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National news rework 3 - discussion


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1 hour ago, admin said:

We stand by all the bans we do in game and here. bans on forum are very rare. bans in game are 100% for mentioning player mothers or sisters in a negative light. Those bans are issued every week. Some of those reviewers could be issued temporary bans by mistake  (we all make mistakes). But most of those reviewers you mention are people who shit on others get punished and then cry about the so-called professionalism in return. Community reports such people and we ban them. And most of those reviews are very strange.

For example - one recent review - the person calls devs/mods fascist for not letting him post. He did not even know that all posts are pre-moderated to reduce penis enlargement spam and 2 first posts must be approved by mods. He claimed its fascism. 80% or something found it helpful. 

Community helped us to remove such reviews before - when someone lied about us you took action. This post below was initiated by a community member who was appaled that someone has lied in the review saying we have premium content for sale in game. That review was flagged and dissapeared.

Its a two way street LV.
I see no reason to keep NN for the moderation reasons. Someone calls a person mother a really really bad name. We moderate him. He goes to reviews and claims we are fascists. NN currently escalates often to a need of moderation. What have you as a promoter of NN section done to reviews who call us fascists? Only community can flag them. we cant. 

Because you dont remove those reviews by flagging we dont see a reason to escalate the problem even further. No NN - nothing to moderate -Less negativity reviews about moderation.

if you got my hint you can save NN.

 

Problem is mods they see problems where there is none.

 

Wanna an example?  of how they create job for them where is no need?

I made a "troll" fun post becouse the forum also conteplate   forum pvp k?    where i claim that my clan will switch nation and hide in white letters, SORRY NOPE

Do you know what happened?

my thread got edited             (really he edited  SORRY NOPE )

i got warned by 1 point, and every of my reply where needed to be accepted by a mod, all becouse of a fun post.

So i obviously reported such mod to INK for an exageration of his actions,  INK removed the infraction etc etc

 

Later in the same thread we started talking about another clan i not  name, nobody was insulting anyone, it was a divergence of opinions and some provocations about who leads better etc, no bad words or insults.

A mod, i not name,  famously linked to such clan, come to IMPOSE ME  in my own thread that i cant talk about that becouse i started the thread with another purpose, a preposterous illogic and completely made up excuse  from whom he was obviously tryng to force me to not talk about that  becouse he had a conflict of interest.

That is not the moderator work, he is supposed to moderate if we insult, but we should be free to talk about what we want as long we not cross the edge.     I point that out to him         and he locked the thread becouse he was failing to impose his censorship on me talking about his friend clan, i not was breaking any forum rules.  He was blatantly tryng to censor me.

 

all of this was totally un necessary, a waste of time,   so if the mods are less biased they can avoid 70% of the work since they generate that by themself.  IF ppl flame each other regards game, battles clans etc withouth calling each other mothers they should be free to do so since is part of any game with clans politics and competition.

 

And about the reviews no i am not talking about stupid ppl making stupid accuses, but i remember clearly american moderators players banning with every excuse my clan members when we where usa  abusing their positions for an in game-conflict.  (we even recorded thrue a spy in an american council, their national leaders telling  that every usa mod should ban from chat members of my clan with any pretest/excuse possible)      Is your fault? nope, but you made unprofessional ppl with huge conflict of interest in that roles... And by doing their job poorly they give NA a bad reputation in matters of mods and community administration, they payd nope, but that not means you cant fire them. 

Or when i got banned for 1 day? officialy by mistake. (in reality exactly after i did a long thread of criticism and denunce of mods behavior)

 

Or when i posted a similar reply to this one explaining and denuncing mods behavior and got eliminated.   maybe you dont see them but we do, they jump around even in steam forums censoring, and white knighting anything that  you post, against the players, Look the recent thread  where you ask our opinion regards new mechanics,  majority expressed an opinion that diverge from your and the mod team jumped around giving you likes give likes to themself, making comments for try hide the general unhappyness.

I understand that  keep you happy is their job if they wanna keep/justify their position  (never bite the hand of the master) but there is also intellectual honesty and a limit a line from wich a collaborator stop to be a collaborator and become an acritic funboy with the jihad  mission to censor any comment that not fit the story telling that please you.  But that work of philtering the reality damage more you then us.

 

 

Edited by Lord Vicious
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I dont particularly like to get involved in drama,however,it does seem to me that there is a few bad apples who are either genuinely toxic,or roleplay too much.Be advised one particularly toxic player is not well regarded by the community,from reading this forum the thing that i would recomend is more agressive moderation.Questioning moderators actions outside of pm  is something most forums ban people for.Certain players should be temp banned,alot of the time posts stray into the realm of baiting the opposition.Personally i think its a shame we have reached the point where this is neccessary.

Perhaps a downvote system would be a good idea.

If a post recieves a large volume of downvotes,it is subject to review by the moderators.

I hope the forum dosent change its format,just root out and remove the bad apples.

Another tactic would be to introduce server temp bans in game for those who breach all the rules.I for 1 would support this.

 

Edited by MajorGosnell
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1 hour ago, MajorGosnell said:

I dont particularly like to get involved in drama,however,it does seem to me that there is a few bad apples who are either genuinely toxic,or roleplay too much.Be advised one particularly toxic player is not well regarded by the community,from reading this forum the thing that i would recomend is more agressive moderation.Questioning moderators actions outside of pm  is something most forums ban people for.Certain players should be temp banned,alot of the time posts stray into the realm of baiting the opposition.Personally i think its a shame we have reached the point where this is neccessary.

Perhaps a downvote system would be a good idea.

If a post recieves a large volume of downvotes,it is subject to review by the moderators.

I hope the forum dosent change its format,just root out and remove the bad apples.

Another tactic would be to introduce server temp bans in game for those who breach all the rules.I for 1 would support this.

 

Agree with 99% of this.

I would also like a 'Ignore this thread' option. I *hate* paging through notices of flame bait crap in a few threads that have flared up that I have ZERO interest in.

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1 minute ago, Angus McGregor said:

Agree with 99% of this.

I would also like a 'Ignore this thread' option. I *hate* paging through notices of flame bait crap in a few threads that have flared up that I have ZERO interest in.

When you see a thread get off topic, report it.  We can't be everywhere at once.  I assure you, those sorts of reports are much more appreciated than the 99% that we get that fall into the category of:  "I disagree with this person, and want to 'win' the argument by silencing him or her."

What some people are missing (or choosing to ignore) is that National News isn't going away.  It's just that now Captains need to work to roleplay, and can't keep doing this low-energy, flame-bait, sophomoric drivel.

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56 minutes ago, Powderhorn said:

When you see a thread get off topic, report it.  We can't be everywhere at once.  I assure you, those sorts of reports are much more appreciated than the 99% that we get that fall into the category of:  "I disagree with this person, and want to 'win' the argument by silencing him or her."

What some people are missing (or choosing to ignore) is that National News isn't going away.  It's just that now Captains need to work to roleplay, and can't keep doing this low-energy, flame-bait, sophomoric drivel.

Understood

But not really what I was commenting on - there's threads I can tell just from the title that I don't want to read the avalanche of flaming it is sure to provoke.

Edited by Angus McGregor
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I fully understand the concerns and frustrations Admin raised.  Looking at many of the posts on this forum, they do nothing to help the game.

The trolling and nasty comments back and forth all detract from the game.

What many of you forget.  This is a publicly viewable forum.  Prospective buyers of Naval Action can read through these pages - and what do you think a potential buyer is going to make of all the caustic comments, personal attacks and flaming?  

We all want more players of this game... 

As an aside to this Devs, you might want to reconsider which pages of the forum are accessible to the general public.

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3 hours ago, ElricTheTwo said:

I fully understand the concerns and frustrations Admin raised.  Looking at many of the posts on this forum, they do nothing to help the game.

The trolling and nasty comments back and forth all detract from the game.

What many of you forget.  This is a publicly viewable forum.  Prospective buyers of Naval Action can read through these pages - and what do you think a potentialarrow-10x10.png buyer is going to make of all the caustic comments, personal attacks and flaming?  

We all want more players of this game... 

As an aside to this Devs, you might want to reconsider which pages of the forum are accessible to the general public.

Precisely that ..... Thinking about possible new players, who enter the forum to evaluate if this game is alive or dead, to know if there really are people who play, have fun and do things in it, close NN Will be another big mistake of the devs ........

From my point of view, it would be easier to buy the game if I go in and I see a lot of people throwing the tackle to the head, that if I enter and there is nothing and I do not know if someone is playing or not ........

Of course it would be desirable another attitude in certain players, but if the devs have no possibility to really moderate and really eliminate those who only seek to muddy ..... Better to be quiet, before closing it ..... that It will only give the impression that this game is dead ....

But maybe I'm wrong.

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6 minutes ago, Alvar Fanez de Minaya said:

Precisely that ..... Thinking about possible new players, who enter the forum to evaluate if this game is alive or dead, to know if there really are people who play, have fun and do things in it, close NN Will be another big mistake of the devs ........

From my point of view, it would be easier to buy the game if I go in and I see a lot of people throwing the tackle to the head, that if I enter and there is nothing and I do not know if someone is playing or not ........

Of course it would be desirable another attitude in certain players, but if the devs have no possibility to really moderate and really eliminate those who only seek to muddy ..... Better to be quiet, before closing it ..... that It will only give the impression that this game is dead ....

But maybe I'm wrong.

I think you're missing part of the point that the devs made. They've basically said that they will close NN, and *replace it with something better*. 

What they have described, having a new national news forum revolving around role-players, streamers, content creators and reports from in-game, rather than revolving around trolls and flaming like now, sounds perfect to me. What will get potential new players to want to join the game is not the mudslinging, trolling and racism that permeates the forum now and drives away both veterans and new players alike. What will rather get new players to want to engage in the game is content like this:

Sea diaries, journals, sea vlogs, very committed roleplay diplomatic announcements and so on. Devs want to give this content more room, and the trolling removed.

 

 

 

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As a youtuber,im concerned that by removing the ability to respond to content the viewing figures will drop considerably.Also i take pleasure in engaging with people who respond to my footage.Its great to get feedback and to develope my content better,I would urge the mods to rethink this,its clear to everyone who are the bad apples/prone to writing essays and memes.Just start policing them,make it abundantly clear that toxic behavour has penalties regardless of clan affiliation or rank.

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On 2/18/2017 at 1:47 AM, Powderhorn said:

There was once a time where people would do up actual political cartoons, newspapers that looked like newspapers, treaties that looked like treaties.

We want that back.

We eagerly look forward to the content players create.

 

the reason that died out ,,,is it takes a bit of effort to do ...there isnt that much news to report ....and it becomes pretty boring to read after awhile ... while i have no specific objection to such a news channel ...what is wrong with trolling and flaming the people you fight against ...obviously racism and insulting people s families isnt acceptable ..and it should be kept in one section of the forum ... but I enjoy the forum sparring between players it also adds something to the game ... when you are in battle in game with someone you have an axe to grind because of forum comments .. it makes the actual game more interesting ... as with any forum or post you do actually have the choice to read or not read ...to post or not post .... I would suggest that national news at the moment contains the most entertaining posts ....and is the most read section on the forum

Edited by Grundgemunkey
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15 hours ago, MajorGosnell said:

 

As a youtuber,im concerned that by removing the ability to respond to content the viewing figures will drop considerably.Also i take pleasure in engaging with people who respond to my footage.

 

Unless they completely reform NN into a sort of article format accompanied with a layout change, I doubt that the plan is for replies to topics to be removed. I do not know for sure, but I imagine that OP creation will be limited to approved content creators, while replies will still be open to anyone. This will allow mods to crack down on off topic and derailing threads a lot more than now, since the creative content in the OP will be more in the focus, and at the same time it will focus the types of topics created in NN. It will hopefully root out OPs created simply to troll, flame, bait or incite conflict.

 

46 minutes ago, Grundgemunkey said:

what is wrong with trolling and flaming the people you fight against ...obviously racism and insulting people s families isnt acceptable ..and it should be kept in one section of the forum ... but I enjoy the forum sparring between players it also adds something to the game ... when you are in battle in game with someone you have an axe to grind because of forum comments .. it makes the actual game more interesting ... as with any forum or post you do actually have the choice to read or not read ...to post or not post .... I would suggest that national news at the moment contains the most entertaining posts ....and is the most read section on the forum

The trolling and flaming going on in NN inevitably spills over into other forums and discussions. It creates higher tension in the community and locked positions, and respect goes out the window. It's also mostly the same few players flaming and trolling in NN, cheering each other on or riling each other up, often against players who are not active in the forum either because they were driven away or because they do not write English well enough to respond. NN right now is dominated by players playing for nations with primarily English speaking populations. Other nations' voices are drowned out. Players from other nations get flamed and provoked, without the opportunity to respond, or if they try to they get instantly flamed by many people, and often mocked for their English skills.

People need to recognise that this game has a global community. In many western countries the online culture of throwing insults, flaming, lying and being generally obnoxious, is accepted as harmless banter and fun. But just like is often pointed out when discussing the issue of night flips, the globe is round and cultures differ around the world. Not all cultures have people as accustomed to being insulted, flamed, wrongly accused or trolled at. If you want a global community, a growing population and diversity of players, then the community needs to be kept respectful and civilised. Neither describes NN right now.

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FINALLY!!!!!

 

I have been writing letters incessantly to H.H. the Pope about this forum, and finally, my prayers have been answered.

As Metropolitan Archbishop of Habana, and, by extension, of the whole Caribbean, and ultimate theological and moral authority around these waters, I believe censorship should be rigorously applied, with an iron fist.

Free will and freedom of speech are inventions of troubled minds from the so called "Illustration", revolutionaries, godless souls, who will burn in hell for all eternity. The idea of liberty is an invention of the malign himself.

Liberty leads to debauchery, debauchery leads to the cells of the Holy Inquisition. The Cells of the Holy Inquisition lead to the fires of the Holy Inquisition, and these fires lead to eternal damnation in the fires of hell.

I offer you, Sir, my good, experienced and ruthless officers of the Holy Inquisition to enforce order, good manners and fear of God in the National News forum.

And I offer you my blessing, In nomine Patri, et Filii, et Spiritu Sanctu, Amen.

Edited by Don Inocencio Botillo
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18 hours ago, Anolytic said:

The trolling and flaming going on in NN inevitably spills over into other forums and discussions. It creates higher tension in the community and locked positions, and respect goes out the window. It's also mostly the same few players flaming and trolling in NN, cheering each other on or riling each other up, often against players who are not active in the forum either because they were driven away or because they do not write English well enough to respond. NN right now is dominated by players playing for nations with primarily English speaking populations. Other nations' voices are drowned out. Players from other nations get flamed and provoked, without the opportunity to respond, or if they try to they get instantly flamed by many people, and often mocked for their English skills.

People need to recognise that this game has a global community. In many western countries the online culture of throwing insults, flaming, lying and being generally obnoxious, is accepted as harmless banter and fun. But just like is often pointed out when discussing the issue of night flips, the globe is round and cultures differ around the world. Not all cultures have people as accustomed to being insulted, flamed, wrongly accused or trolled at. If you want a global community, a growing population and diversity of players, then the community needs to be kept respectful and civilised. Neither describes NN right now.

while i agree with 90% of that ..except that you will never stop flaming and trolling ....some are just more subtle about it than others ,,,,and locking it out  will not stop it and it will then spill over into other discussions

i think this is a fantastic forum it is diverse and everyone has the opportunity to have an opinion ... being English I have the ignorance of never bothered or thought the need to learn to speak another language and therefore would never think to mock another persons English skills when it is not their primary language ...they only have to reply to any such mocking in their own language .to put someone in their place

I don't read Spanish , French,  Russian sections of this forum because i don't understand any of those languages ...I have no idea what has been said in those sections of the forum ..

you forget that reading a thread isn't mandatory and you have the option to read or not to read 

the main problem is that the game is about real world countries and most people want to play for their real world nations except strangely  the Dutch ...( see what i did there?)

the easiest way to get rid of nationalistic taunts and insults is do away with the in game nations ..and make some imaginary nations ... even better let players make up there own nations and flags ...that clans and players can join  . it will take away the stupid nationalistic pride and bigotry that comes from real world and is brought into the game ...imagine having 15 or 20 different imaginary nations fighting over territory  it will lead to a complicated set of of alliances truces and broken truces that will imo only enhance the game ...it will also negate the night flip problem

people can then troll and flame without upsetting each other 

 

 

Edited by Grundgemunkey
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I'm outraged at this latest announcement no more national news where will I get my salt at work lunchtime??? Chips won't be the same without N-News Salt.............hang on did you mention REWARDS how do I get a them sign me up... 

 

Sad day when there's no nation news on here , means I've got to go to 2 sites now not one ...

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On 2/17/2017 at 7:29 PM, Anolytic said:

Thanks! This was long overdue.

The National News section has devolved into base trolling, racism and shouting matches. And it has spilled over a lot into other sections of the forum, to such an extent that many players I know do not want to post their suggestions or opinions about the direction of the game because of all the flaming and trolling that goes on from some members even outside the National News. I myself also stopped using this forum actively for a long time, because it was just a shitstorm and nothing serious.

The forum has become highly unfriendly to players who use English as a second language, and to anyone who does not belong to the "club" of trolls and cheerleaders who think they alone own the game and wish to limit open discussion of mechanics solutions by bullying and flaming.

What this guy says. I am one of those players that comment less and less about proposals and suggestions because of all that goes on in those threads and how good ideas get buried in the deluge of responses that are generally unhelpful.

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4 minutes ago, Johny Reb said:

What this guy says. I am one of those players that comment less and less about proposals and suggestions because of all that goes on in those threads and how good ideas get buried in the deluge of responses that are generally unhelpful.

Beside proposals and suggestions have nothing to do with national news LOL

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