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BallsOfSteel

Port Battle Outlaw Battle Exploit global Server

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koltes    1,729
35 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said:

Koltes and rest must admit that's exploiting, because the battle was used not to fight, but to hide and prevent fight. One thing is that Brits could join the battle, but it doesn't change the fact that if you attack someone, you do it to fight him. Attacking without a will to fight I consider as griefing. Just like SORRY clan came to PB without cannons for damage farming. 

No we don't have to use green on green to fight. Where does it says that we must use GnG battles for fighting??? We did not attack anyone, we just sailed to a close proximity.
We use outlaw battles for all sorts of things. In particular we use them to prevent separating our fleet into separate groups, which is what they do using current broken tagging mechanic. We also use outlaw battles to deliver and share Repairs and Rum so not to overload our 1st rates which are slow already.
Also hiding in outlaw battles is no different than hiding in ANY battles.

 

49 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said:

Attacking without a will to fight I consider as griefing

I agree and the griefing is built-in to this screening mechanic, because ALL they do during the entire tagging is grief us the entry into the PB. They don't fight. They use cheap store bought washtabs to kite our heavy fighting fleet. Does this not go as a griefing in your books??? 

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Peter Goldman    502
30 minutes ago, koltes said:

No we don't have to use green on green to fight. Where does it says that we must use GnG battles for fighting??? We did not attack anyone, we just sailed to a close proximity.
We use outlaw battles for all sorts of things. In particular we use them to prevent separating our fleet into separate groups, which is what they do using current broken tagging mechanic. We also use outlaw battles to deliver and share Repairs and Rum so not to overload our 1st rates which are slow already.
Also hiding in outlaw battles is no different than hiding in ANY battles.

 

I agree and the griefing is built-in to this screening mechanic, because ALL they do during the entire tagging is grief us the entry into the PB. They don't fight. They use cheap store bought washtabs to kite our heavy fighting fleet. Does this not go as a griefing in your books??? 

Fair point, I agree with above as well.

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JobaSet    268

1st of all Drink 2x

Nothing stopping you from joining our battles, but we will keep our fleet together any way and every way we can.  You want to stop us join us when we start another if we have to show up 3 or 5 hours early we will.

Have a Bless Day

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Duncan McFail    266
2 hours ago, BallsOfSteel said:

BLACK and one BLOOD are exploiting a mechanic to enter a PB. 

As far as I am concerned the tactic needs to be banned for everyone  and as I said ALTS of every nation causing the problem. 

The proof is in the screen shot, if you entered the outlaw battle to hide before it is blatantly obvious. 

Admins, I have made the case either stop this activity or Ban Me.

I like many will no longer play a game that allows this hiding of fleets before a PB.

Fleets of all nations should be able to join a PB directly without tagging.

 

What are you crying about? We go into a battle before server shutdown. You're allowed to enter if you get into something bigger than that free cutter. And the PB is hours away after reset. We have to work hours ahead of time to try to get into a port battle because you guys can't face us in even port battle. If you want to quit because you can't have 75 guys keep us from making into the port battle then please find another game to play.

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Christendom    1,793

Oh look, more mechanics abuse.  

If RVR between nations is to be equal, then using this to hide your ships in battle is an unfair advantage to the pirates since other nations do not have access or this needs to be a bannable offense.  

The pirates will most likely either sit by the join areas and demolish anyone joining with 20+ first rates or simply kite for 30mins making it impossible for anyone joining after them to catch up and tag.

Hiding in battle to avoid screening fights was not the intended purpose of the outlaw battles. This clan has already been caught hiding in battle with the use of a pirate alt before.  

 

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The whole pirate outlaw battle IS an exploit.

It is exactly like logging out in front of a port battle, except only one nation is allowed to do it.  

The people that keep saying "your chicken for not jumping into the outlaw battle need to think for a few seconds.  all the rats needed to do is sail away from the spawn location and anyone joining after a few minutes would never be able to catch them... Plus the pirates could just leave battles and reenter outlaw battles, or leave and scatter into 13 1v1 battles.

It IS an exploit because pirates are using it to attack other nations, NOT to have pirates fight pirates. 

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Would it be OK for two allied fleets to do this? Lets say Danes and Dutch, or GB and US? Alliances are gone, but there are still allied nations.  So 25 allied screeners tag 25 allied first rates.  Should we stop all tagging before PB?

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Skully    711

I think we can all agree the PB mechanic is bad.

Having ways to turn this into a lobby and bypass OW is best left for Legends.

The incentive to hide needs to be removed. This could probably be accomplished with an expiring flag.

Tagging, more specifically troll tagging needs to be addressed as well. An engagement needs to be a real engagement  (ships need to go down). A topic for future discussion.

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Daguse    430
17 hours ago, koltes said:

There are two types of RvR players. One type is doing everything they can use to get inside and have a legit fight. The other type does everything to avoid PBs using all game mechanics possible and call the first type cheaters every time they get into PBs.

Ban for what? What is your statement? Ban pirates for having GnG battle?

 

17 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

As for the OP I would like to know how sitting in a battle 5 hours before a port battle is an exploit?   There is nothing wrong with going to a location and getting you fleet all gather up in one spot.  I mean the port battle is in 5ish hours so how exactly is this exploiting?

So why did they add the 30 min log in timer for PBs?  It's pretty obvious the devs didn't intend for players to hide prior to PBs. The intent is that you would work together as a nation to overcome screening forces. Think of the spirit of the game/rules and not the letter of the law. 

 

But don't worry, when NA legends comes out, you'll have the match play you crave so much, no screening or OW for you to deal with. 

Edited by Daguse

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9 hours ago, Duncan McFail said:

What are you crying about? We go into a battle before server shutdown. You're allowed to enter if you get into something bigger than that free cutter. And the PB is hours away after reset. We have to work hours ahead of time to try to get into a port battle because you guys can't face us in even port battle. If you want to quit because you can't have 75 guys keep us from making into the port battle then please find another game to play.

Boring response. :P

First, Ballz of Steel, the player you were speaking to, was screening in an aggie.

Everyone, I'd say is working hours ahead of time. I imagine next time we start a PB with you, your team won't have any screeners present or will you?

 

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koltes    1,729
9 hours ago, Skully said:

Tagging, more specifically troll tagging needs to be addressed as well. An engagement needs to be a real engagement  (ships need to go down). A topic for future discussion.

Its easy.

- 1 hour before PB clan with more generated hostility is able to create x25 PB group within the region of the PB

- 1 hour hour before PB defenders with more generated defense points are able to created x25 PB Screeners Group.

- x25 PB group can only be attacked by x25 Screeners group of a similar BR

- Full group needs to be in the tag distance to be able to initiate attack to ensure close proximity engagement and close fight

 

We dont mind fighting.

First they kite us to eternity then they cry that we want to avoid their screeners. Pfff stop calling this a fight.

It is your nation that has the largest population. Stop crying that enemy doesnt play by your rules and organise a proper bloody defense already. I refuse to believe that largest nation could not come up with formidable force outside their bloody capital. Its just shows that your nation does not want to have a proper fight in PB regardless. Soon as they cant screen us out of PB and prevent PB to happen they are no longer interested in defending the region. Pfff

And please GB dont give me this BS that it was not your time zone. You are the largest population nation. If one clan could organize and bring force your nation as a whole could definitely organize too. I know for a fact that you have more players after DT. This is why we chosen weekend so both sides could show.

Where do we have to go to finally meet your 1st rate fleet? Cartagena? When is your mightly Royal Fleet will stop hiding behind fir 5th rate screeners and finally meet with our Iron Fleet?

Will there be at least one PB after or before which you will not whine or cry? If your goal would have been the fight you would never had any issues with us. Its because your ultimate goal is to avoid the fight by all means possible it makes you unhappy when you DO have to fight to defend. If you say that we must play NA Legends to have proper fights, then you need to stick to Candy Crush instead of NA altogether.

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HoneyBaddger    23
30 minutes ago, koltes said:

Its easy.

- 1 hour before PB clan with more generated hostility is able to create x25 PB group within the region of the PB

- 1 hour hour before PB defenders with more generated defense points are able to created x25 PB Screeners Group.

- x25 PB group can only be attacked by x25 Screeners group of a similar BR

- Full group needs to be in the tag distance to be able to initiate attack to ensure close proximity engagement and close fight

 

We dont mind fighting.

First they kite us to eternity then they cry that we want to avoid their screeners. Pfff stop calling this a fight.

It is your nation that has the largest population. Stop crying that enemy doesnt play by your rules and organise a proper bloody defense already. I refuse to believe that largest nation could not come up with formidable force outside their bloody capital. Its just shows that your nation does not want to have a proper fight in PB regardless. Soon as they cant screen us out of PB and prevent PB to happen they are no longer interested in defending the region. Pfff

And please GB dont give me this BS that it was not your time zone. You are the largest population nation. If one clan could organize and bring force your nation as a whole could definitely organize too. I know for a fact that you have more players after DT. This is why we chosen weekend so both sides could show.

Where do we have to go to finally meet your 1st rate fleet? Cartagena? When is your mightly Royal Fleet will stop hiding behind fir 5th rate screeners and finally meet with our Iron Fleet?

Will there be at least one PB after or before which you will not whine or cry? If your goal would have been the fight you would never had any issues with us. Its because your ultimate goal is to avoid the fight by all means possible it makes you unhappy when you DO have to fight to defend. If you say that we must play NA Legends to have proper fights, then you need to stick to Candy Crush instead of NA altogether.

That just happened!

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Sir Texas Sir    3,271
54 minutes ago, koltes said:

Its easy.

- 1 hour before PB clan with more generated hostility is able to create x25 PB group within the region of the PB

- 1 hour hour before PB defenders with more generated defense points are able to created x25 PB Screeners Group.

- x25 PB group can only be attacked by x25 Screeners group of a similar BR

- Full group needs to be in the tag distance to be able to initiate attack to ensure close proximity engagement and close fight

 

We dont mind fighting.

First they kite us to eternity then they cry that we want to avoid their screeners. Pfff stop calling this a fight.

It is your nation that has the largest population. Stop crying that enemy doesnt play by your rules and organise a proper bloody defense already. I refuse to believe that largest nation could not come up with formidable force outside their bloody capital. Its just shows that your nation does not want to have a proper fight in PB regardless. Soon as they cant screen us out of PB and prevent PB to happen they are no longer interested in defending the region. Pfff

And please GB dont give me this BS that it was not your time zone. You are the largest population nation. If one clan could organize and bring force your nation as a whole could definitely organize too. I know for a fact that you have more players after DT. This is why we chosen weekend so both sides could show.

Where do we have to go to finally meet your 1st rate fleet? Cartagena? When is your mightly Royal Fleet will stop hiding behind fir 5th rate screeners and finally meet with our Iron Fleet?

Will there be at least one PB after or before which you will not whine or cry? If your goal would have been the fight you would never had any issues with us. Its because your ultimate goal is to avoid the fight by all means possible it makes you unhappy when you DO have to fight to defend. If you say that we must play NA Legends to have proper fights, then you need to stick to Candy Crush instead of NA altogether.

“Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win”


 Sun Tzu, The Art of War

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Daguse    430
1 hour ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

“Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win”


 Sun Tzu, The Art of War

I would prefer even to fail with honor than win by cheating. 
- Sophocles 

 

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Trouble    5
20 hours ago, The Red Duke said:

Here I find myself in a bewilderment.

Outlaw battle is always open and free for all ( make your own friends and enemies inside the battle).

Why didn't you enter it and sink the enemy fleet ?

If you play this game then you would know that a team that uses this tactic could never be chased down within the exploited Green on Green combat, since they would have far too much of a head start, and thus are using it to hide in combat, no way to catch them and engage them in combat, even with the fastest ships you would never catch them

 

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Skully    711

@koltes are you seeking a mechanic to address fairness or population imbalance?

The first I don't see happening in a sandbox warfare MMO. Every player will use whatever aspect he can to turn the fight in his favor. Since only Pirates can instigate Outlaw battles, I can only conclude you did the same.

I know admin doesn't want to release before the game is fair, but I think that is a lost cause.

Secondly we have proven multiple times, most recently at the taking of PaP, the having more ships available, let's us dictate the terms of battle.

Ironically this is a true naval tactic. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Command_of_the_sea

Even more funny is the counter, smuggling and privateering. In other words, be a Pirate. (Although smuggling is currently disabled.)

Your proposal will only augment a population imbalance as it makes a horde unstoppable. Start picturing Aussies using your tactics or proposals.

I shouldn't be saying this, but what if there was a true attack on the Mexican gulf.

  1. Avatar TP to Freeport needs to come back. Make a large Nation put in effort against privateering. (Avatar TP is just a mechanism to counter low server population anyway.)
  2. Bring back contracts in any port for anything. Make a smuggler smuggle something again.
  3. Bring back a low AI resource production, so land needs "maintenance" done either by traders or smugglers.

Last, 故善战者,至人而不至于人。I'm on vacation. Nor worries, I'll likely sail again next week. I might even go into a fight.

Edited by Skully

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The Red Duke    5,955
3 hours ago, Trouble said:

If you play this game then you would know that a team that uses this tactic could never be chased down within the exploited Green on Green combat, since they would have far too much of a head start, and thus are using it to hide in combat, no way to catch them and engage them in combat, even with the fastest ships you would never catch them

 

I do play this game without resorting to any loopholes and always play honest, not because of others but truly because of my own fun factor - I find the challenge quite pleasing without having to take shortcuts.

In any case and thanks to the efforts of some players an issue was reported in relation to this case.

Given most proof is in the open already we sit and wait.

 

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Ink    2,105

Outlaw battle is open for the whole duration of instance and everyone can be attacked there, case is dismissed

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