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Preliminary discussion of the changes to conquest - clan wars are coming

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9 minutes ago, Louis Garneray said:

So we are going to have 2 types of clan?

- regular clan where you can go in any port, do regular pvp against foreign nation and

- war companies where you can own a port and where you can do Port Battle against whoever you want.

yes

8 minutes ago, Anne Wildcat said:

As the nation a port belongs to will not change, will there be a map reset with this?

yes once this feature is done map will be reset

6 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said:
  1. Does it mean that there are allowed clan wars? I would like it. We often hear and meet with a term "rogue" clan in nation
  2. Can clans form the charted war company together or does it have to be one clan? Otherwise, it will lead to lots of merges between clans to form a "zerg" clans. Please allow semi-alliance between clans, so forming the company together
  3. Can you explain how access to ports will work for everyone?
  4. How attacking players from same nation will work? Please, explain. 

1 Yes - you can attack any chartered war company even if it is in your own nation
2 Not sure  - because mechanic is different new company have to be created
3 Access is under consideration.. there are 2 options. war companies can only enter their nation ports and ports their war company control (hardcore) - or they can enter any ports their nation and their national war companies control and ports that other companies allowed them to enter .. this is still under consideration
4 Attacking players from the same nation will only work if you are both members of different chartered war companies

6 minutes ago, rediii said:

How would OW pvp work?

Would it be possible to attack own nations members? So is everything a outlaw battle then?

How does conquest work with this idea, is it still AI grinding?

Described above
Conquest (because clans decide what to conquer) can be moved to flag system with modified place timer (much longer timer than before) to give time to counter. 
But we are still discussion options
which are

  • Open conquest - buy a flag start a port battle (but it is placed for 30 mins to allow time to react)
  • Staged conquest - you place a flag and port battle happen next day 
  • Defensive timers can come back as well. Clan determines the 3 hour window when they can be attacked but can be attacked any time. 
  • other ideas are considered too. based on flags or war supplies. 

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Can I be in a clan AND a war company at the same time?

I think that needs to be how it works, if it's not already.

e.g.

Player: Teutonic. Clan: BORK. War Company: The French Legion.
Player: Slamz. Clan: PURGE. War Company: The French Legion.
Player: The Red Duke. Clan: ROVER. War Company: The French Legion.

We're all in our separate clans but we're in the same war company. We have our clan warehouse, clan roster and business-as-usual but we are also in a war company for purposes of RvR.

If this is NOT how it works then frankly I do not like the idea at all. Running a clan is a big deal. Lots of different personalities, forums, rules, etc. Requiring small clans to officially merge isn't gonna fly.

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This is an excellent idea. How will teleports be handled for non-war company players? Will they be able to outpost in non-national ports?

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5 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said:

What about free towns? We need somehow to be able to reach other regions all around the map... This will make borders not important anymore, though. 

you will be able conquer free towns too and tax them and potentially lock entry to enemy corps.  

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1 minute ago, z4ys said:

Please consider: Dont make capital regions player controlled. Thats where new players start and get used to the game. I fear that vet players will capture capital region and palce horrendous taxes there while they stay far away with their own cheap taxes and use the capital region as milkcow.

You have the data @admin do new players move a lot? how long the stay in the capital region before they move out to explore? How long they need to get used to the game?

New players should be proceted.

Because of that consider to not make every resource available at the capital region like it is now. PLayers should get used to the building and crafting system but then they have to go out and seek for resources. In my opinion that currently a huge problem of the game. For a beginner the game should focus around the capital but Vets should get pulled away from there.

 

I would agree but maybe remove the tax option on capitals and have the other options available

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7 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

A BIG NO.

If this game aims to be realistic, wars in the XVIII century were among nations, not between small groups.

current system does not work. If player joins spain on PVP Global he leaves like in 1-2 days. Because he sees that he can never win. Basic game design rule - if perceived chance to win the game is 0 the fun falls to 0 immediately. 

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I like the general sound of the proposals but one big issue I can see is with regards to the warehouse. As another clan even from the same nation can take over the region and get what is in the warehouse, it means there will be a lot of "night flipping". Its bad enough now trying to protect a port round the clock with a whole nation let alone when you only have your clan to do it.

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Just now, rediii said:

Id rather have a good working game instead

This system is going to make absurdily complex the conquests. This clan wars arent needed at all, enough drama already in nations.

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1 minute ago, Aventador said:

I would agree but maybe remove the tax option on capitals and have the other options available

yeah could work

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2 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

This system is going to make absurdily complex the conquests. This clan wars arent needed at all, enough drama already in nations.

Finally that drama will be able to be solved in battle, not in chat, we've got enough of Chat PvP :)

Edited by Peter Goldman

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3 minutes ago, Slamz said:

Can I be in a clan AND a war company at the same time?

I think that needs to be how it works, if it's not already.

e.g.

Player: Teutonic. Clan: BORK. War Company: The French Legion.
Player: Slamz. Clan: PURGE. War Company: The French Legion.
Player: The Red Duke. Clan: ROVER. War Company: The French Legion.

We're all in our separate clans but we're in the same war company. We have our clan warehouse, clan roster and business-as-usual but we are also in a war company for purposes of RvR.

If this is NOT how it works then frankly I do not like the idea at all. Running a clan is a big deal. Lots of different personalities, forums, rules, etc. Requiring small clans to officially merge isn't gonna fly.

I believe that's how it will work but may be wrong. 

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Just now, Intrepido said:

This system is going to make absurdily complex the conquests. This clan wars arent needed at all, enough drama already in nations.

The drama is exactly why I would favor clanwars above national wars at any time. Right now you have to work with your nations, with that clanwar thing you decide where you want to settle and with whom you ally.

I dont see it at absurdly complex too. Pretty similar to what we have now except you dont change the colour of a port.

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3 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

This system is going to make absurdily complex the conquests. This clan wars arent needed at all, enough drama already in nations.

But it makes its amazingly easy and a bit more stable for new players. New system basically separates normal players from hardcore RVR players without interfering with each other's goals. Normal players just want to play, rvr players want to conquer. Everyone will be happy as a result. 

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The entire system creates a safe zone at conquest level, if you didn't notice yet. New players ( or very casual ones ) will always have their nation. Always.

Will give them growing space and warfleets that want to dedicate themselves to smaller tasks, like privateering or trade escort a place to exist in their own niche.

Ports do become important only for the RvR taxation level and raids and denial of entry against equally elevated warfleets.

 

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I think this is the best of current solutions on the table.  I would echo Slamz above, and suggest a war company is joined in addition to a clan, so that one might be in Clan ROVER or clan PURGE but also be in War Company "Napoleon's Guards" (for example)

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6 minutes ago, admin said:

you will be able conquer free towns too and tax them and potentially lock entry to enemy corps.  

This is probably the most impactful change on the list. Highly approve! Can't wait to attack some Free Towns. 

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Just now, admin said:

But it makes its amazingly easy and a bit more stable for new players. New system basically separates normal players from hardcore RVR players without interfering with each other's goals. Normal players just want to play, rvr players want to conquer. Everyone will be happy as a result. 

What about camping ports? Let's say a player from British nation will have access to Spanish ports and will "camp" there to attack Spanish players? A problem we had with Free Towns for a long time. 

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My initial reaction is that all this really does is shift the problem of population balance, national politics, dealing with grievences, etc. from the Nation level where you see nation flipping regulated by access to forged papers and willingness to move with all their stuff and/or willingness of any individual to want to go through the hassle of re-rolling and any re-leveling that might be required as a result.  Instead it shifts it to the "War Company" level which is now regulated by quit & join timers.

You've not solved any of the underlying problems -- its like you squeeze the middle of the balloon and shift the air to the left and right side of your hand.  The same amount of air is still there as was before.

This would be no different than giving everyone the opportunity to create their own nation and provide limited access to forged papers (except you wouldn't need to move your stuff first).

If your concern is new players don't know what nation to join and just leads to bandwagon nation flips and/or people quitting the game, how does any of this solve that?  

The natural evolution of this will be that you end up with mega-War Company entities which in effect would be no different than what you have today with Nations except now people carry two flags (Nation Flag and War Company) instead of one?

Am I missing something?

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Just now, Intrepido said:

But nationals vs nationals? Come on, that can never end well.

yeah that is not gonna go well,so basicaly if youre in a war company, all player within the same nation but in a different war company can attack you? this is gonna caus griefing

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A suggestion to merge to current system with the proposed! @admin

 

Great Britain holds region A. Town A is the capitol of Region A. Region A has 4 ports, Town A, B, C, D.

A Swedish (enemy) war company can only capture Town B, C and D. When these towns are under swedish controlled war companies, Town A will become available for capture. When all the towns are captured by the Swedish war company the region becomes available for RVR conquest. There could also be a limit on the amount of ports a single warcompany can hold in a single region. So multiple war companys must work together in order to do nation conquest.

And for the new players... I dont know a good fix for this too be honest...

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18 minutes ago, admin said:

regions won't change national ownership 
only the controlling chartered war company changes.. 

it will look like this:

Havana region

  • Nation Spain
  • Controlling company - Hanseatic League
  • Governor: Con Shonnery
  • Tax rate 5% 
     

If another clan conquers it it will look like this

Havana region

  • Nation Spain
  • Controlling company: East India Company
  • Governor: Shon Connery
  • Tax rate: 25% 

As Intrepido said below.. NO.

15 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

A BIG NO.

If this game aims to be realistic, wars in the XVIII century were among nations, not between small groups.

Thank you sir well said.

 

This idea, while interesting would lead to more problems than it is worth. It will just lead to CLANs being the only thing that matter, and national pride will mean nothing.   There will be no point in being British, US, Pirate, or Dutch, they will all be the same.  

 

So why have nation chat then, just have clan and global chat.   

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18 minutes ago, admin said:

regions won't change national ownership 
only the controlling chartered war company changes.. 

it will look like this:

Havana region

  • Nation Spain
  • Controlling company - Hanseatic League
  • Governor: Con Shonnery
  • Tax rate 5% 
     

If another clan conquers it it will look like this

Havana region

  • Nation Spain
  • Controlling company: East India Company
  • Governor: Shon Connery
  • Tax rate: 25% 

will this not drive players to flock to the biggest nations, they will more land and so more they are guaranteed entry? 

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