PVP Zones, An Alternative to PVE Zones.

[Fluffy Fishy]

With the merger of PVE to the PVP servers likely on its way soon I would suggest a different approach to the system proposed by the dev team. I feel like the current system that has been outlined for the future doesn't really benefit either PVE players or PVP players. While I imagine this post may receive quite a large amount of criticism I thought I would make some points to throw down an alternative to what has been suggested by the dev team.

The main point of my idea would be to almost entirely turn the plans PVE and PVP inside out, instead of having a PVE zone, have PVP zones instead but to make them more dynamic by utilising similar mechanics already in place.

Thanks to the region mechanic we can contain player vs player violence to certain points of the map, this both benefits the PVP players as they have a higher concentration of opponents but also PVE players as they can enjoy the sea and fighting their various NPC opponents or fulfilling missions or trading. This also goes with more traditional MMO models of implementing PVP, so is a good and effective system, but also something that works well and has been tested before in other games.

As part of this I would like to see no area of the map safe from port battles, but make port battles something that becomes an organic area of conflict where each nation can target an area at a time, while hostility grows, players then have the choice to stay in the conflict area or move on to somewhere uncontested where they would be safer. The areas of conflict using the outlines for regions as the PVP combat zones, as soon as you cross over into say, Hispaniola from Puerto Rico, where Hispaniola has been marked as a conflict zone you become vulnerable to PVP attacks, no matter what nation you play.

The main benefits to this system is it streamlines PVP, doesn't portion up large chunks of the map, doesn't allow for such intense abuse as the current proposals, allows to give a more dynamic player experience, and somewhat addresses the problem of wild gank squads. Where as the only major drawback I can think of is that to some extent it takes away some of the trader hunter aspect.

To compliment this I would also like to see a karma or reputation type system, allowing for some leeway in attacking out of combat zones, but would like to see some penalties attached to this, for example a captain with poor reputation will struggle to generate hostility and face other fairly harsh drawbacks but be able to attack players more freely, where as on the flip side a notorious player would be fairly free game, even despite alliances or neutrality.

Thank you for reading

[Shrez]

No risk no fun i don't like PvE at all.

[lizard280]

While I'm a new player to this game (day 4, totaling 28 hours) I'm not new to multiplayer open world games. Most of these games have a strong PvP community that sits happily within their designated zones, allowing both new and experienced players to enjoy PvE freely, with minimal worry of stumbling into a PvE zone. These players can trade freely, battle AI without having to watch their back and have fun. While oncoming changes do take into account the need for PvE, I find that it is in fact us, the PvE players that require the larger space to enjoy our game the way we enjoy playing it i.e. trading across vast distances without fear of attack, learning new tactics and mechanics by attacking AI and completing combat orders. This gives the player the freedom to learn at their own pace, without having to start the game under-threat of pirate attacks, or port battles.

In almost all open world PvP games I've played, the actual PvP has taken place in limited areas such as resource hubs or well-earning trade routes. PvP like this can still take place within a designated PvP zone. It could even be built into the "lore" of the game. "Due to the increase of violence in *PVP AREA COUNTY* *PORTS LOCATED IN PVP COUNTIES* are increasing demand for weapons and war supplies" something along those lines would make trading across PvP/PvE borders a much more profitable way of trading, while also giving PvPers more cargo-laden targets.

The idea of Karma for PvPers is a good idea, however why be a Pirate if you're going to listen to rules?

Perhaps a bounty system, this would be realistic, as known pirates would often have prices on their head. Pirates would accrue a bounty by attacking players outside of the PvP zone, the bounty would increase by the cost of the destroyed ship and the cargo on it.

Just my two pence on the idea, personally I'm all for it, as I don't believe the designated PvE zone will be large enough to house the full form of the current PvE gameplay.

[Ruthless4u]

Why make such a drastic change that favors to the small minority of the playerbase.

There is a reason the PVE server never took off, so how does limiting PVP benefit the game.

[Sir Texas Sir]

4 hours ago, Ruthless4u said:

Why make such a drastic change that favors to the small minority of the playerbase.

There is a reason the PVE server never took off, so how does limiting PVP benefit the game.

I see it this way if it doesn't work than they can make it smaller and smaller liek drop the Brits zone and than the French and well if all else fails the Spain.   Lets test it and see.  That and I know a bunch of people that play on PvP servers but refuse to fight and run that will prob be hanging out in that area.  So now we know where they are and don't have to worry about it if the rest of there nation gets rolled.

[Rychu Karas]

potbs had it very well solved. The one difference is distance, in potbs i need arround 20-30min to get any place on map. not 3-4hours.

[Zooloo]

Please no. What i like in NA is the hunting and patrolling. A hunt is not a hunt when it takes place in a small zone, and pvp events are quite bad to me.

[Rikard Frederiksen]

I'm afraid that I am absolutely dead-set against this idea. We are not playing a 'themepark' MMO. My three reasons arguing against are as follows:

• PvP zones would be fleet-central.
• It denies players who 'hunt', like myself, opportunities of doing so.
• It would rob the game of any sense of danger, or fear, when a ship appears on the horizon.

For the first: We only have to look at the current Admiralty events to see how this would turn out. Not in a 4th Rate or larger? Not with another 3-4 people in similar or bigger ships? Well, you're not going to do much PvP! From my own observations of the Admiralty event PvP areas the following occurs: Fleet A turns up, and either drops anchor or mooches around trying to spot a target or two. Fleet B turns up. Based on available numbers, one fleet runs from the other (who pursues). More ships turn up for the fleeing fleet, who turn around and pursue the other fleet. They go back and forth until finally a battle opens up. And the fellow in the 6th Rate, buzzing around in his favourite ship? No PvP opportunities at all except by suicidally engaging in a massive fleet battle.

For the second: I don't do Port Battles, I get out there and hunt targets - it is what our clan is about, really. We delight in surprising, and taking, larger ships with our smaller ships, or in taking trading ships (all with a bit of light-hearted roleplay involved), whether as a group or individually. By forcing all PvP to take place around where a PB would be would deny us the chance to play the way we like, the way we enjoy. So that would be a playstyle out the window.

For the third: Part of what is attractive about this game and its open world, as DayZ was (mod & the game), is the threat of not knowing who or what was going to come at you next. Spotting a sail on the horizon when hauling 2000 silver in an LGV (as I was the other day) is a troublesome moment, leading to frantic clicking on the ship to find out what it was. Most of the time I can AFK-sail everywhere as it is, it can feel so safe, but I want the waters of the Caribbean to feel terribly dangerous, and that I have to be on my guard the whole time, otherwise this game will just be all about being AFK.

My thoughts on encouraging PvP near a Port Battle would be to turn the area around the port into an Admiralty PvP zone until the battle takes place. That would centralize PvP to an area for all the big ships, and the rest of us can hunt elsewhere.

 

Edited March 22, 2017 by Rikard Frederiksen

[Fluffy Fishy]

Firstly I would like to thank you all for your responses, they are great to read through and hopefully I can expand on my original ideas to better appeal to a wider range of people. I am really pleased that mostly so far people have properly explained their reasons against my suggestion rather than just dismissed it which was what I was expecting.

I will respond to what has been said so far and start with answering Rickard:

I don't believe that my suggestion would severely limit PVP as much as focus it, with the original post I suggested something like one region a day, but I would be open to having more than one, where as the current proposal by the devs looks like roughly half the map will be lost permanently. I think its also important to remember that as we currently have 8 factions, so thats 8 declarable regions of conflict, in a map that is currently composed of 73 regions, having thought a little more about this having 2 each would work quite nicely in my eyes, thats 16 possible target zones. My other idea to help with this would be that you can declare an area of conflict at a set period of time, a count down and logistics period would then start, followed by the raising of hostility, then port battle. Its also important to remember that nations can take full advantage of the alliance mechanic and be involved with more than the conflicts that directly affect them. As part of this I would also like to see the return of multiple port battles, like proceeded the regional mechanics.

To answer Ruthless;

The main reason PVE never really took off to the same extent that PVP did was the distinct lack of features, the grind also had quite a high attrition rate. I have been around a long time and have seen most of the friends I have made get very excited and enjoy the game, then level up to rank 10 and sometimes level 50 crafting too, then just run out of things to do and lose interest, thinking back to the early game the PVE community was a solid base of around 500 people, with around 300 online at most time periods, they nearly all left as they got bored with the amount of content, some moving over to PVP. 

Zooloo:

This is by far the weakest end of my suggestion, there is no shame admitting that. I'm honestly not quite sure how to remedy this either, because you aren't alone, its what many players like. Although my intuition would be that now we are going to see 1 dura rolled out across the board we will see quite a few less people out on their own anyway, especially traders who now run a much higher risk to losing their cargo, and will therefore likely seek close protection from friends due to the much higher risks involved.

Rikard Frederikson:

I will try to keep to the same format that you have for ease of reading, to begin with the first; The whole idea of only large ships being useful is a criticism I have with the game in general where small ships just aren't very useful on a general level, the current l'Ocean or Agamemnon is something that hampers the game generally. It would good to see a system that properly benefits bringing a higher variety of ships, this could somewhat be addressed with the return of multiple port battles in areas, the upcoming changes to ROE mean that large ships will soon be quite easy to victimise and hamper by zergers in basic cutters.

For your second point I feel like I have mostly covered in my response to Zooloo, I am very sorry if thats not a satisfying answer for though you two though. I too would like to somehow do something to give players the ability to continue with your play style.

For the third, this seems fairly similar to your previous point, I'm sure everyone has their own views on this, I personally feel completely the opposite to you in this regard, where the presence of danger while just doing some light trading actually detracts me from the game, I'm not alone either, we have lost a huge amount of players to this reason you are supporting here. The risk to many people creates something that ends in frustration and therefore boredom, its the same issue that plagues the devs when it comes to facilitating PVP, the huge time periods of sailing in dangerous waters just aren't applicable to most people's lives, I like many others simply don't have time to spend sailing 2 hours for everything to be lost, in that regard AFK sailing is the lesser evil here, it creates too high of an attrition for players, who can't almost waste their time like this.

To conclude, I want to enable a better more symbiotic relationship between those who want to take part in PVE and PVP, both are important to the game. I am just trying to create some ideas that appeal to more people to benefit both ends, perhaps we are all missing something that could benefit us all here, the main trouble is that for the most part I feel like the audience who would critique and add to these posts have already gone, and we will gradually lose the game we enjoy.

Thanks again for the responses, I hope I have provided some alternate arguments.