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'De Zeven Provinciën' Dutch Warship 1665 (With plans)


Jay Gatsby

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And what about the story of the ship?

To my knowledge, not much is know either besides some general data.

I find it strange that a ship of her caliber would not be present in any of the naval battles of the Batavian Republic.

 

Guns total: 70

26 x 30-pdr, 28 x 18-pdr, 16 x 8-pdr

Lenght (ft.) 180

Beam (ft.) 48

Depth (ft.) 21,6

 

Sold for breakup in 1839

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There are other classic Dutch flagships which do fall in the game timeline - I'm struggling to find much in the way of details of the 1694 De Zeven Provincien, but there's a few contemporaries of note with information available -  like the 92-gun Prinses Maria (1683), the 90-gun Beschermer (1691), and the 96-gun Vrijheid (1695) - and a few ships that would be interesting if information could be found, like the 100-gun Eendracht (1703).

 

Beschermer is a famous name in and of itself, while the ship has 36-pounders on its main gun deck (most of these ships are listed as carrying 24-pounders) and, for bonus points, is a false three-decker like the 1665 D.Z.P. so would have a very similar silhouette.

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What about the Vrijheid? Another third rate (74 guns) is always wellcome. She looks nice

My thoughts as well. I actually proposed Vrijheid in the last Player Ship Selection poll. Like a bunch of the other proposals, though, she got slaughtered, and at the end she only had 28 votes. :(

Edited by Arvenski
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The shipbuilding program instigated in 1680 was an agreement between the admiralities to field 15 170 ft. Long warships.

These large ships would all be armed around 80-100 guns, yet sadly no plans have survived.

Regatdong the 1694 zeven provincien:
The dutch archibes have nothing on her at all. Yet there is a shipmodel website that claims to have her plans. I find it somewhat sketchy and the price of €55 is somewhat much for me to figure it out.

Despite all that, keep in mind that these ships are still very early in the timeframe and might as well be denied due to old age. The 1721 ingermanland is even frowned upon by some because she looks out of place between the 1780-1820 warships.

 

 

2b512b7f0e132ed3a275f29551b9ecff.png

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(Please note that the following is intended as a critique, but not as a criticism)

 

In the previous poll there were 4 Dutch ships, which did split up the 'vote for something Dutch' votes more than was necessary; two (Vrijheid and Mars) were addressing roles already covered by existing ships rather than gaps in gameplay, while Admiral de Ruyter was presented largely on its name and there wasn't enough information to clearly differentiate it from the Pavel. That left Dordrecht, and a two-decker with less firepower than the Constitution is going to be a hard sell.

 

If a future poll comes around, there should be a discussion about picking one or two Dutch ships with distinctive roles to bring into the final poll.

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(Please note that the following is intended as a critique, but not as a criticism)

 

In the previous poll there were 4 Dutch ships, which did split up the 'vote for something Dutch' votes more than was necessary; two (Vrijheid and Mars) were addressing roles already covered by existing ships rather than gaps in gameplay, while Admiral de Ruyter was presented largely on its name and there wasn't enough information to clearly differentiate it from the Pavel. That left Dordrecht, and a two-decker with less firepower than the Constitution is going to be a hard sell.

 

If a future poll comes around, there should be a discussion about picking one or two Dutch ships with distinctive roles to bring into the final poll.

There is actually quite some infotmation about the admiraal de ruyter, it just wasnt provided in there.

Currently im on my phone, ill post some in the morning

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I'm aware that there is plenty of information about the De Ruyter and the other Wreker-type two-deckers.

 

(from threedecks: http://threedecks.org/index.php?display_type=show_ship&id=24682)

 

Main gun deck: 28x36 pounders (Dutch)

Upper gun deck: 30x30 pounders (Dutch)

Upper works: 2x60-pound carronade, 6x30 pound carronade, 14x12 pounders.

 

Translating her upper works to 22x12 pounders and her 30-pounders and 36-pounders to 32 and 42 pounder guns, her armament comes out at 1200 pounds. If you do as was done with the Bucentaure and add an extra pair of guns to her main deck, it comes out at 1242 pounds, all of highly-penetrative guns.

 

The poll post really undersold her - a Wreker-type like De Ruyter or Chattam would be an impressive second-rate in-game.

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De Ruyter was one of the "Wreker" class ships. Originally build for 80 guns, upgunned and upgraded to 90+ guns.

Bascically what they did is to arm the whole weatherdeck with 36pd carronades. On the Chattam you see the positions on which they mounted the carronadeson. (mid to fore- weatherdeck)

 

If you dig deep, as Steel can, you find tons of information.

In Steel's Dutchships list he also postet the"wreker" and "Chattam" which both are frm the same class of ships as the admiral

 

Chattam:

Cj059jS.png

wreker:

IteOKh6.pngzHu4L8F.png

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The upgraded version of the ship carried an immense armament, dutch 36-pdr equivalent to 39.3 English pound -> 42-pdr ingame. Dutch 30-pdr equivalent to 32.7 english Pounds -> 32-pdr ingame. Dutch 36-pdr carro -> ingame 42 carro.

 

To add to bungee's two above, an overview of all ships in the class, two more plans posted.

 

Wreker (plan posted above)

Chatham (plan posted above)

Admiraal Zoutman

De Ruyter

Leeuw

kkEwHR0.jpg

Admiraal de Ruyter

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Admiraal Evertsen

 

 

 

Aditional pictures of the Admiraal Zoutman:

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Aditional pictures Admiraal Evertsen:

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glY4DJJ.png

 

Admiraal de Ruyter aditional pictures:

AnoOtoc.png

 

Z0AxJTP.jpg

 

H1Nn0tn.png

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  • 3 months later...

Really loving those pics Steel!

20 hours ago, GreatTimo said:

I would love to see this ship in naval action, The Seven provincies is my favorite ship of all ships that ever excisted.... and excist.. i pray that this ship will come into naval action, thats one of my dreams..

Won't happen.

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  • 2 weeks later...
2 hours ago, BungeeLemming said:

for shitz and giggles (and my own interest in this vessel after visiting the batavia werf) I am modeling her and releasing updates on sketchfab.

This ship model is purely for my own interest and is not intended to make it ingame. That said: enjoy the eyecandy ;)

https://skfb.ly/TRSA

I visited the Batavia werf a number of years ago before the fire that damaged De Zeven Provincien. I recall there was a platform you could climb to view the keel and framing that had been completed. Sadly I hear there is no money to finish her now.

Bungee I do like your drawing of De Ruyter of course :D

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;) (wont say anything about that)

You should keep a look at the 7 prov once a month or so. Its roughtly the timeframe for another update since I am very unfrequently modeling on her. But when I do, I add things here and there and you might have to look out for them.

A few moments ago I uploaded a new progress where I worked on the bowsection and corrected a few errors here an there. (main mast interfering with a grating, gunwale not ending at the stern, etc)

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Do you reckon also make the 1694/5 variant bit more in timeframe. Steel and me have dicussed what might be the case with th 1694/5 variant 92/4/6 gun is, that she is the 7 Provinciën with no flush deck (if i say correctly)and might have some different decorations. Have been tracking your work for a while, nice job on the ships. numbers are depending on the source

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I model her according to the plans, steel gave me in advance. That and the flickr link which includes loads of information about her.

I guess the plans I got represent her "original" build state. And hence she will look like when she was launched. One thing I did however is to load her with the full 36pd armament and full 18pd on the mid deck. I dont have any cannon shortage ;)

And no matter the armament, she would be a very competitive ship - going in straight lines^^

flush deck means to have an enclosed weatherdeck. such as on the santisima trinidad. and on mid 19th century frigates when they loaded those full with guns eventually.

I am not sure if the 7 prov ever had a flush deck by that means. She is an old design with a very destinct forecastle and a high stern. Build with the intent to board the enemy.

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Well, according to records known of the 1694/5 variant she would have atleast got 12 more guns than the orignal of 1665. From this point it is speculation because of the lack propper plans. Steel and me had a discussion wether the ship would be of new design or based to a high degree on the old(1665) design. After the discussion and some research work from steels side, that the ship would be based in a lot of ways on the old design but that instead of a interrupted top deck it would have a flushdeck (makes sence because of the higher gun count), because of the time when the old(1665) was decommisioned in 1694 and the new brought to service in 1694/5, depending on the source, and include for shipbuilding at least 1.5 years prior the decisions to shipbuilding aprovement and she would have had different kind of decorations and/or colour. 

Edited by pietjenoob
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  • 1 month later...
  • 3 years later...
On 4/8/2015 at 3:00 PM, Jay Gatsby said:

This ship is a third rate, and not a second rate. The thirds rates are from 64 to 80 guns, while the second rates are from more than 80 to 98 guns.

Correct even Admiraal de Ruyter is third rate and it has 82 guns.

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  • 5 months later...

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