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Fluffy Fishy

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About Fluffy Fishy

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  • Birthday July 19

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  • Location
    : La Arsenale di Venezia
  • Interests
    Venetian History, Maritime History, Martial Arts, Watersports

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  1. Player-selected ship 2017 - Final poll

    If you are going to add more super frigates (and at the risk of being a bit boring and predictable of me) you may as well look more into their conception which means Venice and the fregata grossa rated ships, first theorised as a concept in the 1710s with the first ship being launched in 1724 its a substantial shift in naval thought, its also not unlikely these ships played a more important role in the development of the US fleet than is really written about or documented, it being extremely improbable that the US constitutional delegation in Venice wouldn't have been shown these ships during their prolonged stay trying to uncover what created stable governance and society as part of other smaller tasks within the city, especially looking at maritime trade in the face of adversity, as the USA faced trying to trade in British controlled water similarly to the Venetians in Turkish dominated seas and how the nimble fregata grossa supported the mercantile fleet. Realistically the current crop of heavy frigates isn't bad either, it doesn't really need expanding on that much at least in the short term until we pad out other areas of the game. If you are looking at it from a completionist point of view it makes far more sense to add something the game doesn't currently have which is the trusty old 50 gun ship of the line like famous HMS Leopard, or perhaps something a from the line up of 50s that might be a little more unusual, either way i'd prefer to see something slightly different coming in than another super frigate for now.
  2. I think you misunderstood the point i was making slightly, although it's more likely I just explained it badly. The bulk of the frame is closer to the keel as you say and the woodwork does nearly always taper into thinner cuts as you go higher up the ship but it's not this that causes the problem in itself, live oak is a far heavier framing wood than most, it's something like 20-30% denser than standard oak if I remember correctly which means increased weight of the wood used. The effect of this increase in weight means the ships need to counteract this force otherwise a ship of the same design built from live oak would sit much lower in the water than the exact same build made from standard oak or even more dramatically compared to a softwood ship made of something like pine. To counter this generally speaking the ship would have to either take less ballast, making it more unstable, potentially even limiting the amount of sail that could be used in certain wind conditions, or modify the hull to displace more water either through depth or width which makes it slower overall. Hold space isn't really effected by the type of wood you use unless you are using poor quality wood that needs to be thicker to make up for it's poor structural properties. You don't really see a major change or difference in frames and their effect on hold space until the introduction of iron frames. It's also important to remember that the specialness of the 6 US frigates is quite overstated and distorted due to historical propaganda and that live oak doesn't give a great advantage over oak in frigate or line battles, guns will penetrate live oak without too much bother at the close ranges needed to make cannon fire at sea at all accurate which is something not really represented in naval action. The best part about live oak is it's longevity meaning similarly to teak the ship weather much better which is why we are still lucky enough to be able to visit the gorgeous USS Constitution, it does also have the advantage over teak by not being poisonous too. While we are on the topic of Constitution, feeding back into the hull shape changes, she very much has a typical design modification of a live oak ship, she takes a much deeper draft than would normally be expected of a ship of her size, allowing her to maintain a good centre of gravity below the waterline and increase her stability to make her a relatively fast ship able to carry heavy guns. The difference Constitution would have in her behaviour should she have been made out of oak or even a lighter wood with regards to speed and handling would be astonishing sadly this isnt something naval action really represents either. I hope this helps explain a little better
  3. Realistically speaking diagonal riders should increase speed slightly as there isn't so much drag from hogging, they are one of those things that you can't really balance properly with real world physics, which is why they likely get that trade off they do. Historically speaking both the US diagonals design and the more advanced Seppings method both contributed towards ship speed, they also consumed less resources as a whole, as their frame style created stronger geometric shapes so less materials could be used to get the same effect, or the same materials could be used to get a much stronger hull structure. The other issue is its not particularly difficult to understand as a concept either, so could easily be learned as a technology, balancing with physics and history is kind of a nightmare, which is a bit of a shame. Live oak on the other hand could be balanced a bit more accurately by making ships a bit less stable, the heavier wood mean that their is more weight higher up in the ship, so you are either forced to have less ballast or design a deeper draft. As it currently stands I don't believe drafts change in the game to what you equip and build your ship with, but realistically if you built a ship of the line out of live oak it would need to have a much rounder or deeper hull to support the extra structural weight, therefore the same hull form or ship design would either have to be less stable, modified slightly to give it more buoyancy (leading on to a less streamlined hull and slower ship) or be forced to take a hit on the weight of their guns by either cutting them down to be smaller guns, therefore less accurate, or alternatively just carrying a slightly lower poundage weapon, sadly different gun cuts arent in the game as it currently stands, so you can't get a short 24lb or a cut down 24lb gun, which is a shame for authenticity.
  4. The Battle of Trafalgar Video

    The YouTube channel kings and generals (previously nurrak & phoenix) has just posted a nice video looking at the run up to and the battle of Trafalgar, Its not a bad watch and is part of a longer series looking at the Napoleonic wars in general, while they are only posting trafalgar in this current series they plan to do another shorter video series in the not too distant future looking at the rise of napoleon eventually leading to and including the Egyptian campaign, so we will probably see a video looking at the Battle of Abukir/The Nile not too long away. Anyway Here is the Video, Enjoy .
  5. [Poll] Rum

    It's not complicated at all someone pretty inexperienced could do it.... It's literally a small script that needs to have a few programming "ifs" it could be written in under an hour in notepad if you wanted to, with the amount of crew on surgery/repair duty being quite easily the main balancing force here. It sounds a lot more complicated than it actually is with the main balancing force being the crew committed which can borrow code from what is already in place, while it's just a case of saying something like: If item x exists, change value y Then you just set the tick rate involved and balance it properly, the coding is easy it's getting the right values that's going to add time and resource restraints.
  6. [Poll] Rum

    Firstly, sorry for the joke post earlier, here is a more sensible suggestion. I'd personally like to see both repair kits and rum replaced with something that can be used over time rather than once with a cooldown, I really don't like the 1 kit system, it feels gamey and weird. I'd like to see rum being renamed medical supplies and used by a theoretical ships doctor, while your crew are assigned to a new role, so similarly to survival mode you will also get a surgical mode where you can toggle crew to heal the wounded and you get a tick of men coming back into action over time while medical supplies get used up at a matching rate. say if 5% of your crew is damaged, 10% of your crew can become stretcher bearers and surgeons assistants. Similarly I think the same thing should be done with repairs, where your crew have a store of carpentry supplies and it takes a portion of the crew to heal over time with bits of wood and nails stored in the hull, forming a use over time, but differentiating from medical supplies you should theoretically be allowed to include more of your crew into repairing, it should be a slow tick and again be something that is an assigned role, it should also receive a slower assignment role change when turned off, meaning while crew would tick over into doing repairs at 5/s maybe limit them going back to gunnery ect at a slower pace of 2.5/s or something, leaving the ship much more vulnerable to combat.
  7. Player-selected ship 2017 - Final poll

    Furthering on from what Bungee has said, the royal navy was extremely aware of the Napoleonic French dockyard power, similarly to how the US navy reacted to pearl harbour the French were in a position that they could if they so wanted rebuild their fleet, through having control of not only their own major naval yard facilities in Brest, Lorient,Toulon and Rochefort, but also controlled the substantial assets of Genoa, Antwerp, Rotterdam, Venice and Amsterdam, this all combined with the numerous supplies Napoleonic France had access to, such as the black forest thanks to their client state the Rhine Confederacy meant that first rates are the exception. San Josef is actually one of only a handful of first rate ships available at the time, here is a table showing the number of first rates over the Napoleonic period. First Rates In Service In Ordinary/Repairing Total 1793 1 4 5 1796 6 0 6 1799 4 2 6 1801 4 2 6 1805 6 1 7 1808 4 2 6 1811 5 2 7 1814 7 0 7 1815 0 8 8 As you can see in 1805 the Royal navy had access to 6 first rates, in total with 1 being in repair, as far as I can work out the ships in question are Victory (1765), Royal Sovereign (1786), Royal George (1788), Britannia (1762), Ocean (1805), Hibernia (1804) and Ville de Paris (1795). As you can see from the date, Victory and Britannia were dinosaurs by naval standards, despite this Victory is widely regarded as the the technologically most impressive 1st rate built in the 18th century, showing just how much effort was made to really build the best ship possible with the knowledge available at the time as an example of what Bungee stated. San Josefs capture is notable for the British mainly because of her having been forced to surrender with relatively little damage, incredibly rare for a first rate in battle due to their sheer size and high ranking within the fleet making them a target. The damage she did take was mostly in the rigging leaving her in a position to be able to be quickly refitted and then going on to serve the Royal Navy well while they repaired some of their other first rates, then going on to continue active service up until the end of the Napoleonic wars. She became a vital part of protecting the repair and refitting program following Trafalgar. I'd also like to clear up that I don't think Spanish ships are boring as Intrepido has suggested, perhaps it was something that got lost in translation slightly, I certainly hope I haven't offended anyone here as that's not what I set out to do here. I would also like to hope I treat the situation fairly, and hopefully objectively assessing all ships and navies in a well rounded way and that in my own opinion I think Montanes is just one of the less exciting ships in this specific poll. I'd also like to point out that I have thought a lot about what ships I'd personally like to see in the game, having posted a list of suggestions that not only contains Montanes and San Josef but also San Damaso and San Jose, and while I haven't named any 4th rates specifically in the thread there is no doubt a great Spanish ship in that rating bubble. Here is the full thread if you want to have a read.
  8. Player-selected ship 2017 - Final poll

    I'm not sure why John Finchham would say this, of the Spanish ships captured at Trafalgar only a handful survived the battle and the storm afterwards, so would have been impossible to survey many of them. of the few survivors all but San Ildefonso were hulked, which served as a reception hull should they have been as advanced as Fincham suggests in your quote this would not be the case, I'm also not aware of the British copying any Spanish ship designs during this period as was frequent with the French captures. I may have to look into this a little more.
  9. Player-selected ship 2017 - Final poll

    Don't get me wrong, as I said just now, I would love to see 3 or 4 ships but from what I have read so far it looks very much like we are only getting one from the poll, my hope is that the devs have also got a few ideas they are putting out regardless of the democratic outcome of what is going on here, I have a feeling that's not the case though as it seems like other development priorities are far more pressing in their books. You don't need a degree in historical Spanish naval architecture to understand how different cultural shipbuilding works, I'm pretty sure there isn't even a degree level qualification in the subject anyway, the best course I have personally seen is the naval history course offered by the University of Genoa, beyond that you are looking at least at masters thesis or more likely PhD work or more specialised non university courses working with historic dockyards or museums. Spanish and Iberian ships of the period in general are well known for being more lightly constructed than other navies, similarly the Genovese followed a very inter-lapping cultural shipbuilding history as the two nations worked quite closely together through the age of discovery into the age of sail. Spanish ships of the period were simply built to mainly act in convoy escort missions helping protect wealth coming into Spain from their new world empire and colonies. because of this the Spanish tended to build smaller ships, more broadly favouring the 70 gunner over the 74, with both these types of ships being built to more of a speed over distance than combat effectiveness, acting more as a deterrent than anything else, The Spanish fighting navy supported these weaker hulled 70s and 74s with their large first rates usually either 112 or 114 guns which were a little more robust, but again still more fragile than their British and French counterparts. The general lightness of the Spanish 74s made them much better at their day to day activities of trips to the new world and back but made them somewhat vulnerable in combat, they also had a fairly poor turn rate, being made for speed over agility. Looking more into the technological aspect, Spanish shipbuilding was somewhat behind the curve of Britain and France, having suffered greatly in the 30 years war, lost out on investment into their navy, so after this period the Spanish suffered a long period of relative conservatism, this was further solidified by the war of Spanish succession leaving them a bit behind other European navies, which is why you see the vast majority of 18th century advancements happening in Britain and France, where the French tended to perfect sailing ratios, rigging and hullform, while the British spent time advancing hull strength and additional technology like coppering. Generally speaking when comparing Britain France and Spain you see quite a large difference in what they look for in a ship, with Britain building well armoured tough ships that could spend long periods of time at sea at the expense of being a bit slower, while France created some fantastic hull forms, working to make their ships pretty good all rounders and gave them the investment to achieve this, while Spain focussed their more limited budget in creating a navy that supported their commercial interests in the new world over fighting, with lightly armoured, not particularly agile but straight line fast ships. Hope this helps
  10. Player-selected ship 2017 - Final poll

    People have since that post was made asked if there was going to be a ship of each of those ranges and it has been said that its not the case, those are just the requirements for which ever one of the next ships will be added, as far as other posts have said so its going to be either a 32-36, 50-60 or 70-80 not a 32-36 50-60 and 70-80. I would much prefer the idea of adding multiple ships but this time as far as has been announced its not the case, it was also confirmed not too far back that no other ships were being worked on for the game, although hopefully it has changed a little since then, especially as there are now 2 games sharing assets. Montanes isn't a particularly advanced ship technologically, she is a typically light built Spanish 74, Spanish ships being constructed with thinner frames and planking than designs by the French, and much more so than the British. The speed she had at the time of her running was also in part due to her being armed with a compliment of lighter guns combined with copper plating, something as far as I am aware not all Spanish ships had at the time, compared to all Royal Navy ships being not only fitted with but also having a more advanced sheathing. She is fantastic to look at, I don't have any issues with that and I'm not sure where you got that idea from but on a whole it makes so much more sense to add a more typical 70 gun Spanish ship first, they would be fun to play, add more variety and generally be a bit different. Endymion was famous for her speed which was inconsistent compared to the rest of her class by the same design, which is partly why she has such a longer and more interesting history than Severn, Liffey, Liverpool, Glasgow and Forth. She is a great ship but also just a good example of what happens and why Montanes wouldn't get her somewhat dubiously impressive speed. I'm not being impolite or at least that wasn't the intention, I'm just a bit miffed why so many people like Montanes so much, she is a fairly unexciting 74 as things go and is somewhat of a waste of a chance to get a much more interesting ship into the game.
  11. Player-selected ship 2017 - Final poll

    Unless they have changed their mind only one ship will be selected in general, so its not likely to get in at all. if this has changed please correct me with a source . Just a sad poll aiming to get Dutch, Portuguese or Venetian entry that will end in a dull Spanish ship being added, which of course will be OP to start with then people will get annoyed and it will be nerfed and there wont have been much point in her being in the game to begin with, even if it is a nice idea long term to see a 74 of the majority of nations.
  12. New 4th rate turn rates

    Why not make it more representative of 64s as a whole, they had neither the speed not the punch of a 74 which is why they became obsolete, As 50 gun frigates replaced their lighter duties and 74s made their heavier uses redundant. Wasa is crazy overpowered, especially compared to historical values, just because a ship of her class was for a period armed with 32lbs doesn't mean she should be, she should be a 24lb 60 gun 4th rate while Agamemnon should be a fair bit slower in general and constitution should have a notably worse turn rate than Bellona. Please balance with typical values not exceptional, it's like the 15kn 24lb frigate issue again and again
  13. Limit Chainshot

    That accounts for a little under half HMS Victory's round shot count and all of her specialist shot, generally speaking peacetime armaments for lineships were about 40 round for each cannon, while wartime armaments basically doubled this number to about 80 per gun, while frigates tended to carry 50 or 100 respectively. In contrast specialist shot historically really quite limited with enough for around 3-5 broadsides with the number not really changing a great deal whether at peace or war. Its also worth pointing out that these numbers are pretty consistent throughout all the European navies, while the US navy stored less round shot in favour of a more privateer style armament containing around 25% of their total ammunition as double headed and around 10% scatter shot, leaving them typically with around 35 shots per gun. To limit the number of shots an in game ship should have you should probably look at how much damage the ships can take, the NA ships are far weaker than historical values suggest, with cannons also loading a little bit faster as there is no account for fatigue or morale in NA so there is no loss over time for crew members who basically operate on peak efficiency of numbers taken from training. Realistically if we want to limit balls we need to think about this aspect as well, so as to not end up with things being skewed either way. Personally I'd like to see repairing being something you can do over time without a kit, more a resource over time, representing spare bits of wood and jury rigging going on around the ship in general, whilst mast repairs are a bit more formal with kits as they are now. when it comes to balls, I'd like to see them restricted to about 40 shots per gun for regular round shot, around 5 chain, and 8 grape, this is more than enough and represents a somewhat broadly based historical descaling to make a meaningful and fun game. Its a bit odd to see people complaining about potentially limited ammunition as a whole, no one complains about limited ammunition in shooting games, they just accept it as part of the behaviour, it also stops people needlessly trying to get for lucky shots and being a little more tactical and precious about their shots as they are a finite resource. Just to end here are the wartime ammunition counts for HMS Victory: Round, 32pdr: 2400. Round, 24pdr: 2800 Round, 12pdr: 4200 Round, 68pdr Carronade: 84 Grape, 32pdr: 90 Grape, 24pdr: 112 Grape, 12prd: 168 Grape, 68pdr carronade: 7 Case shot, 7 Grape in tin. Double headed (Chain/Bar), 32pdr: 90 Double headed, 24 pdr: 84 Double headed, 12pdr: 126 Paper cartridge (Gunpowder), 32pdr: 2580 Paper cartridge, 24pdr: 2996 Paper cartridge, 12pdr: 4728
  14. Earliest Deep Sea Navigation Tool Found

    I saw this article from BBC news just now talking about finding an astrolabe, the earliest form of deep sea navigation. The find is the earliest of its kind, dating back to about 1495-1502. The find was uncovered in the Indian Ocean on the wreck of a a ship named Esmeralda, and was part of a fleet lead by the Famous Vasco da Gama. Its always quite exciting to see discoveries like this, especially as maritime archaeology is such a surprisingly young field. Full Article here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-41724022?SThisFB Here is an example of a slightly later model of an Astrolabe, showing a little more how it might have looked, and how they were used, somewhat similarly to a sextant later on by measuring angles.
  15. Today is a fairly huge date in naval history, especially in the USA and UK, with it being 212 years since Trafalgar, and perhaps a little more of a landmark due to the fact its a round number 220 years since the launch of the famous USS Constitution, today on facebook Naval Action has been making quite a few posts commemorating the birthday of the oldest floating warship, most notably the post here; I am very curious to what this is eluding to, does this mean the work is going ahead despite the kickstarters, or perhaps the kickstarters will start to dribble out soon, which can only be good for the game. Whatever the news, it looks like things are looking up. I do hope they rebalance her to have a more typical load out though, I'd really like to see her with a slightly reduced load out more typical to the one she received after 1815. The Other posts Naval action has shared today are: Happy Trafalgar and Constitution day everybody!
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