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PIerrick de Badas

Stair farming and skill slot

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PIerrick de Badas    1,052

I got the understanding on the new system of xp. It's interesting and it will help people to focus on a ship

 

More you farm on it more you get dedicated xp and more it help you to got slot for your skills

BUT

When you reach a good level on a ship, the next slots need and xp and slots on others ships

For example:

On consitution, the 3th slot need 21k xp AND 4 slots open on endemyon

On Suprrise the 4th slot need and xp and 3 slots open on renomee

etc

It's basicly a stair

You need to open the slots on the smaller ship allowing you to open slots on the ship followign etc etc if you want to open the slots on some ships.

 

If you are max rank and want to play on the 4ships you want, you will be forced to farm every ships to open the slots on this 4 dedicated ships as you will not be able to open them withtout open end slots of ships before which is necessayr to open slots on ship before which is need to open slots on ship before which etc etc etc

 

I'm really against this system, it's the one we got before steam launch and it was named an error by admin on this time. Their excuse was to force us to tests the ships we dislike to get data.

We can figure than 1.5 years after, devs got enough data on all ships to not force us to farm in cerberus to open slots on renomme or farm 3th rate to open slots on bellona or pavel.

Thans you to support it and to make devs change their mind about this crazyness.

 

Focusing on a ship to open his slots OK

Spending hours farming ships you dislike to open slots on ship you love NO

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Morty    33

hey,

i just can confirm, just unlock,the second slot to ship knowlege on my connie, and to unlock the third , i have to farm on endymion firt

totally agree with kierrip, xp our knowledge ship is a really good idea, but not have to farm on ship we dont want to play with

 

Jeanne de Belleville

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Taranis    228

I very much agree that there should be no cross dependencies.

 

Edited by Taranis

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Liquicity    2,833

Yes. Please do not force players to use ships they don't like in order to progress with ships they like. Never liked any grinding system where you have to go through vehicles which you don't like.

edit:
After rethinking it, I came to the conclusion that system might work out nicely for the future of this game and its new players.
Might suck for us who have already reached max rank ingame and know what ships we want to play, but future players will start from zero with the cutter, and by levelling up, they will also automatically unlock the slots.

Edited by Liquicity

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admin    25,970
1 hour ago, Liquicity said:

Yes. Please do not force players to use ships they don't like in order to progress with ships they like. Never liked any grinding system where you have to go through vehicles which you don't like.

You don't have to grind. You can sail with 0-3 slots on any vessel as usual.
You can even commandeer a victory on a very low rank. But to learn a frigate well you have to learn brigs well. Its how it was.

 

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PIerrick de Badas    1,052
7 minutes ago, admin said:

You don't have to grind. You can sail with 0-3 slots on any vessel as usual.
You can even commandeer a victory on a very low rank. But to learn a frigate well you have to learn brigs well. Its how it was.

 

You are basically forcing us to grind again all the ships. Just have the courage to wipe everything instead of hiding behind new features. i got a friend that got +20% reload on his ship staking fits and upgrades... how to fight a port battle 25v25 if one on the two  group has 1 or 2 more upgrade than us.

 

upgrades are supposely wipe to balance things between newcomers and vets. Now it s worst... and i may got your point between " you need o sail brig to Know how to use frigate" but it s not what we are spoken about. It s not that we need to use brig the problem but we have to master it meaning we have to master cutter meaning we have to mater lynx etc etc...

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admin    25,970
8 minutes ago, PIerrick de Badas said:

You are basically forcing us to grind again all the ships. Just have the courage to wipe everything instead of hiding behind new features. i got a friend that got +20% reload on his ship staking fits and upgrades... how to fight a port battle 25v25 if one on the two  group has 1 or 2 more upgrade than us.

 

There are hard caps - (not all are tuned). You cant get more than a cap despite the number of upgrades and bonus you installed. For example speed wont be able to exceed 15 knots. 

Regarding skills we are not forcing anyone. You can sail an un-upgraded vessel. All other vessels have some form of census. Admiralty orders - there is nothing we as captains can do.
Progression systems work well in MMOs and will work here. That "so called" freedom took away focus from ships - main content of the game. But in EVE you can't even fly(sail) a tital without months of training. Here you can. But pre-requisites will let you extract more performance out of it. 

 

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koltes    1,726
25 minutes ago, admin said:

There are hard caps - (not all are tuned). You cant get more than a cap despite the number of upgrades and bonus you installed. For example speed wont be able to exceed 15 knots. 

Regarding skills we are not forcing anyone. You can sail an un-upgraded vessel. All other vessels have some form of census. Admiralty orders - there is nothing we as captains can do.
Progression systems work well in MMOs and will work here. That "so called" freedom took away focus from ships - main content of the game. But in EVE you can't even fly(sail) a tital without months of training. Here you can. But pre-requisites will let you extract more performance out of it. 

 

In EVE you can also fly anything you like pretty fast (maybe not titans, but battleships). Most in a day old character. To fly it well you need to learn skills for that particular vessel. You are not forced to waste your time training frigates in order to get access to battlecruiser. Skills in EVE are not tied to a vessel type. So you learn skills that you need for your preffered ship and often those skills are also usable in other vessles.

Here you want us to sail brigs and grind them before I get access to my Reno's upgrades?.. As a competitive player I must have all the best on my Reno. I dont even consider the ship without it being fully upgraded. None would and thats the reality of it. Which means I must sail brig and grind it first before I get to Reno's upgrades? Sorry this definitely doesnt agree with me. I would rather have much longer grind on my Reno, than having to sail something else even though total geind time would be the same.

In history you were not nessessary had to jump ships. You could have been assigned to one ship and progress through the ranks until the opportunity presented itself and you become a captain of that ship

Edited by koltes

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Morty    33

it seems to be really close to the old system you made with rank, i meant we have to do xp to reach next rank and do 15 renome kill and 15 surprise (for example)

it was really annoying, dont do it again pls:)

i can understand unlocking 5 slots on a ship cannot be easy, but not on an other ship, the one we dont want to sail

Jeanne de Belleville

Edited by Morty

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Borch    374

While i agree that the game needs some kind of longer progress through your ranks and ships, I believe that this way of locking mods will only cause troubles. At the beginning nobody will care but later on people who play less will be considered an unwanted part of your groups. They will be weak in their ships and will only take battle slot. 

Additionaly not everyone will have an access to some rare ships, so if they get one, they will lock themselves in the least visited place on the map just to do pve until they unlock needed slots. They will be afraid to loose that 1 dure ship before they finish exp'ing.

I see this system to be a big problem in RvR and dividing even more playerbase into casuals and hardcores.

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Even if I suppose there won't be any change since it seems you have a already clearly defined idea of what you want to see happen for your game (which is fair, since it's yours..), I must admit that you seem to be going into a wall...

I guess we'll have a change in a few months, along with a vague excuse/reason for that mistake but hey... c'est l'jeu ma pauv' Lucette...

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admin    25,970
9 minutes ago, Matthieu Carolin said:

 

I guess we'll have a change in a few months, along with a vague excuse/reason for that mistake but hey... c'est l'jeu ma pauv' Lucette...

We wont see a change in a few months. Ship pre-requisites will remain. 

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admin    25,970
43 minutes ago, koltes said:

 

Here you want us to sail brigs and grind them before I get access to my Reno's upgrades?.. As a competitive player I must have all the best on my Reno. I dont even consider the ship without it being fully upgraded. None would and thats the reality of it. Which means I must sail brig and grind it first before I get to Reno's upgrades? Sorry this definitely doesnt agree with me. I would rather have much longer grind on my Reno, than having to sail something else even though total geind time would be the same.

 

You cant fly a battleship in a 1 day in EvE. https://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Raven requires 3 days of training at least (not counting support skills and missile skills). With support skills it is 3.5 weeks at least on the most forgiving Dominix (i think it is around that time or more if you actually want to use it effectively). 

You don't have to grind it every time. Just once. 
And if you don't have to grind it - you can still sail that reno just with 0-1-2 or 3 slots like everyone else who does not want to serve on the pre-requisite. Dedicated players will appreciate the extra performance they get from the vessels if they spent some in its pre-requisites. . 

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On 17/04/2017 at 11:01 PM, admin said:

You cant fly a battleship in a 1 day in EvE. https://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Raven requires 3 days of training at least (not counting support skills and missile skills). With support skills it is 3.5 weeks at least on the most forgiving Dominix (at least i remember those times. 

You dont have to grind it every time. Just once. 
And if you don't have to grind it - you can still rail that reno just with 3 slots like everyone else who does not want to serve on the pre-requisite. 

Just to know, are you making an EvE-like or Naval Action : A MMO about age of sail ? 

Stop making your game like EvE pls, if we want to play EvE, we'll play EvE.

Edited by Major General La Fayette

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Morty    33

maybe we can have more precise explanations about how it ll work exactly?

for example if i want a full slot connie, who ask 4 slot endy first,i guees to un lock 4 slot endy i ll have to grind a lower ship before, ect ect...

so we ll restart from a lynx?

Jeanne de belleville

Edited by Morty

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Siegfried    776

If I understood correctly, you are not limited to sail the next ship, only for unlock the 4th and 5th upgrade slot... I see it fair. You can sail that ship with 3 slots without problems. And sure is not so painfull to kill a few ships for unlock that slots anyway.

People is clearly over reacting here.

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TXSailor    104
16 minutes ago, Major General La Fayette said:

Just to know, are you making and EvE like or Naval Action : A MMO about age of sail ? 

Stop making your game like EvE pls, if we want to play EvE, we'll play EvE.

Yes. Thank you. Devs need to figure this out QUICKLY before everyone jumps ship.

1 hour ago, admin said:

but to learn a frigate well you have to learn brigs well. Its how it was.

 

No, it isn't how it was, and I can provide many accounts, spanning the age of sail all the way to today. You're trying to combine World of Warships with EVE, except you're not doing it well. You're only taking the BAD parts of each game, and in the process very nearly killing your own.

1 hour ago, admin said:

Regarding skills we are not forcing anyone. You can sail an un-upgraded vessel.

Yeah, okay, so, no one is FORCING you to do anything, your life is just going to suck if you don't because your maximum performance will be punished. 

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admin    25,970
15 minutes ago, Major General La Fayette said:

Just to know, are you making and EvE like or Naval Action : A MMO about age of sail ? 

Stop making your game like EvE pls, if we want to play EvE, we'll play EvE.

We are just giving an example that majority of MMOs have locked progression. In majority of games you cant use something unless you level up. We have been giving freedom right and left before and it backfired on us (also it was kinda never cherished by players, at least we never felt that you like really loved it). 

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TXSailor    104
Just now, admin said:

We are just giving an example that majority of MMOs have locked progression. In majority of games you cant use something unless you level up. We have been giving freedom right and left before and it backfired on us (also it was kinda never cherished by players, at least we never felt that you like really loved it). 

You ALREADY HAVE PROGRESSION in the form of having to rank up to crew a type of ship. You've given MORE progression in the form of having to learn a particular ship. Don't get me wrong, I really like that. I'm looking forward to it. But when you start requiring experience in a completely different ship, now you're just make a WoW grind that no one really wants.

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Remus    603

I can sort of understand the progression - you need experience on a brig to max out on a post ship, so on to a frigate, fourth rate and so on, but from what the OP says, you need the experience on a particular ship, and this surely has no validity, historical or otherwise.

3 hours ago, PIerrick de Badas said:

On Suprrise the 4th slot need and xp and 3 slots open on renomee

The Surprise and Renomee are ships of the same level - which happens to be where I am currently with my combat XP so I have played quite a bit with both. But they suit different playing styles (I favour the Renomee, btw). Arguably, trying to master both makes it less likely you will master either

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TXSailor    104
2 minutes ago, Remus said:

I can sort of understand the progression - you need experience on a brig to max out on a post ship, so on to a frigate, fourth rate and so on, but from what the OP says, you need the experience on a particular ship, and this surely has no validity, historical or otherwise.

The Surprise and Renomee are ships of the same level - which happens to be where I am currently with my combat XP so I have played quite a bit with both. But they suit different playing styles (I favour the Renomee, btw). Arguably, trying to master both makes it less likely you will master either

I can agree with that. A system that says "you have to get at least [half way] through any 6th rate ship before you can MAX a 5th rate" would be acceptable. I DON'T like the idea of "You MUST max out ship X to progress in ship Y", because it's not only an obnoxious grind forcing us to play something we may REALLY not want to, but it also has no basis of any kind in history.

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admin    25,970
2 minutes ago, Jon Snow lets go said:

@admin Please make it at least so that its equally fast to level up the ship through PvP. We dont need another PvE grind system like the rank.

You get 3x xp from pvp (for now)

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I think this is going to be a pain, but it's clearly defined and, @admin, thank you for sticking to your guns.  A grind for the best is necessary in an MMO.  In eve, your training queue is so full of core skills for so long it's not really different from this.  The basic ship skills are easy.

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6 minutes ago, admin said:

We are just giving an example that majority of MMOs have locked progression. In majority of games you cant use something unless you level up. We have been giving freedom right and left before and it backfired on us (also it was kinda never cherished by players, at least we never felt that you like really loved it). 

This is exactly right.

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