Bjerg Bjergsson

Interested

I left PvP because I couldn't keep up with crafting/ship build meta with the hours of gaming I had available. I left PvE because there was little to do besides Fleet Missions and Solo Missions and every patch seemed to cater to the PvP crowd. Will I come back for a new UI? No, but I will come back to try out the new mission types. If I stay will depend on how compelling and in-depth they make them.

Come to the PVE server! It's so calm and civilized and you can get enjoyment without the angst and venom of egos colliding.

The PVE and PVP community are at complete odds I can't ever see them "banding together". Until they do away with the ship building meta I don't see anything changing as the time investment is just too steep for any casuals. I gave up on PVP when I realized I just don't have the time to put into the game to be remotely competitive as I would need: 1. To stay current on shipbuilding meta (which ship build + upgrades are considered best for PvP and what suits my playstyle) 2. To stay supplied so if I lose a ship I won't be stuck building/gathering resources for a new one for two weeks or waiting on clan mates to build one for me (they all left anyways for the exact same reasons) 3. To keep my PvP skills honed through hunting/defending I'm now of the opinion there needs to be a separate forum for PVE as PVP is making the most noise and any PVE'er who raises their head seems to get shouted down anyways.

Please dear god yes. Get rid of modules and upgrades of all types. Make wood be the only variation and that's it. Level playing field and it is skill + crafter that makes the difference.

So for a new player with 1 fighting ship and maybe 1 trade ship they are either going to lose at PvP or lose at PvE by that regard. How do you reconcile that? If they get jumped on the way to a PvE mission? With the current system in place the new player could be in a fast ship but easily get outpaced by a PvP built warship with speed mods. If you remove mods altogether or limit them to 1-2 (versus the FORTY-SIX that exist now) then you at least enable a bit more balance and lets ships play their roles a bit better. Diversity in cosmetics + ship type/play style would take over at that point.

So mods only matter on the same skill level meaning.. mods do matter? I also hate to point out your experience as a pretty high skill level PvP player is not emblematic of a new player experience. I do think mods are a problem - certainly not the only one. PvP experience is absolutely learned and the only way to do it is by playing and getting sunk and playing more. I've fought players in PvP and done alright and I've fought players in PvP and lost. The biggest difference I found when losing was the times I didn't feel I learned anything when I got crushed thanks to faster reloads and more maneuverability - it was noticeable. Not as noticeable a difference as the old exceptional mods were back in the day but enough. Ultimately that is my point. As rediii said mods make a difference. Maybe to him it only seems so on the same skill level but when the skill level is asymmetric then the mods will help even more. The difference for a new player between a close fight - or even a pitched battle - where they can see how they were defeated and understand the mistakes they made versus a battle wherein they were just outclassed at every level does not make them feel like they have a chance. I think of War Thunder in this regard. You can get matches where you get outplayed and that's that but then there are matches where you just get humiliated thanks to max upgrades etc - and that is in a game with actual matchmaking not the OW encounters of Naval Action. The advantage of the rounds and matchmaking means that you can get in another match where that doesn't happen. In Naval Action when a PvP ship sinks your boat in such a manner the player is stuck begging on Nation chat for someone to fight the PvP-er keeping them penned into the port and if/when that doesn't happen they log out - not something we want players to be doing. Mods can have a place in Naval Action: Legends as maybe that works better with the PvP and matchmaking system but in regular NA I just think it doesn't add anything to the gameplay and instead detracts from it. If someone can please tell me though - what do they add to gameplay - I would love to hear it!

Certainly a vet vs. noob is going to be an imbalanced fight based purely on experience of player, that's in some ways my point. It is already going to be one sided, adding mods + perks + wood types on top of pure player experience only tips the scales that much further. Does this make for good gameplay for the noob? Or even for the vet? Let me ask you, what does refits/books/slots bring to the table? What do they add gameplay wise beyond speed meta and many other issues? You say you do both PvE and PvP in your ship - what is your ship and what is the breakdown of your build? Would a simplified system and build not be also PvE and PvP capable?

Problem: As I see it experienced players gaining even more of an edge over new players through ship experience and upgrades/builds. For veteran players it upgrades + mods + builds means a player must have a PvE ship and a PvP ship if they want to do both. If they are on a PvE mission and are jumped they are at a disadvantage or if they want to now PvP they have to sail back and change to their PvP build (how many times have I seen/heard "let me go back to port and get my PvP build..."). Evidence: Two players encounter each other in OW, both of them in say a Lynx. One is brand new and the other is a veteran. The new player has a base ship (say oak with oak planking) and medium 6pdrs with no ship knowledge and thus no upgrades. The veteran player can use his ship knowledge + permanent upgrade slots to fit a combination of, what.. seven out of FORTY SIX different Upgrades that when stacked can give (him as a singular example) +16% hull penetration (Bow Figure - Rattlesnake + Almeria Superior Gunpowder) or +22% hull penetration if you can stack Guacata Superior Gunpowder on top of that - not including if he is using 6pdr longs. 46 upgrades is way too many - especially coupled with the various wood combinations and planking and then add Officer Perks and you can have a crushing imbalance for a new player to try and overcome. Are all these upgrades really necessary? What do they add to gameplay other than imbalance? Why does a veteran and experienced player even need these things? The example I gave above is regarding guns but the issue travels into the speed meta problems as well. Having a handful of speed mods + wood choices + officer perks and suddenly you are untouchable in your Wasa (or pfrig etc). You can gank and run as you choose and none can touch you. Solution: Level the playing field. Officer perks are gained through experience and they provide any sort of "mod" abilities across all ships. Ship "knowledge" is Ship Veterancy and takes the form of purely cosmetic effects like sail colours or paintjobs or signal flags. Number of woods reduced to 4 or 5 (not 8) and values tweaked accordingly. In Conclusion: A player shouldn't need a PvE ship AND a PvP ship. More Byzantine systems of mods and tweaks and upgrades and perks and woods do not great gameplay make. Getting people on the water and letting player experience and knowledge decide a battle is far more fun, realistic and challenging than who has the better upgrades/speed meta.

1. Round trip meant resource gathering to utilize buildings and crafting not necessarily trading. Agreed capitals are the primary hub of trading, no argument there! 2. As Admin said there will be a re-jigging of costs so as to make shipbuilding etc not as prohibitively expensive. I used shipyard as an example but any sort of crafting buildings or resource gathering would suffer the same fate in a Clan disused port. Perhaps you are missing the point I'm trying to make regarding Clan ownership of ports, the taxation mechanic and maintenance. Tying the defense/maintenance/taxation of a port to any one Clan runs the risk of new players getting caught in the wake of that Clan's decisions. This can certainly motivate some players to get involved, but it can also put off many new players.

It's not going to be much of an issue from the perspective of an accomplished Clan or a Rear Admiral. I'm trying to view things from the point of view of a new player (as I think we all need to start doing). 5-15% is a huge difference for someone who is counting their coins (as you do at an early stage in the game). It can be the difference between good profit and barely scrapping by. Between good returns for that 2 hour round trip or a total waste of time. Maintenance being tied to tax rate is equally disconcerting for the same reason. A new player saves up and builds a shipyard in a distant port. Maintenance by a Clan that the new player has no part in is left to go slack (perhaps they are focused elsewhere or they just fold up) and now the port is basically undefended when a hostile nation rolls in. New player loses shipyard and all the wealth and investment tied to it thanks to situations totally beyond their control. They are knocked back to whatever they had back in their protected home waters. Hell I was nervous when I moved my assets to Belize! All my resources and wealth went into building a network in that region. If it was lost while I was on vacation or something I would have been back in a Cutter in KPR in no time! As it is now I'm a little worried what the wipe will entail as if it resets me back to zero.. well.. I don't know if I have much more in me. I want to add that I think there is some good Econ moves in the forthcoming patch. There is also a lot of vagaries which are worrying as well though. The RvR etc is not something I'm particularly worried about as I think there is a big gaping hole in content that comes before RvR for most players. (PvP yes, but much more as well)

Hi folks, Something that has been on my mind lately when I log in is new player content. Something that entices a player into the game and also keeps them interested. Certainly XP and gold rewards serve their purpose but they are what come after the content, not the content in of itself. Here I am proposing gameplay which can be interesting to players new and old but also perhaps educational and can teach the new players a bit of the RvR/PvP elements as well. Currently there are two types of missions: Fleet and solo missions. Using these as a basis I'm going to build on them and suggest missions that can be both rewarding and entertaining. These missions could have RvR rewards as well to the nation or be strictly player rewards (or a mix of both). 1st level mission: Protect Fisheries - Using 7th rate ships protect a small number of fishing ships (AI controlled trader cutters, trader lynxes) from attack by pirates/Nationals. These missions are based in safe zone around main port. Closed to PvP. The AI controlled ships will try and remain in a certain area (fishing) while avoiding attack for the duration of the mission. Keep 50% alive for mission success (ramp rewards up for more ships kept alive) until timer runs out. 2nd level mission: Coast Guard - Using up to 6th rate ships chase, sink or capture 5/5 smugglers in the region. OW mission encouraging player to learn the basics of attacking ships in OW. Closed to PvP. 3rd level mission: Protect Whaling Fleet - Using up to 5th rate ships protect a fleet of 5 whaling ships towards the edge of the protected zone. Open to PvP. Whaling ships are LGV types and act much the same as the fishing ships in lvl 1 mission. 4th level mission: Patrol - Using up to 5th rate ships sink or capture 5/5 enemy nation flagged warships (6th rate or above). OW search and destroy outside the protected zone. Open to PvP 5th level mission: Convoy Escort - Up to 4th rate ships. Attaches AI trade fleet to player (and group) of 5 trade ships (t. brig and above) and gives them a destination to sail to in another region. AI OW fleets will attack if close and is open to PvP. 6th level mission: Raiding - Up to 3rd rate ships. Destroy or capture 3/3 Tower or fortifications in an Enemy or Hostile port. Open to PvP 7th level mission: Blockade - Up to 1st rate ships. Destroy 10/10 enemy ships (5th rate or above) in enemy held regional waters. Open to PvP

@admin I'm concerned what a clan controlled tax rate will do to a new player who is using what little gold they have to set up a base of operations. There is a possibility that a steep increase in tax will essentially cripple their base of operations. For a new player this leaves their financial security in jeopardy as investment vs. return is dicey at the early stages. Particularly a problem if inflation becomes an issue and late game players have millions versus the new player with a Cutter and a dream. Spending coin to open up another port may be beyond their costs so their options would be: 1. Go back to PvE missions to get more coin to open another base of operations elsewhere and hope the same thing doesn't happen (fool me once..) 2. Wait it out and hope for a flip (which means either not logging in or logging in just to check the status and logging out) 3. Try and join that large clan (if you can't beat them join them..) which just means that everyone of one nation is part of one or two mega clans and the whole purpose is nullified anyways 4. Quit It's an interesting concept but I'm not sure from the perspective of a new player it is the best idea. A single tax rate for everyone regardless of income level doesn't work in real life and it can't work in game either. A 15% tax may be nothing to a Veteran Player with their piles of gold but to a new player that could be crippling and slow their growth considerably. There have been many concerns in the pages prior to this regarding new player attraction and retention and I feel like there is still a bit too much focus on the later stage of player involvement - pandering to the veterans as it were. While vets are certainly going to need pandering to, it is the early stages of player involvement that need the most work at this point.

I haven't got on the testbed because I've been struggling to grind through gold and resources to build ships so that my clan can play together. I'm happy to play risk free pvp but that's not exactly the game I signed up for.. The OP ideas sound interesting.. unfortunately most of the stuff is not helpful to me or my clan as they consist primarily of noobs or people with 1-2 hours of gaming a night/week they can do. The ship crafting is probably the best news but I have yet to see how exactly that will break down vs. the stifling issues I and my clan have now (2 months of casual gameplay to secure resources just to build a shipyard lvl2).

Docu-series to watch while you are open world sailing

Hahaha my god we have unearthed the awful truth..

Doubtless they are singing about the SOL debate..

@admin I'd be interested if you have any comments on this thread Here's an image of the WWII Online map (game is now called Battleground Europe) now obviously a Naval Map would have a lot of strategic options as well but the capture points could still predominantly be capitals which flip regions (versus fighting for every single town).

I actually really like this idea! It gives combat a direction (which is much needed) beyond the current organic system which seems more about avoiding direct combat than getting stuck in. Not only does it give the combat a direction but it gives traders and raiders direction too! Shipping to the front lines etc to support the AO. Each Admiralty could have a period "in office" perhaps based on their success rate in Attacks/Defenses. Thus there is a level of democracy to their rule (player participation decides whether they remain in office) and rewards their success. The Admiralty also allows for a modicum of unified diplomacy as well (which can obviously only last as long as they are in charge).

Do you live in Australia?

He was a new recruit so he never made a char on Global he thus has no redeemables.

Well that should make the sell easier for most of them. Only one guy (who just reached M&C pre-wipe) didn't have a char on the Global server so he will doubtless be butthurt for a while. I'm still a little on the fence about making the move but I will keep you posted if we do

That's a pretty good idea both for new players and those still struggling to adapt in this changed economy. Also - YOU HAVE CONSORTS!??? Lucky Duke

From what I understood regarding the wipe - once we cashed in our XP on the server that was it, we couldn't make the switch? Was I wrong in that?