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Fluffy Fishy

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About Fluffy Fishy

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  • Birthday July 19

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  • Location
    : La Arsenale di Venezia
  • Interests
    Venetian History, Maritime History, Martial Arts, Watersports

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  1. Give Ships Melee Values

    The opening broadside to Bucentaure was loaded with a treble shot of round, and that the full broadside fired weighed 3444lb (1566kg/1.9 Imperial tons). The record doesn't state any grape/cannister being involved.
  2. Give Ships Melee Values

    Something I would quite like to see put into the game is a clear indication of a ships combative ability in a melee. It would be nice to see different ships gain a more of a visual number, with some being given higher values than others with potentially including an offensive or defensive value based on various points. This may even add some interesting new tactical thoughts into the faster ship, usually one being built lower and longer having a poorer ability to board a slower higher sided ship. The values I see as being important are: Height - The advantage of height in combat is quite a substantial one, being able to send musket volleys and grenades down from above gives you a huge difference in combat effectiveness Prominence of Fore/Aft Deck - Similarly to height, a strong fore or aft castle/deck is a very difficult place to attack, although not so prominent in this period as only a couple of ships feature these to much degree. Number of Cannon Ports - Attacking a ship with lots of holes in it leaves for easy pickings compared to one with a solid hull Angle of Hull - Climbing a vertical hull is a lot more taxing and difficult than one with a shallower angle to it. Covered/Uncovered Quarterdeck - Covering a quarterdeck comes somewhat under the fore/aft decks but again having a more structured and covered deck leaves much greater defensive values How open the weather deck is as a whole - This includes how filled in the waist is, a single sparred deck without a waist will suffer in hand to hand combat when compared to a deck composed of many different levels. Less important might factors include: Length - The length of a ship is somewhat important, as it means there is generally more chance for a counter attack to be mustered. It can also mean that forces are more spread out Larger Masts - Larger masts and arms will mean more opportunity for ropes to be used to swing men over, it also means there are better positions for snipers to hide. How open the gun decks are - While not quite as important as the weather deck, the designs of the gun decks and how difficult it might be to manoeuvre around them, a more open deck is also more easily traversed and attacked by an unfamiliar aggressive crew. These values should also interact and affect the importance of each other, where for example the height of the ship will be somewhat negated by having a large number of gun ports, for example the Santissima is a very high ship but its massive amount of gun ports leave it vulnerable to attacks from better equipped and drilled marines attacking the exposed gun crews. Taking another ship as an example, the USS Constitution, would be an interesting case as she is relatively exposed with a long almost continuous weatherdeck, however she again is very high, almost as much as her contemporary 64s and not far off the 74s, meaning she would really struggle in an engagement with ships taller than her but be really quite effective against those who have a shorter profile. Ideally I'd like to see a fluid system where each of these and possibly more can interact to make a more natural combat system, where ships have strengths and weaknesses in combat that are properly represented as is now, where it makes a lot more sense to use various actions over others and try to force play to the best of your ship, hopefully as part of a system that breaks away from the rock paper scissors of today. If anyone has any extra ideas for this kind of thing I would love to hear them, as ever thank you for reading
  3. HMS Victory wrong paint scheme

    Victory is painted a faint salmon pink because that's how she was at Trafalgar (perhaps kiss me Hardy isn't such an awful misquote after all). She has had many different paint jobs over her many years of service, the pink and black is just one of them, she was also yellow and black, black and white, and red and yellow, and red and black, there are a also few other colour schemes that she donned during her lifetime moving with fashion and material supply. Victory in the game also is somewhat different to how she would have looked at Trafalgar too but not many people seem too fussed by that, the original hull and design has shifted slightly but noticeably enough away from Slade's original plans after she was extensively rebuilt in 1800 after the battle of Cape St Vincent, she was also rebuilt again in 1814, again to a slightly different design. The HMS Victory we have today and in the game is subtly quite different to how Slade and Nelson would have known her in 1765 and 1805.
  4. Agamemnom

    The threedecks ratings pages are probably better to use to emphasise the point here as it shows progression pretty nicely, Agamemnon is technically a 3rd and a 4th over the rating system thanks to the changed over time. https://threedecks.org/index.php?display_type=ship_rates We could always just go Dutch/Venetian and make everything above around 64 a first rate The issue with this is there's not a good enough stock of ships to pull this off, its not like battle fleets really had this mix unless you count the support ships involved. Sadly the reality is we need more of a system where there are more ships for starters, with benefits and drawbacks of playing different ships, say lighter 3rds vs heavier 3rds with a real mix up of nationality and build types to better represent different play styles, sadly that would take an incredible amount of time and money to program in.
  5. HMS Unicorn

    You could also say the same thing about a quite a lot of ships in the game though, why not a different Leda class, why Bucentaure, why Agamemnon? So many of these could potentially be replaced so you can have a fancier looking figurehead but I'd personally prefer a good and interesting history than picking ships for having a fancy model on the bow My understanding is also that one of the main requirements for a ship being developed is that it has a very strong record of its specifications and history, with the Trincomalee foundation and museum providing great details into this, it also helps that the ship can be visited and inspected in great detail much how it was during it's service, unlike unicorn which looks quite different from the original Leda plans.
  6. HMS Victory needs you

    Having followed the ship for a little while now I noticed today that there are currently two jobs going for aspiring shipwrights and riggers, if you like to play with model ships or ropes, or better yet ropes on model ships this may be the job of a lifetime, sadly however there are some limitations to who can be taken seriously as an applicant but who needs qualifications when you can make up for it in enthusiasm. Make Sir Thomas Slade proud and restore the greatest 1st rate of the era. I'm sure all you really need is the Haynes Manual and some plucky spirit. Available here: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/0857338315/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1499399948&sr=8-2&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_FMwebp_QL65&keywords=hms+victory&dpPl=1&dpID=51EdC-G6FxL&ref=plSrch While somewhat more exciting part of this is that they will be attempting to rig her up over the next few years giving her the much more historic and authentic look, having been to the Cutty Sark not too long ago I have to say looking at the rigging was one of my favourite parts of the experience. For more information on the jobs and others like it visit here: https://www.nmrn.org.uk/about-nmrn/current-vacancies
  7. American Independence and the Frigate of Freedom

    L'Hermione really is a stunning ship but I'm not convinced the fighting capability of French navy was nearly as influential in the war as is portrayed, with the only major sea battles being Cape Henry and Chesapeake bay where both of these battled combined only resulted in the loss of 1 British ship. The true strength comes from the huge input of French supplies and land support, both through troops proper and the helping of training given the revolutionary troops given by French officers. Its also important not to underplay the other supporting nations and their role in helping America into being, The Dutch, The Spanish and all of the more minor parties in the conflict. While I don't aim or want to take too much away from the celebrations today, personally what impresses me most about the conflict is how the British operated an equivalent naval strength while being at war with the majority of continental Europe, and more importantly, being out numbered at sea in raw values by almost 3 to 1. This was mostly due to the huge efforts played by British shipyards, performing their maintenance tasks with incredible efficiency, but also the dramatic effect that coppering had on allowing for less time in docks and more time at sea, leaving the British fleet closer to being only slightly out numbered through most of the war, almost to the point where the numbers of active vessels were evenly split to each side. For those of you who are celebrating, have yourselves a really fantastic day!!
  8. for Deck Roll disturbance coming from a Broadside?

    The reason battles are so fast in the game are more to do with realistic penetration and damage values, crossed with slightly faster reload speeds and much more flimsy planking, I'm not sure if you were about when they did it but the devs did try a more accurately valued patch where there were much truer values for wood strength, interestingly though although operating on values without considering various fatigues a crew would come under the cannon values aren't too far off. When it comes to fighting battles, it wasn't often the case that much cloth was shown, this was for all kinds of reasons, for example, it would require less crew to manage the sails leaving more for the guns, too much sails would create more instability for the ship in combat, they would limit the effectiveness of snipers in the rigging, and if things went sour it was a lot easier to unfurl sails and run than it would be to repack them, that's possibly one of the most important key differences between NA and real life situations. So fights would be fought at much slower speeds as you said, around 3-5 kns, depending on things like weather and desired tactics. The angular difference the heel would make and the raising of the centre of gravity involved with more torque being applied to the sail would certainly be enough to cause issues with stability, but again you would see the affect giving much more punishment towards accuracy of fire before you saw anything risking a capsize, people are still rational and with most sailors being unable to swim they wouldn't risk enough force from firepower. The force over time thanks to the rope systems in place combined with the appropriate weighting of ballast, slowing of the ship compared to its full speed for fighting and the general design of the hull would almost stop this entirely If you want to think on more practical terms, consider how water doesn't compress very easily, and if you apply a sudden impact of force it actually behaves with a lot of resistance, with high impact properties not too unlike concrete, firing a cannon would have a shock compressive force as the hull is driven into the water, the water would almost entirely resist, with the important element being the centre of gravity and balance. Does this help answer your questions?
  9. for Deck Roll disturbance coming from a Broadside?

    Its not the case that the ship wouldn't have any effect at all, but sustained fire wouldn't really create much more of an impact that wouldn't be seen as a part of its general sailing characteristics, for example if you had, say a ship of the line who's ordinary sailing characteristics would see her heel perhaps 3 degrees and roll a further 2-3 in the waves, firing guns might create a further roll of 1-2 degrees although this would largely be compensated for by using less cloth in battle, most SOLs weren't really designed to tilt more than around 4 degrees in battle while frigates would sometimes double the numbers above. Ships were specifically designed not to sway too much by the mid to late age of sail because too much differentiation in height made it a huge amount more difficult to keep aim, especially as most cannons of the period either operated on a system where wedges were driven between the carriage and the gun to determine height of aiming, while fancier models operated on a screw system where it would be rotated to change the vertical aim, both these systems were poor at dealing with much change in the differentiation of height. Frigates would behave slightly differently, largely due to them having shallower drafts and their main gun deck being comparatively higher than that of a line ship, meaning shooting would have a slightly larger effect but again it would be pretty negligible. I think what most people refer to when it comes to wanting recoil in the game is the animation of guns shooting backwards into the hull of the ship, before being reloaded and redeployed, so what you are looking at isnt the same kind of recoil you would get in say an FPS game where the gun moves around as you shoot, but a system that pushes the force backwards, if you want to see how it works its probably worth reminding yourself with a few of the battle scenes from Master and Commander, where the system of ropes and pulleys absorb the backwards motion created by the shot, but if you want to learn more about the behaviour of the ship I would certainly check out the book I mentioned earlier. Here is the ISBN 13 number, you can get the ISBN 10 from the digits after the dash: 978-1844863099 Below is an amazon link (for the UK store) https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1844863093/ref=olp_product_details?_encoding=UTF8&me=
  10. for Deck Roll disturbance coming from a Broadside?

    You probably won't find a distinct calculation because there are so many variables involved. The best you will likely get without a PhD in physics is looking at recoil values themselves for specific cannons taking specific loads. The actual roll would depend on how tender the ship is, how deep or wide the hull design is, how heavily the ship is currently heeling but also the positioning of the cannons themselves and how it compares to the ballast and centre of gravity for the vessel in question. The pulley system in place by the late 18th century also means a lot of the force is dissipated over time so it won't have a huge affect on how the ship in question would change in the water, especially when considering that guns were fired in quick succession and not all at once in a massed volley. You could get a very basic idea from combining texts on cannons and the information contained in books like "Seamanship in the Age of Sail: An Account of Shiphandling of the Sailing Man-O-War, 1600-1860" The ballasting, tactics and design of ships of the line at least would easily compensate for the guns fired, this is why you dont hear many accounts of ships capsizing in battle unless sand bars or a lot of damage are involved. Sorry this probably isn't the answer you are wanting but I hope It helps at least point you in the right direction.
  11. Rifling Cannons

    Now players can build their own cannons might it be time to add the possibility for people to rifle their cannons at the expense of a lot of labour hours and perhaps some specialist drills as an extra expendable resource that you can craft to be able to produce rifled cannons, leaving them as an expensive nice to have. With rifled cannons being invented in the late 15th century and appearing in their true form by the 16th century, and there are also quite a few examples from the Napoleonic period the history is perfectly acceptable, even if they were somewhat rare among most navies until the 19th century. There are examples of the British toying with them from 1772 although it sounds like neither the French, or British used them extensively, Venice certainly did, and continued rifling their guns from at least 1540 onwards, especially their bronze armaments constructed in the Arsenal shipyard. When it comes to balance, I would suggest rifled cannons have longer range, and better accuracy and penetration, however they would be quite expensive in resources and time and and do slightly less damage to crew.
  12. Chain shot

    Double headed shots were actually really quite limited in supply for all ships in navies except the USA, who carried a lot more than anyone else. Generally speaking most ships of the line carried around 4-5 broadsides of chain shot while frigates would carry 6-7 worth. I'm personally in favour of limiting all ammunition in the game, with much more severe limitations to anti personnel and double headed shot. If a game as casual as call of duty does it, why does a much more hardcore game not, bearing in mind the size of traditional stocks of ammunition within a ships store its not like it would be a big problem, with most ships carrying around 60 broadsides worth with 70-90 of powder, limiting ammunition to each battle instance would go a long way to making the game more authentic without restricting gameplay much, but if anything making it a lot more tactical.
  13. Restoration for Falls of the Clyde

    People may have missed this but there is now a restoration project to restore Falls of the Clyde, here is an article from the honolulu news talking about the project supposed to be taking the historic iron ship back to Scotland to be restored back to her original glory, I have to say I'm not a big fan of iron ships but this actually has me quite excited, I hope it brings some good exposure not just towards maritime history but restoration of historic ships in general, the more projects people have going the more it will be in people's minds and the more people will get together and take part in other projects. The article link here: http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/story/35721270/plans-afoot-to-give-historic-falls-of-clyde-a-second-life-in-its-scottish-birthplace
  14. Danish-Norwigian Line ships

    May you spare a moment to talk about the ships of Venice?
  15. 8 teams: a failed idea?

    Is no one going to point out the real weirdness of the suggestion of Poland being a thing? Poland was a landlocked country for the main part of the vague date of the game here (by the map being something between 1790-1803). Prussia would be a fairly odd choice too as they were such a land force oriented country. Why not Switzerland?
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