Preliminary discussion of the changes to conquest - clan wars are coming

[Sella]

3 minutes ago, Prater said:

^^ This right here.  To then enter a nation's ports, you have to have decent relations with that nation.  Attack that nation's players or ai too many times, and you can't enter their ports anymore.  So everyone starts off neutral, and anyone can attack anyone, but you will harm your relations with that nation by attacking them.  Pirates, of course, would start off negative with everyone.

Who will decide that though? Are you thinking reputation like in Port Royale which comes through trading and other stuff? I though that the devs dont like these singleplayer aspects

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Arsilon said:

...which was basically my point.  Why bother if all you're doing is creating a new "nation" mechanic which aside from what limits you place on it end up with the same problems the old mechanic did?

 

 

Well, these war companies can solve they're own disputes with internal factions, whereas the nations could not.

Lets say two clans are part of the same war company. They have a major dispute, and one joins a different war company. Now these two clans (that are part of different war companies) can go to war on the OW and in RvR, but there's no need for a mass exodus from one nation to another. 

[Prater]

4 minutes ago, Sella22 said:

Who will decide that though? Are you thinking reputation like in Port Royale which comes through trading and other stuff? I though that the devs dont like these singleplayer aspects

I've never played Port Royale.

Who will decide?  You as a player decide.  You start off neutral with every nation.  You can attack every nation, or not attack every nation.  You can attack its players and ai or not attack its players and ai.  If you attack a nation's ai or players, your reputation with that nation decreases.  If it decreases too much, you can't enter their ports anymore.

Edited August 2, 2017 by Prater

[Archaos]

1 minute ago, admin said:

Yep maybe the player rights to entry all ports is something that needs to be reviewed with more scrutiny. But thats exactly the reason why we post this here in advance for discussions. 

I like the fact that you have decided to put this topic out for discussion first so that potential flaws can be raised early. I hope that this idea is developed more and that the final solution is deployed on the test server first to try it out, rather than on the main servers.

[Arsilon]

1 minute ago, EliteDelta said:

Well, these war companies can solve they're own disputes with internal factions, whereas the nations could not.

Lets say two clans are part of the same war company. They have a major dispute, and one joins a different war company. Now these two clans (that are part of different war companies) can go to war on the OW and in RvR, but there's no need for a mass exodus from one nation to another. 

I get all of this.  But if that is not the problem you are trying to solve, you don't need to rework the entire RVR, port ownership, etc. mechanic to solve that problem.

The problems that Admin stated were the root cause of this proposal had to do with new player experience and alts.  None of what I've seen described actaully solves any of those problems ultimately and just shifts where they create issues from Nation to War Company --- and in fact the mechanics as described just push War Companies into 'defacto Nation" status under the existing mechanic.

 

[NavalActionPlayer]

Just now, EliteDelta said:

Well, these war companies can solve they're own disputes with internal factions, whereas the nations could not.

Lets say two clans are part of the same war company. They have a major dispute, and one joins a different war company. Now these two clans (that are part of different war companies) can go to war on the OW and in RvR, but there's no need for a mass exodus from one nation to another. 

The effect is the same. War Company is the new Nation. The only difference in this new mechanic is that you don't have to worry about moving your personal possessions from one port to another before making the switch.

[Daguse]

5 minutes ago, The Red Duke said:

Hope so. Upkeep is a necessity and expected in a scenario like we still have, NPC nations, let alone what is coming.

 

Good kickoff for reputation/infamy.

goes into an idea of clan buildings.... ie, ship yard, expanded docs, defensive towers, and so on. 

Hope we can expand the crafting as well. castings require a foundry, wood shops for wood working and so on. 

[Grundgemunkey]

had to read it 3 times .... its an idea ..  so as i understand it ..clans have to decide if they are a pvp only or a pvp/rvr clan ... if the want rvr they have to join a company that has other clans within it ... but this limits ports they can enter to their own nations and company owned ports ..whereas pvp only clan  can enter any port ...

so first question is why bother having nations ??

how easy is it to join or resign from a company ...for example could a pvp only clan join a company for a couple of days then leave ?

if you come across another captain in your nation thats not in your clan or company you can attack them .. ??

so first impression is its too complicated .... will probably lead to  5-8 mega clans instead of nations ... wont help new players at all they will just get seal clubbed by  their own nation rather than another

why should i sail from kpr to anywhere to pvp with other nations when i can pvp with people in my own nation that are not in my clan/company right outside kpr

 

 

 

[Prater]

2 minutes ago, JG14_Cuzn said:

If this is the path you're going to be following then before these changes are implemented you'll need:

1- Map Reset

2- Player reset 

3-Server merge between EU- NA

 

Otherwise you're pissing in the wind with game dynamics and just going to be Losing more players and gaining none.

 

 

Why do you need a player reset?  That doesn't make any sense to me.

[Hethwill]

Full wipe, full merge, and Pandora to test it. 

Keep player names.

[NavalActionPlayer]

1 minute ago, JG14_Cuzn said:

If this is the path you're going to be following then before these changes are implemented you'll need:

1- Map Reset

2- Player reset 

3-Server merge between EU- NA

 

Otherwise you're pissing in the wind with game dynamics and just going to be Losing more players and gaining none.

 

 

So right....and the number of players is going to crash again just like with every other wipe

[z4ys]

1 minute ago, The Red Duke said:

Full wipe, full merge, to test it.

Keep player names.

I like wipes. its at least for me the best time while everyone is sailing small ships^^

[Daguse]

@admin Seeing this changes the ideas of nations completely.... 

Please remove Pirates as a nation. Make them true pirates, only 4-5 rate ships and a hand full of parts. Allow them to TP to free ports like other nations can from their national ports. They can still take 4 rate ports and shallow water ports, but their main goal should be to raid. 

The only issue you'll have is how to keep everyone from going, pirate. 

 

[Lonar]

3 minutes ago, The Red Duke said:

Full wipe, full merge, and Pandora to test it. 

Keep player names.

 

Another wipe before release will this game not survive ... at least my opinion

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Arsilon said:

I get all of this.  But if that is not the problem you are trying to solve, you don't need to rework the entire RVR, port ownership, etc. mechanic to solve that problem.

The problems that Admin stated were the root cause of this proposal had to do with new player experience and alts.  None of what I've seen described actaully solves any of those problems ultimately and just shifts where they create issues from Nation to War Company --- and in fact the mechanics as described just push War Companies into 'defacto Nation" status under the existing mechanic.

 

Except this adds a new dimention to everything. 

Right now, hardcore RvR and a new player experience are intertwined together. If the swedes one port the brits, it can destroy the experience of a new player that joined the brits and finds everything heavily limited.

With this feature, hardcore RvR won't ruin everything for a new player. They won't lose access to resources and ports, and will only have to deal with taxes changing depending on the war company in charge. This lets the RvR people fight it out without having to worry about crushing a player base. 

[Bart Smith]

6 minutes ago, JG14_Cuzn said:

If this is the path you're going to be following then before these changes are implemented you'll need:

1- Map Reset

2- Player reset 

3-Server merge between EU- NA

 

Otherwise you're pissing in the wind with game dynamics and just going to be Losing more players and gaining none.

 

 

Simple why?

[Christoph]

i like it!!!

The clan must also be able to build the defense of the region!! 

[VirtuallyIdiotic]

Okay so coming to the conversation late here so i apologize if this is already mentioned. Basically the current clan system will remain. War companies are a system that will be added to the current game allowing say clans come together and work together with in-game mechanics and can create economic warfare abroad or at home? I am sorry but this is a lot to take in all at once and attempt to process the information with the current knowledge of the game.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, Grundgemunkey said:

had to read it 3 times .... its an idea ..  so as i understand it ..clans have to decide if they are a pvp only or a pvp/rvr clan ... if the want rvr they have to join a company that has other clans within it ... but this limits ports they can enter to their own nations and company owned ports ..whereas pvp only clan  can enter any port ...

so first question is why bother having nations ??

how easy is it to join or resign from a company ...for example could a pvp only clan join a company for a couple of days then leave ?

if you come across another captain in your nation thats not in your clan or company you can attack them .. ??

so first impression is its too complicated .... will probably lead to  5-8 mega clans instead of nations ... wont help new players at all they will just get seal clubbed by  their own nation rather than another

why should i sail from kpr to anywhere to pvp with other nations when i can pvp with people in my own nation that are not in my clan/company right outside kpr

 

 

 

If you aren't in a war company, you can't be attacked by people in your nation. 

If you are in a war company, members of different war companies (in your nation) can attack you.

So the new players are safe from being attacked by their own nation. Just a partial response to your questions. 

[Daguse]

Just now, Lonar said:

 

Another wipe before release will this game not survive ... at least my opinion

after the last wipe we saw a major increase in players. I think if done right, it could help. 

• Don't notify the players of a full wipe till shortly before the launch. 
• use the test bed to iron out the kinks. 
• Once the patch launches, promote the hell out of it. Steam Sale, FB post, talk to game sites, all sort of shit. 
• welcome players back with good redeemable 

[Aventador]

6 minutes ago, The Red Duke said:

Full wipe, full merge, and Pandora to test it. 

Keep player names.

@admin I hope you consider this please

[Tenet]

47 minutes ago, z4ys said:

Capitals just could buy and sell newbi stuff. No contracts are allowed or just certain. So new players can get used to how NA works without vets exploiting them. There should be no reason for vets to hang around the capital.

If the "highest income" trade goods are moved away from main capital and into the regions, with comparable prices, I have no problem with your adjustment. 

[Arsilon]

2 minutes ago, EliteDelta said:

Except this adds a new dimention to everything. 

Right now, hardcore RvR and a new player experience are intertwined together. If the swedes one port the brits, it can destroy the experience of a new player that joined the brits and finds everything heavily limited.

With this feature, hardcore RvR won't ruin everything for a new player. They won't lose access to resources and ports, and will only have to deal with taxes changing depending on the war company in charge. This lets the RvR people fight it out without having to worry about crushing a player base. 

OK.  Simpler solution.  Top of screen there is now another checkbox next to the Smuggler Flag called "RVR".  Check that box and you are now exempt from all those issues.

[Hethwill]

6 minutes ago, Christoph said:

The clan must also be able to build the defense of the region!! 

I'd say mandatory. With Power comes Responsability. 

[Liq]

I like wipes too, as zays said, its the time where everyone is sailing frigates for a while.

But announcing a total wipe NOW, months before anything is going to br wiped, is a mistake. Should have learnt that by now. It took what, 4 months the last time a wipe was announced, and player numbers dopped to a peak of 200.

IF you are going to wipe, keep it secret. Make an announcement one or two weeks before it happens. But not 3 months...