PVE Server and PVE zones - Preliminary announcement.

[Hethwill]

2 minutes ago, Paulchen said:

What happens with ship notes i got at the challenges? Will they resist the patch?

Please refer to this announcement, especially the red bold paragraph.

 

[Bubba Smith]

On 3/16/2017 at 5:01 PM, admin said:

Hello Captains. 

This is a preliminary announcement - official statement will be provided later both on steam and here.

• PVE server will be closed down. All assets will be transferred to the redeemables on both PVP Global and PVP EU (new server names). Transferring players will be able to choose themselves and stay on the server of their liking. We understand that it is painful but with forthcoming wipe you are not losing anything.

Captains affected by this might ask: How can you PVE ignoring player vs player on the pvp server?

The answer is simple and elegant.

• PVE Zones will be added to the main servers.
• We deliberated very long about this as initially we wanted to have full loot pvp everywhere with no protection. But looking back it was not optimal. Some might say it was awesome, but in reality most hardcore games we know have pve zones, safe zones, high security space or some other form of buffer area. Such zone allows pve players to see the more alive world around them and try pvp from time to time maybe converting to pvp players. 
  • Players who will want to engage in PVE activities without any interaction with the outside world will have to choose one of 3 nations. Spain (Sisal spawn), France (French Louisiana spawn), Britain (around Mosquito coast). These three nations will have 2 spawns - main pvp and secondary pve.
  • This will basically turn Gulf of mexico into large PvE zone.
  • All free-towns inside the PVE zone will be removed to avoid safe transport of resources from inside the zone. 
  • Some resource locations will be re-balanced.
  • The only way to fight in the PVE zones will be to attack smugglers - which will from the patch create outlaw battle (FFA) - the mechanic that you can test on the testbed.

 

Approximate map of PVE zones

Admin:

I'm going to give this new map a try... with an open mind. I have read some of your posts and I understand that PvE is a -money sink- so if you don't mind I would like to ask you a few questions;

1) Is this PvE zone temporary, permanent or, you don't know until after the full game release and will decide then? 

2) So I assume any ships built in the PvE zone can be sailed, attacked and potentially sold in PvP areas like KPR for example? 

3) Will PvE areas still have regional bonuses like British refit and strength designs, I hope so!? Looking at your PvE map those areas already have the regional bonuses under the present system.

4) Will resources within the PvE zones be balanced allowing building of ships and upgrades? Will we get our earned blue prints back?

5) Will there be any McDonald restaurants at locations near ports? wink wink. 

Once I get direction, I will pass the info along to the clan. We do have players interested in returning under the new system to check it out. 

Thanks again for your time. 

 

Edited March 20, 2017 by Buba Smith

[Paulchen]

19 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

Please refer to this announcement, especially the red bold paragraph.

I know but i talk about notes not about vessels. Notes are items (or will they evaluate as an upgrade?) and can be converted into a vessel. Can i convert them after the ship wipe when i keep this notes?

[Angus McGregor]

27 minutes ago, Paulchen said:

What happens with ship notes i got at the challenges? Will they resist the patch?

I think this link addresses your question directly, but I must admit that it isn't 100% clear whether admin is referring to a ship note, or the the ship that was redeemed from a note. But it seems obvious that a redeemed ship would be wiped along with all the others, so I've interpreted this to mean the notes themselves have info in them (wood type, mods) that makes it necessary to delete them too.

Maybe a mod who can bend admin's ear can get a clarification on this specific point.

Safest thing would just be to hang onto the note and hope for the best. The materials gained from breaking it up will seem trivial to having the ship after the wipe.

Edited March 20, 2017 by Angus McGregor

[Genma Saotome]

IMO the entire debate here can be resolved with what ought to be a very simple change: Tag each ship for PvP or PvE and display only like-tagged ships to whatever "tag" the player is sailing.  That way PvE trading remains "world-wide" and there is no "keep-out" zone for PvP.

It would let the Dev's close down the current PvE server, and it's likely a far more simple change than what they are proposing.  Everybody wins, nobody is unhappy.

Edited March 20, 2017 by Genma Saotome

[Maloco]

4 minutes ago, Genma Saotome said:

IMO the entire debate here can be resolved with ought to be a very simple change: Tag each ship for PvP or PvE and display only like-tagged ships for whatever the player is sailing.  That way PvE trading remains "world-wide" and there is no "keep-out" zone for PvP.

It would let the Dev's close down the current PvE server, and it's likely a far more simple change than what they are proposing.  Everybody wins, nobody is unhappy.

That would be ideal, according to my point of view

[PIerrick de Badas]

Too easy to exploit. Everyone will use an alt to make trade and craft on PvP area...

[Koltes]

Please dont make PVE zones on PVP server. 

It will not work if there are "safe house" places size of 1/4 of the map where players cannot be attacked. They all will be doing their own thing there and you kill this gane for the PVP guy.

The only way you can combine the two is by making all capitals and their surroundings a high security zones, where it is still possible to attack them, but this will trigger game consequences, like a criminal tag, AI patrol fleet start chasing you out of the region etc.

PVE players have nothing on PVE server, so when they started migrating to PVP server they have become pretty active on forums and since then we see nail after nail into our PVP title.

Final verdict. This is PVP game. If you can't have separate PVP server - do not make NA PVE. But by all gods do not ruin our PVP game

 

Here is an example of how to create high security around capitals and also make conquest harder if its further away from the capital.
On this example map I have moved France and Sweden out of Antilles for the sake of balance.
This map is also missing trade hubs and routes, but this is a separate issue. Enjoy

Edited March 20, 2017 by koltes

[Mrdoomed]

On 3/16/2017 at 5:51 PM, Neptune said:

PVE Zones? What really? Come on you are seriously going to turn the only good servers on the game (PvP) Into PvP & PVE? What is this PoTBS 2.0? Sigh............ Words cannot express how annoying this is.

Seen this comming since no cooldown teleports where added. Even got suspended and comments removed for saying it was turing into world of warcraft on water. 

This game was so good at start of open world and WOULD have kept a small stronge long term population,  4 r 5k probably but i and others called what was happening.  They just tried to please everyone which we all know pleased nobody.  

Maybe NA 2.0 wont be a dud but i definitely wont pre buy it.

Edited March 20, 2017 by Mrdoomed

[Paulchen]

What's about Wappen von Hamburg? It was a present at new years eve. Do we get a new one? Or will Wappen von Hamburg become a reward ship like L´Ocean?

[Teutonic]

21 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

Decreasing PVP map is not a bad idea. This way PVP will happen in certain areas of the map, making easier to find.

Map is proven to be quite large and the Gulf an area without much pvp action due to being far from all nations homecapitals.

agreed. too many players the gulf is so far out there, that nothing really happens, even on PvP1 as I have been told. So I really don't mind if it becomes a PvE zone. It may have some economic disruptions for certain nations but I'm not worried.

[Koltes]

33 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

Decreasing PVP map is not a bad idea. This way PVP will happen in certain areas of the map, making easier to find.

Map is proven to be quite large and the Gulf an area without much pvp action due to being far from all nations homecapitals.

The only 2 reasons why map is "large" is because:
1. There is only 200 players on the server in average (this will be sorted with increase of population);
2. There is no PVP concentration zones that attracts players. In order to make PVP game should bring players together be it high concentration of resources area, trade hubs, trade routes, random events etc etc

The only reason why we are playing is because of hope that these issues above will be resolved. You decrease size of the map, tells me that those issues are not going to be targeted.

Are we going to decrease the map until it becomes a lobby?

[Mrdoomed]

On 3/17/2017 at 7:59 AM, JonSnowLetsGo said:

Game description from steam:

Naval Action is an exciting, realistic, and beautifully detailed naval combat sandbox immersing players into the experience of the most beautiful period of naval history - when sailing ships ruled the seas.

Maybe try a single player game rather than a MMO focussed game around combat?

Exept its neither sandbox or immersing,  unless teleporting ships,  invisible free port to port ship moving  , and fleets ofbdozens of ai ships pulled into your  battle because player ships have speed boosts is immersive.

[Corona Lisa]

21 minutes ago, Mrdoomed said:

Exept its neither sandbox or immersing,  unless teleporting ships,  invisible free port to port ship moving  , and fleets ofbdozens of ai ships pulled into your  battle because player ships have speed boosts is immersive.

Ofc its a sandbox or do you think its an arena/lobby based game? And about immersing: Do you want 100% realism? Weeks of afk sailing until you MAYBE see a single ship?

Edited March 20, 2017 by JonSnowLetsGo

[Jesters-Ink]

2 hours ago, Angus McGregor said:

I think this link addresses your question directly, but I must admit that it isn't 100% clear whether admin is referring to a ship note, or the the ship that was redeemed from a note. But it seems obvious that a redeemed ship would be wiped along with all the others, so I've interpreted this to mean the notes themselves have info in them (wood type, mods) that makes it necessary to delete them too.

Maybe a mod who can bend admin's ear can get a clarification on this specific point.

Safest thing would just be to hang onto the note and hope for the best. The materials gained from breaking it up will seem trivial to having the ship after the wipe.

Nope, he's asking about the NOTES for ships, if you keep the notes, are they going to be redeemable?

As for "only being able to attack contraband traders in the PvE area", whos smart idea was that? 

I trust you've heard of "Russian Roulette", you guys are playing it with a frickin machine gun and you guys should know better, you invented it ffs.

Edited March 20, 2017 by Jesters-Ink

[Wesreidau]

I'm just going to reiterate that a neutral-to-all faction for the PvE players and traders will have...

1. Net economic benefits for all factions thanks to cross-factional trade by a neutral party.

2. No interference in our port battles by keeping all regions in play.

3. Not create unassailable bases for friends or enemies off the Spanish capital.

4. Avoid high-sec / low-sec and no-tagging area rule shenanigans and confusion.

5. Keep the full map open for both PvP and PvE play.

[BoomBox]

On 19.3.2017 at 6:55 PM, Remus said:

They don't; I don't. But I'm pretty well catered for playing mostly PvE on PvP1, and personally I think having risk-free shipbuilding in the Gulf of Mexico will take something away from the game.

The problem with PvP1 (I cannot speak for PvP2) is that if you don't PvP you are thought of as doing it wrong, and this is sometimes expressed rather vociferously in chat. I expect that dropping a huge PvE zone into the server will make things worse as the existing players make plain their resentment. Perhaps the PvE zone should get its own chat channels.

The PvE server is a very different environment from PvP1, and the gameplay is differemt too, more like an historical sailing sim. I am sure there is a market to be had for it, if only the message could be got out.

btw, like your picture. I quite like our own wrens, but they're very dull compared to yours.

 

 

Remus da man , a well known POTBS man 

 

I agree on everything you said. As said earlier , i really enjoy sailing on pve. I have no problem sailing in the gulf

[jnovotny6]

5 hours ago, Angus McGregor said:

Just for the sake of argument, I modded one of my saved maps to highlight the idea of giving each nation a stake in the GoM PvE zone. It isn't pretty but it gets the concept across.

I gave 2 regions to the US, France and Spain to acknowledge their historical presence in the gulf, but yes - otherwise this isn't historically accurate at all.

Restricting the PvE zone to the actual gulf leaves more map for the PvP side, which I think is the primary emphasis for Naval Action. Let's face it, the GoM is a large body of water. Besides, the PvE people can make runs out of the gulf in the off hours when server populations are down and the risk is lower. They could also hire a screening fleet for protection.

I'm also sure there will be some bickering over the exact regions given, but there's no pleasing everybody. 

swiss? a formidable  navy. I would give Swiss a bigger area

 

 

[PaladinFX]

Personally I'm in favour of the PVE server merge so that it brings our community together and gives a positive benefit for those on PVE who want to engage with the PVP community a way to be able to do that directly yet still retains pure PVE content for those that want that. Our player base is too small for us to be divided IMO.

PVE players will quickly find out that the long held view on PVE that all PVPers must be scumbags who just want to screw with the little guy all the time is far from the truth for most of us PVPers. That understanding in seeing the reality on alot of what happens on the PVP server might actually help bring our community together more. I would suggest most of us on PVP want a fun well-matched battle and blowing up some midshipman in his cutter with our much higher rated ship isnt that interesting to most of us, we'd much rather be in a more challenging battle!

There are many of us who started on PVE (me included, I ranked to Rear Admiral on PVE but have been PVP only for over a year now) to develop some skills and try out the game before migrating to the PVP server and there are probably some current PVE players doing the same right now. PVE is still a great way to get started in NA for those who have just purchased the game. The move from PVE player to PVP player will be a much easier and smooth transition if we are all on one server.

PVE players should have a dedicated PVE chat tab on the new merged server.

The map with the proposed zones for PVE that Admin have now posted shows that there will be a big area for PVE only although I personally would like the devs to find a workable solution for PVEers to have access to the whole map. A very difficult one I understand as you dont want all trading on the map to be PVE and hence no traders to attack in PVP.

 

With regards to the move to PVP-EU(with PB lockout times) + Global Server suggested by the devs:

Personally I am in agreement with Jeheil as he stated in this weeks Letter to the King Episode 52; I think the devs are overreacting to the recent "nigh flipping". This hasn't resulted in huge swathes of the map now being green in American hands and having an EU server with time in lockout when PB's cannot happen is overkill IMO. And lets face it the Danes or whoever can organise for their own "night flip" if they so choose!

Personally I think with player numbers as they are, it is time to do the long hinted at merge of PVP2 into PVP1-EU and have ONE Global Server ONLY. Bring the whole community together so that there are more active players online at the different prime times AND off times!

Devs it's time to bring our community together!!!

Edited March 20, 2017 by PaladinFX

[Lord Heyford]

I'm a PVE player but I see this as a fun possibility. Strategy-wise, I'd take a fleet of war ships to the edge of PVE zone and escort clan members to La Havana.

[Bubba Smith]

34 minutes ago, PaladinFX said:

Personally I'm in favour of the PVE server merge so that it brings our community together and gives a positive benefit for those on PVE who want to engage with the PVP community a way to be able to do that directly yet still retains pure PVE content for those that want that. Our player base is too small for us to be divided IMO.

PVE players will quickly find out that the long held view on PVE that all PVPers must be scumbags who just want to screw with the little guy all the time is far from the truth for most of us PVPers. That understanding in seeing the reality on alot of what happens on the PVP server might actually help bring our community together more. I would suggest most of us on PVP want a fun well-matched battle and blowing up some midshipman in his cutter with our much higher rated ship isnt that interesting to most of us, we'd much rather be in a more challenging battle!

There are many of us who started on PVE (me included, I ranked to Rear Admiral on PVE but have been PVP only for over a year now) to develop some skills and try out the game before migrating to the PVP server and there are probably some current PVE players doing the same right now. PVE is still a great way to get started in NA for those who have just purchased the game. The move from PVE player to PVP player will be a much easier and smooth transition if we are all on one server.

PVE players should have a dedicated PVE chat tab on the new merged server.

The map with the proposed zones for PVE that Admin have now posted shows that there will be a big area for PVE only although I personally would like the devs to find a workable solution for PVEers to have access to the whole map. A very difficult one I understand as you dont want all trading on the map to be PVE and hence no traders to attack in PVP.

 

With regards to the move to PVP-EU(with PB lockout times) + Global Server suggested by the devs:

Personally I am in agreement with Jeheil as he stated in this weeks Letter to the King Episode 52; I think the devs are overreacting to the recent "nigh flipping". This hasn't resulted in huge swathes of the map now being green in American hands and having an EU server with time in lockout when PB's cannot happen is overkill IMO. And lets face it the Danes or whoever can organise for their own "night flip" if they so choose!

Personally I think with player numbers as they are, it is time to do the long hinted at merge of PVP2 into PVP1-EU and have ONE Global Server ONLY. Bring the whole community together so that there are more active players online at the different prime times AND off times!

I tend to agree with you on a couple of points but from a completely different angle, I started on PvP and ranked up to Lt/Cmdr and then switched to PvE which I much prefer. I'm apprenhensive about this one server for both PvP and PvE but realize the economics just don't support a 3 server system. I think it is the good only compromise and I appreciate the staffs efforts to keep both sides happy in a such wonderful sailing sim. There will be issues and both sides will have to roll with the punches. I can see concerns with PvErs getting surprised by attacked on their brand new St. Pavel wilst sailing it down to safer waters but there is a tow option after all. Another issue maybe one side building or buying ships and even resources from the PvE area and sailing them back to their own regions considering 3 of the total nations share the same flag. This will be interesting to see and as a L50 crafter I'm going to be watching this carefully and use direct sales instead of selling on the market if it becomes a problem. I think some of us in our clan will welcome the odd PvP battle in a challenge but most of our 52+ member clan aren't interested in PvP,  I won't speak for them they will decide what's right for their game style. They may change their minds after all. I hope that sometime in the future when finances allow a seperate PvE server and map with AI Port battles and more ports to discover will return to NA. Until then captains, I wish you good winds and a star to guide your ship by. Regardless of which game-style fits you, PvP or PvE we are all Naval Action fans. 

 

Edited March 20, 2017 by Buba Smith

[Jesters-Ink]

6 minutes ago, Lord Heyford said:

I'm a PVE player but I see this as a fun possibility. Strategy-wise, I'd take a fleet of war ships to the edge of PVE zone and escort clan members to La Havana.

Yes, sounds brilliant doesn't it? If people played the game like a sim instead of quake it would be brilliant.

My personal experience from a little over a months worth in PvP......

Realistically/historically, a main fleet would have used frigates as its eyes, but in game, we have main fleets using other fleets, sometimes from other nations (enemy nations too), just to milk the mechanics.

You get port campers popping in and out to draw attacks away from other objectives.

Players buying the npc built ships and reselling them at double the price.

It human nature to screw each other over and it's the same in PvP.

An example of my style of play. I'm on my way into port to send some deliveries when a French trader is on his way out. He is too far out to make it back in safe so he makes a run for it. I'm a little slow on the uptake, but I give chase. I tag him at mid range, not a good tag as I was half asleep, but I manage to keep him tagged for 3 more minutes. He's got a faster ship than mine and eventually escapes. I was in the wrong ship for trader tagging anyway. I hit OW thinking I will see him sailing off, but on the way back to port, I see him just spawn into OW. I PM him saying, you escaped my friend, so you are free to go. He spends the next 10 minutes or so figuring out if I'm trying to trick him. 

Whist in my trader, I get pulled by a Renie and a Surp, both guys are ramming and trying to slow me from both sides.

Right after they cap me, I'm back out of port and they tag me again, both times I'm empty but I give um one hell of a fight.

They got nothing but my dura. So Why do I prefer PvE, because it feels a hell of a lot more realistic than the BS on PvP.

This game could be epic, if it was played in a more relaxed and gentlemanly way, but we are too few to make it work.

Make it fun for us or don't, but give it some thought at least.

[Mrdoomed]

2 hours ago, JonSnowLetsGo said:

Ofc its a sandbox or do you think its an arena/lobby based game? And about immersing: Do you want 100% realism? Weeks of afk sailing until you MAYBE see a single ship?

Hahahahaha if you think this game is still a sandbox game then you probably think pac man is sandbox. You should play swtor it would be the biggest sandbox you ever seen. Btw this issarcasm because im sure you wont get it.

 

Since you have ZERO clue what youre trying to say let me tell you what NA has become its now what is called a Theme park game. Obviously if youthink any game that is not arena is sandbox you undoubtedly will have no idea what im referring to. 

Edited March 21, 2017 by Mrdoomed

[Genma Saotome]

2 hours ago, PaladinFX said:

The map with the proposed zones for PVE that Admin have now posted shows that there will be a big area for PVE only although I personally would like the devs to find a workable solution for PVEers to have access to the whole map. A very difficult one I understand as you dont want all trading on the map to be PVE and hence no traders to attack in PVP.

My suggestion is to tag all ships as either PvP or PvE and then show the same tagged ship to each player as what type he is sailing.  This would keep PvE across the entire map as well as allow the DEV's to consolidate servers.

[Koltes]

4 hours ago, JonSnowLetsGo said:

Ofc its a sandbox or do you think its an arena/lobby based game? And about immersing: Do you want 100% realism? Weeks of afk sailing until you MAYBE see a single ship?

This game by any means is NOT a sandbox title, but it is an Open World game. People often confuse these two terms.

Sandbox is where you have minimal character limitations. There are no skill trees, no ranks, no crafting timers (or labor hours), no PB timers, nothing... You just got game tools and the only limitation you have is the possession of those tools. If NA would have been a sandbox game you would have been able to sail 1st rates on the first day (providing that you some how got possession of it). You would have been able to craft anything you like straight away. Nothing would stop you. Take that hammer and craft whatever you have resources for. Take that ship cutter and attack that 1st rate, or the fort. You will get smashed, but you can still attack it.
Progression in Sandbox type gameplay is controlled by availability of the goods/tools/weapons. You play to acquire those assets that will enable you to do those things.
So Sandbox is one of the existing gameplay mechanics and usually take place in an open-world setting as to facilitate the freedom of choice a player is given.

The Open World game is just a non script format in which player may freely travel, rather than being restricted to confined areas. Open World game setting can be a Sandbox gameplay or can be RPG type with a typical character progression through skills and levels/ranks.

Terms "Open world" and "Sandbox" are often got mixed up and used as synonyms which is wrong as they refer to completely different concepts.
(!) One is gameplay the other is game environment.

Naval Action is player driven Open World (as opposed to EVE Online Persistent world) MMORPG game.

Inability to tell the differences has caused lots of silly arguments that otherwise would not even exist, either talking about same thing but using different terms or talking about different things using the same term.

Edited March 21, 2017 by koltes