BungeeLemming

Mystery ship

31 posts in this topic

Ahoy ship enthusiasts,

I am currently working on another, new vessel. The plans are not completely on the forums and I am undecided weather or not I shall share them. Most likely I will upload scaled down versions of those since I had to buy them myself.

This thread is going to be a puzzle as long as you dont get the right answer. And I believe this time the vessel in question is a bit harder to find. Good luck and here I go:

 

I am pretty certain I am the first person to model and publish images of her. She was never build but approved by the authorities. Means she would have been build if the money was at hand.

Her dimensions would have been:

  • Length                     202' ("national" fot) -> ~60m
  • Breadth                   53' -> ~ 15,73m
  • Draught Forward     22' -> 6,53m
  • Draught Aft              23' -> 6,82m

Armed with:

  • 30*42pd
  • 32*30pd
  • 32*18pd

and a crew of ~830

 

 

Sternsection:

 

mysteryShip_01.thumb.jpg.7076e9444c9498cc88fd7707a7e8b92b.jpgmysteryShip_02.thumb.jpg.9c27ab804f88e82770c61b8787bed8b1.jpg

 

Sideview [WIP]

 

mystery_ship_side.thumb.png.55788f85ee21249b967992ed6265fd17.png

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I feel like it's something Dutch or Swedish, or atleast north european in design.
But i am very intrigued, will keep on looking for possible candidates.

Keep up the good work Bungee!

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Posted (edited)

41 minutes ago, BungeeLemming said:

Mystery ship [...] harder to find

 

16 minutes ago, Roelandus said:

I feel like it's something Dutch

Obviously the Flying Dutchman.

Edited by Captain Jean-Luc Picard
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Could it be the one we have talked about? :D

Even if it is not, it looks very promising!

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Id like those who know to not spoil it :)

In your case Sella its not the ship I specifically asked you about. But its from that delivery I talked about ;)

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I know I know I know!

Maybe.....

 

I can say this, it won't be easy for people to find out what ship it's :)

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Finally, some trade vessels are getting some love.  Hate spoiling it for you all, but I'm just too excited to see the Irish Rover in game :P

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3 minutes ago, Powderhorn said:

Finally, some trade vessels are getting some love.  Hate spoiling it for you all, but I'm just too excited to see the Irish Rover in game :P

27 masts??

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34 minutes ago, Remus said:

27 masts??

Only 23.  27 would be silly. :D

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She's either an older ship toward the beginning of the timeline for NA, or she's Dutch or Baltic in design, as Roelandus indicated, if that stern's anything to go by.

Or is she out of timeline Bungee?

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first i thought some kind of galley, perhaps one of the swedish archipelago fleet . But dont find similar pictures. so i dont know.

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She is indeed inside the games timeframe. Given the ammount of glass already you can conclude that she isnt in the 7provinces timeframe. When this dutch vessel was build glass was freking expensive and therefore not plenty to spare on ships.

She is not a ship for shallow water operations like the archipelago fleet. And the upper solidwork on the image you see is a balcony that runs all around the galery. Have to see how she will look at the sides, cant remember out of my head.

 

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How expensive was the glass used in her construction, especially as a comparison to main costing of the ship?

Doing a little bit of research into the subject using the sources I have available I done a little look into HMS victory, which cost at the time £63,176, equivalent to around $70m in today's terms. HMS Victory has 27 gallery windows on her stern, roughly, and quite conveniently around 1 square metre each, although frustratingly I can't get an estimate on how thick the glass was, so will have to use a modern estimate of about 4mm, which again conveniently a square metre of glass weighs about 10kg.

Feeding these numbers into my own sources I have a price for the period for glass panes used in windows, produced in Venice during this time, the specific data coming from 1779 leaving me with a market price of 4.05 ducats per 100 (Venetian) pounds, taking into account currency value, where a Venetian ducat was worth around $40-50 in today's monetary terms, this means a rough cost of between $700-750 per hundred pounds, which also makes easy calculations because 100 Venetian pounds is almost exactly 30kg.

Taking all these numbers into the process and provided I have got my maths right you end up with the rough total raw cost in glass for the HMS Victory's stern windows at about $6300-6750 for the raw materials, which seems remarkably cheap, even considering the extra cost of having the 9 individual panes for the windows adding to the cost perhaps driving it up to around $10,000. I think the real cost involved would likely be the man hours and craftsmanship when it came to transporting safely and fitting them, because what it looks like is that the cost of glass was only around 7 times more expensive than it is now, which to me doesn't seem too extortionate in comparison to other materials during the time period. I would also assume that a glass fitter was much rarer and more expensive than a carpenter, similarly to how glass fitters are one of the more expensive people to hire for modern home renovations.

I do hope I have my rough calculations right here otherwise I have spent quite a lot of time making a fool of myself.

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What I was talking about is 1660s market prices.

Glass was more fragile and thus didnt have much use for ships. And it was expensive.

I do not however have any sources to proov my claims. This comes from my memory.

 

oh and when I tell you the time of construction of the ship I model - everyone knows a bit more - I dont want to share that yet.

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11 minutes ago, BungeeLemming said:

What I was talking about is 1660s market prices.

Glass was more fragile and thus didnt have much use for ships. And it was expensive.

I do not however have any sources to proov my claims. This comes from my memory.

Is that a hint when the ship is from ;)?

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12 hours ago, Fluffy Fishy said:

Is that a hint when the ship is from ;)?

 

He's dropped several hints from the looks of it.  He's confirmed she's indeed Dutch, and that date hint has me curious.

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Unless that sternwork is going any higher Bungee, she's definitely a mystery.  Been looking on the forums for a bit now, and seen a few that might be close, but those damnable windows keep throwing things off.

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I never said she ws dutch.

I said the 7prov is dutch. But I see where your statement comes from.

You know that she is

  1. inside the timeframe of thegame. that is 1680 to 1820.
  2. She is not a shallow draught vessel
  3. a new one: she is to be found in one o the collection threads. (but its damm hard to conclude correctly since there are no sternviews available here)
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is it the  Lady Lovibond

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On 16-5-2017 at 2:31 PM, Remus said:

27 masts??

And was rigged fore and aft...

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not going to say anything.

but youll have a hard time fitting 27 masts on this hull:

mystery_ship_side.thumb.png.55788f85ee21249b967992ed6265fd17.png

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I didn't figure you for modelling a line ship.  94 guns I count.  First guess is British, but perhaps there are others that may fit the bill.

 

I'm certainly stumped.  Unless someone misplaced the British collection thread, or you haven't added any guns to the forecastle/quarterdeck, I do not see her anywhere.

Could she be HMS London (1766)?

 

Edited by Haratik
Either Or

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When I look for british 2nd rates of 94-98 guns they all have a three story Sterngallery.

My model only has two. And no poopdeck compared to the british counterparts. At least not on the plans I use to model her.

The guncount is correct. and the lowest guns are 42 pounders.

I am currently still working on the Stern. Her upper gallery is hard to figure out along the plans. But Ill manage. With the help of other reference that is.

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51 minutes ago, BungeeLemming said:

When I look for british 2nd rates of 94-98 guns they all have a three story Sterngallery.

My model only has two. And no poopdeck compared to the british counterparts. At least not on the plans I use to model her.

The guncount is correct. and the lowest guns are 42 pounders.

I am currently still working on the Stern. Her upper gallery is hard to figure out along the plans. But Ill manage. With the help of other reference that is.

 

Then I'm at a loss, what you mention here isn't in any of the official collections.  At least, she doesn't exist in pictures.  I've gone over them today.

 

Edit:  Unless she's a specific Dutch vessel after a restructure.  And since you've already done the Admiraal de Ruyter, albeit a rough version, I'm going to guess it's the Chattam rebuilt?

 

Edit*: 42 pounders by the English standard?

Edited by Haratik

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