate of 40 guns captured by the Revenge and Ravager, both sloops, of 8 guns and 50 and 70 men. The La Concorde was renamed the Queen Anne's Revenge by its captor, Edward Teach aka Blackbeard. Should I keep going? Mercury vs the Ottoman Navy..... while not a victory in a sense that it sunk anything. The USS Lynx, captured SEVERAL merchant ships varying in size from brigs to larger 5th and 4th rate ships. Oh and if a ship like the USS Constitution in game hits a 6th rate built for speed with its 24lb longs... it does destroy it. Oh SNAP! Ha ha ha. What a load of old tosh, why lie to try and prove a point?? Hms Speedy vs El Gamo. It is well known that the Gamo mistakely surrenderd after some of the speedys crew tore down its colours! It was handled so badly by its 2nd in command that the British captain gave the Spaniard a note saying he had done his best! The Concorde was never a 40 gun frigate. It was a merchant slave ship of 16 guns. There was no fight. The pirates had 20 guns between two ships and 150 crew. The French crew who had just undergone a horrendous voyage and who were diseased having lost 16 men to disease and another 30 who were to sick to fight were surreneded by her captain to save bloodshed. It was Teach himself who armed her up to 40 cannons! The USS Lynx in her career caught two unarmed schooners and two 'boats' who were 'pirates' because they were smuggling. Again no fighting. She never tackled anything like an armed merchantman let alone a 4th rate!! Thanks for the damning proof you provided about all the 7th and 6th rates rampaging through history capping 4th rate ships of the line. Should you go on..... please don't. Edited November 17, 2017 by Flash Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachy Posted November 17, 2017 Author Share Posted November 17, 2017 58 minutes ago, z4ys said: When he is going upwind why you don't sail downwind by doing so you get a fast separation. But I guess you wanted the kill so badly right? In this case you griefed yourself by hunting a better upwind ship. Shot chain at him. You have so much guns. Sail downwind leave. Have you ever been in a fight? Ever sailed something heavier than a 6th rate? If so, your post doesn't show it. First of all, you probably won't be full sails at that point. Second of all, you most likely are mid maneuver trying to get a hit on the snow. Connies aren't like little 6th rates, they don't turn a full 360 in a few seconds or reverse direction without any sort of slow down. They take quite abit to change direction and build up speed. It takes over 60 seconds to get up to full speed. Not even counting the time spent turning to a better point etc. if the snow doesn't want to disengage, nothing the 4th rate does Is going to allow it to disengage. Ever seen a hawk get attacked by a sparrow ? The sparrow can't beat the hawk, but until it decides to let the hawk go, the hawk is pestered by the sparrow and there is nothing the larger, less maneuverable hawk can do. Yes the Connie has lots of guns, but like I said, they take awhile to reload. They aren't little popguns that reload in seconds. When you fire your guns on a Connie, your unable to fire again for at least a minute. A lot can happen in a minute. I appreciate your theories, but sadly they do not reflect reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iroquois Confederacy Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 3 minutes ago, Malachy said: They aren't little popguns that reload in seconds. Why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn Rocko Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 @Malachy put down the Connie and give 6th rates a try They are the only true pirate ships in the game besides the LGV refit (which is not worth sailing now) and maybe the Surprise/Reno. Do this for a day and I'll sail a Connie for a week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z4ys Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 (edited) 7 hours ago, Malachy said: Have you ever been in a fight? Ever sailed something heavier than a 6th rate? If so, your post doesn't show it. First of all, you probably won't be full sails at that point. Second of all, you most likely are mid maneuver trying to get a hit on the snow. Connies aren't like little 6th rates, they don't turn a full 360 in a few seconds or reverse direction without any sort of slow down. They take quite abit to change direction and build up speed. It takes over 60 seconds to get up to full speed. Not even counting the time spent turning to a better point etc. if the snow doesn't want to disengage, nothing the 4th rate does Is going to allow it to disengage. Ever seen a hawk get attacked by a sparrow ? The sparrow can't beat the hawk, but until it decides to let the hawk go, the hawk is pestered by the sparrow and there is nothing the larger, less maneuverable hawk can do. Yes the Connie has lots of guns, but like I said, they take awhile to reload. They aren't little popguns that reload in seconds. When you fire your guns on a Connie, your unable to fire again for at least a minute. A lot can happen in a minute. I appreciate your theories, but sadly they do not reflect reality. In this fight I would have been more than able to leave the battle. And again its a teak white oak build (12kn max) and far away from speed fitted like the snow was (14kn max). I had no issue to keep distance or gain distance. People can have the best modded ships but when they dont know how to sail them (by that i mean how they should behave compared to the ships that they are fighting), the best ship is worth nothing. And that you have to do a 180° turn just shows me that you were chasing him. If your intention would have been to leave the fight you would never have to make a turn more than 90°. - Your sail hp pool is huge compared to snow. So you would win the chaser duel. - Get separation chain his sails with your longs. Maybe let him get closer chain with your carronades and his sail % are gone in no time. When he repairs repeat. - Go to 120° while you extend shoot your chasers at him. 15 min are more than enough time to get out of gun range to leave the battle. That makes me think you either dont know your ship compared to other ships or you wanted to kill him instead of leaving the fight. Back to your comparison: Sometimes the hawk just should leave even he is the natural born killer. Edited November 17, 2017 by z4ys 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachy Posted November 17, 2017 Author Share Posted November 17, 2017 (edited) 4 hours ago, z4ys said: Hide contents In this fight I would have been more than able to leave the battle. And again its a teak white oak build (12kn max) and far away from speed fitted like the snow was (14kn max). I had no issue to keep distance or gain distance. People can have the best modded ships but when they dont know how to sail them (by that i mean how they should behave compared to the ships that they are fighting), the best ship is worth nothing. And that you have to do a 180° turn just shows me that you were chasing him. If your intention would have been to leave the fight you would never have to make a turn more than 90°. - Your sail hp pool is huge compared to snow. So you would win the chaser duel. - Get separation chain his sails with your longs. Maybe let him get closer chain with your carronades and his sail % are gone in no time. When he repairs repeat. - Go to 120° while you extend shoot your chasers at him. 15 min are more than enough time to get out of gun range to leave the battle. That makes me think you either dont know your ship compared to other ships or you wanted to kill him instead of leaving the fight. Back to your comparison: Sometimes the hawk just should leave even he is the natural born killer. I'll watch the video later but just from your comments I'm pretty sure the opposition ship is poorly handled. I'll edit this post tonight when I have time to watch it. Also remember we are talking about multiple sixth rates griefing one 4th, not just 1 on 1. 1!on 1 can't happen due to Br considerations Edited November 17, 2017 by Malachy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodo Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 12 hours ago, Flash Jack said: Should you go on..... please don't. Just one page... If you look above the Lynx, you will see, The Lovely Cornelia, 1 gun 60 men schooner, 16 prizes. Lion, 2 guns, 22 men, 15 prizes. Macedonian 6 guns,..... 14 prizes. 13 hours ago, Malachy said: I understand where you are coming from but the main difference is this: no other ship class can grief with impunity. The only class that can is the 6th rate. It's got enough protection to take pretty much whatever is dished out in the first pass, and then sail to a point where nothing else can catch it and plink away with popguns for the rest of the match avoiding hits due to its small size or damage fall off. You keep forgetting, I don't consider them a threat to a Connie unless there are half a dozen of them. I'm one of the best Connie captains on the eu server, not some damned noob who has never used one. The build you describe would leave serious holes in your combat ability. First, 13.5 knots is too slow if you are solo. You would be meat for any gank group who came by. Also, you would get even less time on target when fighting 6th rates because you are sacrificing a knot and a half before the battle even starts. The slower you are, the slower you turn. It's not a turning stat issue but an acceleration issue. The faster you go into a turn, the faster you complete it. 13.5knots is a start. Second.... and most importantly. Kill 6th rate play and everyone will just switch to Surprises, Cerberus, and Renomee. All of which are WAY better armed than Snows, and just as cheap to get. My current hunting Renomee does 14.9knots and 11knots at 60deg. My Surprise does 14.6 knots, and 12knots at 60. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachy Posted November 17, 2017 Author Share Posted November 17, 2017 4 minutes ago, Hodo said: Just one page... If you look above the Lynx, you will see, The Lovely Cornelia, 1 gun 60 men schooner, 16 prizes. Lion, 2 guns, 22 men, 15 prizes. Macedonian 6 guns,..... 14 prizes. 13.5knots is a start. Second.... and most importantly. Kill 6th rate play and everyone will just switch to Surprises, Cerberus, and Renomee. All of which are WAY better armed than Snows, and just as cheap to get. My current hunting Renomee does 14.9knots and 11knots at 60deg. My Surprise does 14.6 knots, and 12knots at 60. I'm fine with that switch. All of them you can force some sort of conclusion with one way or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodo Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 Just now, Malachy said: I'm fine with that switch. All of them you can force some sort of conclusion with one way or another. Some of us are not fine with that switch. Why should we have to change OUR game play because YOU cant sail? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lz3 Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 3 minutes ago, Hodo said: Some of us are not fine with that switch. Why should we have to change OUR game play because YOU cant sail? exactly 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anne Wildcat Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 17 minutes ago, Hodo said: Some of us are not fine with that switch. Why should we have to change OUR game play Amen! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Jones Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 30 minutes ago, Hodo said: Just one page... If you look above the Lynx, you will see, The Lovely Cornelia, 1 gun 60 men schooner, 16 prizes. Lion, 2 guns, 22 men, 15 prizes. Macedonian 6 guns,..... 14 prizes. 13.5knots is a start. Second.... and most importantly. Kill 6th rate play and everyone will just switch to Surprises, Cerberus, and Renomee. All of which are WAY better armed than Snows, and just as cheap to get. My current hunting Renomee does 14.9knots and 11knots at 60deg. My Surprise does 14.6 knots, and 12knots at 60. Lol. Unbelievable. NO SHIPS OF THE LINE. NO 4TH RATES! JUST SMALL UNARMED MERCHANTS. YOUR ARGUEMENT IS NOW VOID ON THE GROUNDS OF REPEATED B.S. I am going to lie down in a darkened room...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Jones Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 27 minutes ago, Hodo said: Some of us are not fine with that switch. Why should we have to change OUR game play because YOU cant sail? Because it is damaging the game. Players who come to NA for the promissed realism etc, quickly leave when they realise non historical, unrealistic exploits, are being used by a few who use these exploits for their own competitive gain. When enough leave there will be no argument because there will be no game. Move on to another game, find exploit, rinse, repeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodo Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 Just now, Flash Jack said: Lol. Unbelievable. NO SHIPS OF THE LINE. NO 4TH RATES! JUST SMALL UNARMED MERCHANTS. YOUR ARGUEMENT IS NOW VOID ON THE GROUNDS OF REPEATED B.S. I am going to lie down in a darkened room...... Any ship listed in that list in the first row is rated as a 5th rate or larger, or "Ship". Your insults are as weak as your sailing skills. You should remove that flag from your avatar because you arent worthy of flying the black. I found a replacement for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Jones Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 5 minutes ago, Hodo said: Any ship listed in that list in the first row is rated as a 5th rate or larger, or "Ship". Your insults are as weak as your sailing skills. You should remove that flag from your avatar because you arent worthy of flying the black. I found a replacement for you. Insults...yes that's what B.S. losers do. Very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z4ys Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 3 minutes ago, Hodo said: Not sure if surrender or French Don't know why so many people have the attitude the bigger the better. Yesterday I got tagged by a bunch of 4th rates while sailing a schooner. Should I start a topic about griefing while it was more than predictable that they never gonna catch me? What you call griefing can be done with every ship that's just faster than you. So don't blame a specific rate. Blame the tag mechanic suggest changes to the *you can't leave battle counter* maybe sail dmg alone shouldn't keep people in battle? But all I read so far was mimimi I have such a big disadvantage make me win. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodo Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 2 minutes ago, z4ys said: Not sure if surrender or French Don't know why so many people have the attitude the bigger the better. Yesterday I got tagged by a bunch of 4th rates while sailing a schooner. Should I start a topic about griefing while it was more than predictable that they never gonna catch me? What you call griefing can be done with every ship that's just faster than you. So don't blame a specific rate. Blame the tag mechanic suggest changes to the *you can't leave battle counter* maybe sail dmg alone shouldn't keep people in battle? But all I read so far was mimimi I have such a big disadvantage make me win. I try to refrain from making fun of the French. They were some brave sailors back then, fighting the Royal Navy, with inferior tactics, lead by men who lacked experience and were terrified of being sent to the guillotine. Honestly the French soldiers, and sailors are some of the bravest in the world.. they just have been ruined by horrible political leadership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachy Posted November 17, 2017 Author Share Posted November 17, 2017 2 hours ago, Hodo said: Some of us are not fine with that switch. Why should we have to change OUR game play because YOU cant sail? I'd be willing to bet I sail a hell of a lot better than you do. Anytime you care to test that I'm game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodo Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 2 hours ago, Malachy said: I'd be willing to bet I sail a hell of a lot better than you do. Anytime you care to test that I'm game. If you ever find me, you are welcome to try... but from your crying in this thread I am willing to say I doubt it. I am on either Global or EU, and I am often sailing on the US coastline or in the Bahamas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachy Posted November 17, 2017 Author Share Posted November 17, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Hodo said: If you ever find me, you are welcome to try... but from your crying in this thread I am willing to say I doubt it. I am on either Global or EU, and I am often sailing on the US coastline or in the Bahamas. I am on the EU server and am mainly found in the combat channel under the heading "Malachy Karrde sank (player) near (location). That will tell you where to find me. Edited November 17, 2017 by Malachy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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