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Repairs/Surgeon/Stern Chasers Tuning

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All repairs should have cooldown of 15 minutes, not 10 minutes. Ten minutes is too fast in any aspect. 1v1 or 10v10 or 25v25, it's too fast. Makes chases almost impossible as 10 minutes is not enough to gain distance while shooting sails. Once you get your target down to 70-80% sails, he repairs again to 100%. Chases mostly end when enemy runs out of rig repairs. Extra 5 minutes will make a huge difference.

Same relation to stern chasers accuracy. Accuracy should be reduced, sniper accuracy is just silly. Bow & stern guns should have similar accuracy.

Surgeon is too powerful and too fast. I believe he should recover 50-75% of dead crew (so a ship cannot recover to max crew all the time, obviously some % of the crew is dead and surgeon is not a necromancer). Also he should have 15 minutes cooldown and work much slower. Right now surgeon can recover like 20-30 crew each second, if not more. Crew recovery should be much slower. 

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Repairs and rum are currently at either 12 minutes or 12.5 minutes (pretty sure it is the latter).

However, I agree going to 15 is worth testing. They still feel too fast.

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It depends. For the ganker, sure you want the longest repair interval possible. For the guy who's been ganked, you want a shorter repair interval. I don't see much problem right now. The gankee has a reasonable chance to get away and the gankers can use their numbers to keep sails down. Longer intervals just mean that more advantage goes to the aggressor.

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4 minutes ago, Malachy said:

It depends. For the ganker, sure you want the longest repair interval possible. For the guy who's been ganked, you want a shorter repair interval. I don't see much problem right now. The gankee has a reasonable chance to get away and the gankers can use their numbers to keep sails down. Longer intervals just mean that more advantage goes to the aggressor.

Why do you suggest that it would be good only for gankers? Ganking fleets already have a decent chance to catch enemy. In situation 1v1 it is almost impossible to catch someone. This is very harsh for solo playing and encourages gank fleets to increase your chance of catching enemies. Same goes to 1v1 stern vs bow chasers. Gank fleet with 10-12 inaccuarate bow chasers will still catch someone, but 1v1 the chaser/hunter in most cases will lose the chase due to inaccuracy. 

Edited by Peter Goldman
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The advantage stays the same for the group against a soloplayer ...  as it would be with only one or no repairs aswell.

The battle just takes longer with repairs.

I'd prefer no repairs, or only one (one for sails, one for hull), but in essence it stays the same.

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3 hours ago, Peter Goldman said:

Why do you suggest that it would be good only for gankers? Ganking fleets already have a decent chance to catch enemy. In situation 1v1 it is almost impossible to catch someone. This is very harsh for solo playing and encourages gank fleets to increase your chance of catching enemies. Same goes to 1v1 stern vs bow chasers. Gank fleet with 10-12 inaccuarate bow chasers will still catch someone, but 1v1 the chaser/hunter in most cases will lose the chase due to inaccuracy. 

In real life 1 vs 1 in similar ships either side could usually avoid action. In game as in real life if both ships engage, the chances of disengaging are a lot slimmer.  Really don't see a problem. If someone doesn't want to fight you, go find someone who does. That's what I do.

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4 minutes ago, Malachy said:

In real life 1 vs 1 in similar ships either side could usually avoid action. In game as in real life if both ships engage, the chances of disengaging are a lot slimmer.  Really don't see a problem. If someone doesn't want to fight you, go find someone who does. That's what I do.

Usually most of the people don't wanna fight me, it's not a game where you kindly ask your opponents to fight you.

In real life stern chasers don't have sniper accuracy, they should have similar one to bow chasers.

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14 minutes ago, Malachy said:

If someone doesn't want to fight you, go find someone who does. That's what I do.

Like 1% of the players you meet in the OW will fight you. And 0,5% of those players will only fight you because they are in a Santissima and you are in a Pickle. 

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10 minutes ago, TommyShelby said:

Like 1% of the players you meet in the OW will fight you. And 0,5% of those players will only fight you because they are in a Santissima and you are in a Pickle. 

And 0,99% of the players will fight you only once after you turn their ships into canoes :lol:

Edited by Peter Goldman
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4 hours ago, Peter Goldman said:

Why do you suggest that it would be good only for gankers? Ganking fleets already have a decent chance to catch enemy. In situation 1v1 it is almost impossible to catch someone. This is very harsh for solo playing and encourages gank fleets to increase your chance of catching enemies. Same goes to 1v1 stern vs bow chasers. Gank fleet with 10-12 inaccuarate bow chasers will still catch someone, but 1v1 the chaser/hunter in most cases will lose the chase due to inaccuracy. 

Pretty much this. You seem like a player who actually seeks PvP unlike all the PvE idiots on this forum that seem to have no hello kittying clue but still feel they need to talk. Thank you.

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4 hours ago, TommyShelby said:

Like 1% of the players you meet in the OW will fight you. And 0,5% of those players will only fight you because they are in a Santissima and you are in a Pickle. 

And that gives you the right to force them to do something they don't want to do? Talk about arrogance. A slim chance is all the hunter should have. If you aren't good enough to tag properly and or use your chasers properly then you don't deserve the kill. I very rarely have someone I tagged escape as I make sure to tag so that I am in range with my broadsides. So many wannabe pvpers don't have a clue how to tag so want their targets handed to them. This thread is case in point. While I'm sure that the original poster is a pretty decent pvper, this thread basically comes down to "I can't catch anyone so developers need to make repair timers longer so that I have more time and it's easier to gank folks" I'm sure that wasn't the intention but that's what it is. Your targets shouldn't be handed to you and all increasing the timers does is make it easier for those gank squads who like to prey on single targets.

Repair timers as is gives the solo player at least a fighting chance to get away or fight off the gank groups, extending the timers is only going to make it even easier for them to prey on single targets. Anything that makes a gank groups life easier is non grata in my book. Find another solution or learn to tag. @admin

Edited by Malachy

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I agree, I think 15 minute timers are worth testing. The ~12 minute timers we have now are alright, but maybe still a bit fast.

I also agree that rum repairs should not be as strong and that you shouldn't be able to get back to full crew since, invariably, some of the crew removed from action are going to be dead. 60% of your losses seems reasonable. Perhaps add in a perk "Physician" that will cost 1 point but allow you to recover 80% of your crew that was taken out. So, if you start with 450 crew and lose 100, you'd get 60 back with a standard surgeon, but 80 crew if you had the "Physician" perk. It might not be a perk worth taking for the average hunter, but a boarder would probably consider it worthwhile for some ships.

Yes, stern chasers are unrealistically accurate and bow chasers are unrealisitcally inaccurate. Both sets of chasers should have ever so slightly better accuracy than the broadside cannons since you'd have the most experienced and best trained gun captains assigned to them.

6 hours ago, TommyShelby said:

Like 1% of the players you meet in the OW will fight you. And 0,5% of those players will only fight you because they are in a Santissima and you are in a Pickle. 

This is one of the best posts I've read. :D It is sad, funny, and true all at the same time.

A month or so ago, I attacked a Connie with my Surprise and he spent the whole fight running while I tried to out-chain him and get his crew down enough to board. It was the same thing when I jumped a L'Ocean in a mission with my Surprise (although I managed to de-crew him, I knew I stood no chance of out-pushing him to get him upwind...)

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3 hours ago, Malachy said:

And that gives you the right to force them to do something they don't want to do? Talk about arrogance. A slim chance is all the hunter should have.

That's like....70% of the game though. And we already have like a .03% chance of finding PVP

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6 hours ago, Landsman said:

Pretty much this. You seem like a player who actually seeks PvP unlike all the PvE idiots on this forum that seem to have no hello kittying clue but still feel they need to talk. Thank you.

PVE players are no more idiot than you... in fact probably less than you, since you are unable to respect others ways of playing...

As already stated many times, gankers have already so many advantages, especially to run away after ganking, that balancing the game to allow defenders a chance to escape is normal... unless if gankers only want traders served on a dish without any other chance at all....

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21 minutes ago, PYR said:

PVE players are no more idiot than you... in fact probably less than you, since you are unable to respect others ways of playing...

As already stated many times, gankers have already so many advantages, especially to run away after ganking, that balancing the game to allow defenders a chance to escape is normal... unless if gankers only want traders served on a dish without any other chance at all....

If you don't want to get ganked don't go into low sec..err I mean outside of your capital waters.

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Just now, Slim Jimmerson said:

If you don't want to get ganked don't go into low sec..err I mean outside of your capital waters.

I ll explain to you as if you were someone able to understand a thing....

You may have noticed that in the game we had th eopportunaty to craft boats and other things. To craft boats we may need some woods that are not within the range of capitals. Furthermore, we may crfat upgrades for which some stuff is also often far away. Therefore, crafters, that usually choose craft relaated perks because it is their role, for example whithin a guild, and are not particulry fitted for the solo pvp, are usually sailing poorly armed boat made to carry heavy stuff, called trading boat. This is a part of the game, and a usefull role to for guild or nation. Do you understand now that all people in traders do not have the sole purpose of being defensless preys for courrageous, fully pvp fitted so-called capitains? or need I to explain it to you again?

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Just now, PYR said:

I ll explain to you as if you were someone able to understand a thing....

You may have noticed that in the game we had th eopportunaty to craft boats and other things. To craft boats we may need some woods that are not within the range of capitals. Furthermore, we may crfat upgrades for which some stuff is also often far away. Therefore, crafters, that usually choose craft relaated perks because it is their role, for example whithin a guild, and are not particulry fitted for the solo pvp, are usually sailing poorly armed boat made to carry heavy stuff, called trading boat. This is a part of the game, and a usefull role to for guild or nation. Do you understand now that all people in traders do not have the sole purpose of being defensless preys for courrageous, fully pvp fitted so-called capitains? or need I to explain it to you again?

Why are you sending out traders unguarded? That's just asking to get ganked

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5 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

Why are you sending out traders unguarded? That's just asking to get ganked

You are in fact  raising a good point here that relates the player comunity that is unable to play (i mean by that having fun and only looking for fun) together...

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11 minutes ago, PYR said:

You are in fact  raising a good point here that relates the player comunity that is unable to play (i mean by that having fun and only looking for fun) together...

I think we're just not really use to having that aspect of the game as prominent as it would be with proper population numbers.

We should be playing like there could be someone ready to hunt you down at any second but with only a couple hundred people being prepared falls second to just not being at the wrong place at the wrong time, and when we happen to get unlucky its easy to feel like its the games fault.

But its really just lack of population in areas that would normally be traveled by hundreds of fellow traders/friendly nationals who can tell you what routes are safe for the hour, where some people spotted an enemy ship and when to bring a buddy with you to traverse.

Edited by Slim Jimmerson
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In regards to the OP and Repairs, instead of timers. The better balancer is weight and volume. Making the three repair functions way more heavier to make a real impact on performance. Also by limiting the amount available to stack in each cargo slot to a very small amount... example 5 or just 2 in the case of rigging repairs only to take up volume within the cargo hold.

 

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3 hours ago, Norfolk nChance said:

 

In regards to the OP and Repairs, instead of timers. The better balancer is weight and volume. Making the three repair functions way more heavier to make a real impact on performance. Also by limiting the amount available to stack in each cargo slot to a very small amount... example 5 or just 2 in the case of rigging repairs only to take up volume within the cargo hold.

 

I don't think that the weights should be adjusted here. Many fights end only when enemy runs out of hull/rig repairs and that's not exactly good for the combat. It should be much easier to kill someone in between his repairs.

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13 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said:

I don't think that the weights should be adjusted here. Many fights end only when enemy runs out of hull/rig repairs and that's not exactly good for the combat. It should be much easier to kill someone in between his repairs.

yeah just another way to look at it. Using time in an already adjusted world what 20x OW 5x BATTLE instance. How long in the real world would it take and to what extent of repairs could be achieved?.

Using Volume with Weight would hinder what amount you could actually carry thus reducing the amount you can repair the ship. Would work across all ratings as well. But just a view only

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11 minutes ago, Norfolk nChance said:

yeah just another way to look at it. Using time in an already adjusted world what 20x OW 5x BATTLE instance. How long in the real world would it take and to what extent of repairs could be achieved?.

Using Volume with Weight would hinder what amount you could actually carry thus reducing the amount you can repair the ship. Would work across all ratings as well. But just a view only

What if during fight 25v25 one ship manages to disangage weak, sails towards the fort, drop sails and repairs? He is repairing ship for 30 minutes and he's ready to get back to combat again. I find it sad when a guy after 3-5 minutes of battle have no more chance coming back to action. He probably have spent 1-2 hours sailing/preparing for it while he only got 5 minutes of fun. 

Also, increased cooldown will already decrease the number of repairs that could be used in a single battle.

90/15=6 (considering that someone will use repair on a very start, so we're actually looking at 4-5 repairs possible per battle).

Now? 90/12=7,5

Before? 90/10=10

If you mess up with weights, that will affect other fights. I find it very good when I can outfit my ship with enough repairs for 3-5 battles, as I find it tedious to go to port after each fight and repair and go back. 

Also... Try fighting a 1st rate. 2 frigates trying to chain it for 6-8 minutes and taking it down to 60-70% and he repairs again to 100% and then spending few minutes to rake him and then he uses rum and back to the full crew.

Gank fleets will win in most cases anyway, what we must do is increase single player and smaller fleet experience. Would you agree @Bearwall?

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20 hours ago, Peter Goldman said:

All repairs should have cooldown of 15 minutes, not 10 minutes. Ten minutes is too fast in any aspect. 1v1 or 10v10 or 25v25, it's too fast. Makes chases almost impossible as 10 minutes is not enough to gain distance while shooting sails. Once you get your target down to 70-80% sails, he repairs again to 100%. Chases mostly end when enemy runs out of rig repairs. Extra 5 minutes will make a huge difference.

Same relation to stern chasers accuracy. Accuracy should be reduced, sniper accuracy is just silly. Bow & stern guns should have similar accuracy.

Surgeon is too powerful and too fast. I believe he should recover 50-75% of dead crew (so a ship cannot recover to max crew all the time, obviously some % of the crew is dead and surgeon is not a necromancer). Also he should have 15 minutes cooldown and work much slower. Right now surgeon can recover like 20-30 crew each second, if not more. Crew recovery should be much slower. 

 

2 hours ago, Peter Goldman said:

What if during fight 25v25 one ship manages to disangage weak, sails towards the fort, drop sails and repairs? He is repairing ship for 30 minutes and he's ready to get back to combat again. I find it sad when a guy after 3-5 minutes of battle have no more chance coming back to action. He probably have spent 1-2 hours sailing/preparing for it while he only got 5 minutes of fun. 

Also, increased cooldown will already decrease the number of repairs that could be used in a single battle.

90/15=6 (considering that someone will use repair on a very start, so we're actually looking at 4-5 repairs possible per battle).

Now? 90/12=7,5

Before? 90/10=10

If you mess up with weights, that will affect other fights. I find it very good when I can outfit my ship with enough repairs for 3-5 battles, as I find it tedious to go to port after each fight and repair and go back. 

Also... Try fighting a 1st rate. 2 frigates trying to chain it for 6-8 minutes and taking it down to 60-70% and he repairs again to 100% and then spending few minutes to rake him and then he uses rum and back to the full crew.

Gank fleets will win in most cases anyway, what we must do is increase single player and smaller fleet experience. Would you agree @Bearwall?

Well to start - I like the current hull/rig/rum (rum should be replaced with medicine and rum should be what it was - a trading ressouce) repairs.

I do think as the OP it needs a bit of tweaking. Running a repair should be a tactical choice - atm it is just a consumption choice. A surgeon should only be able to bring back a percentage of the remaining crew (I'd say 70-80% max but I'm willing to test other numbers) - never the full crew. As the OP states the surgeon is not a necromancer and I for one do not believe in voodoo. Remove the magics.

In regards to PvP it needs a lot of love and work. Single player hunting is not a viability, small fleet hunting is - if not impossible then impropable since the revenge fleets can relatively easily find the battle site, camp it and simply kill any hunters. This needs to change, I don't believe in tp to port but the current invisibility timers needs to increase and so does the speed coming out of a battle.. There's too many obstacles to PvP atm, the reinforcement zones needs to go, and if they were introduced to allow PvE'ers or players just wanting to relax a bit with PvE needs protection, then let missions close instantaneously and let 7th-4th rate missions drop inside the green capital zones - most ppl that wanna do PvE doesn't want to sail longer than 5 mins from their capital anyway so they simply keep taking new missions till they get a site they are satisfied with - timesink and wastefull. There's not enough incentives to PvP either, the random books drop from PvE not PvP (all books should be obtainable in admiralty store and much more expensive than atm - kill the random number jesus), the rewards in comparison to time spent is significantly larger in PvE, and there really is no incentive to leave the unconquerable regions (which needs to go or be limited to 1 pr nation and no reinforcements).

Just my penny of thought.

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17 hours ago, Malachy said:

And that gives you the right to force them to do something they don't want to do? Talk about arrogance. A slim chance is all the hunter should have. If you aren't good enough to tag properly and or use your chasers properly then you don't deserve the kill. I very rarely have someone I tagged escape as I make sure to tag so that I am in range with my broadsides. So many wannabe pvpers don't have a clue how to tag so want their targets handed to them. This thread is case in point. While I'm sure that the original poster is a pretty decent pvper, this thread basically comes down to "I can't catch anyone so developers need to make repair timers longer so that I have more time and it's easier to gank folks" I'm sure that wasn't the intention but that's what it is. Your targets shouldn't be handed to you and all increasing the timers does is make it easier for those gank squads who like to prey on single targets.

Repair timers as is gives the solo player at least a fighting chance to get away or fight off the gank groups, extending the timers is only going to make it even easier for them to prey on single targets. Anything that makes a gank groups life easier is non grata in my book. Find another solution or learn to tag. @admin

What are you on about? 
The point of what i said in my comment here is that there is like 0.0002% chance of actually getting a fight.

How does the low chance of getting a fight have anything to do with whether or not you are good at the game?

This thread does not basically come down to "I can't catch anyone so developers need to make repair times longer bla bla".
It comes down the fact that repairs and surgeon suck and needs changing. (To improve gameplay in PvP). 

17 hours ago, Malachy said:

Repair timers as is gives the solo player at least a fighting chance to get away or fight off the gank groups, extending the timers is only going to make it even easier for them to prey on single targets. Anything that makes a gank groups life easier is non grata in my book. Find another solution or learn to tag. @admin

Repairs/Repair timers does not help the solo player... This is just plain wrong and i have no clue how you could think differently. 

Let me setup a scenario here and you can make your own judgment. 
Solo Constitution is caught by 5 Surprises. 

Scenario 1,1; No Repairs.
In this case, the Constitution have to deal with 5 Surprises. Disabling 5 Surprises before they destroy you is doable in a Constitution. 

Scenario 1,2; 2x Repairs. 
Assuming each repair fixes 50% of whatever you repair, you are basically looking at a 2v10. 
Now this might sound insane, but in my experience the 2v10 will be a considerably harder fight. 
Whenever the Constitution manages to disable a Surprise, it will come back in a matter of minutes, effectively this means that the Surprises will have a much easier time catching the Constitution and destroy it before it disables all of them.

Scenario 1,3; 10 Minutes Cooldown, infinite repairs. (Effectively 6-7 Repairs in 90 minute fight)
This is basically Scenario 1,2 but worse. 
It gets exponentially worse for the victim really. 


 

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