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Grouping up with other pirates, as we do sometimes, is exactly the point over fleets.

 

I am always delighted to see players escorting their buddies. It shows the social aspect of the game is alive and well outside the brawls and PBs.

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I am always delighted to see players escorting their buddies. It shows the social aspect of the game is alive and well outside the brawls and PBs.

 

problem: it is not worth the time...."trading"

 

Players learn this quickly, the "rate of return" on time investment is just too bad...compared to farm via rage boarding...

 

Basically, only low exp. players trade...or "you need to have a buddy" to play with...

 

Clans don´t do big transports, I have no incentive to share the transport margins

with another player....rarely will I get picked...actually "fleets" are a waste of crew....

 

"frustrated", nothing compared to the first few hours ingame,

when you really worried about your first "cash" coming home...

Edited by Wilson09
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I did record two consecutive combats versus a pirate hunter that was using a fleet privateer with him. Retreated in the first  being bracket'ed by both in a bad spot and then re-engaged forcing him to run away and lose the NPC privateer. Was a marginal victory but overall I'd say he could've done way better without the fleet.

 

Both rounds revolved about him letting the NPC do the combat for good. He learned nothing.

 

Do I care ? Well... it is annoying. The OW would be better without fleets. Smart traders travels with the roaming NPCs already, we exchange some lines in the chat and salute each other a unsafe trip and we go our separate ways :)

You are proving a point where this person lost more with an escort that what otherwise would have been. The cost of the ship and crew far out weighs the gains received in battle. The NPC actually becomes a noose around the next because you cannot cut it loose until back in port. If those like you who find it annoying can let time pass you should start to see a change in behavior. If it is too expensive to use then it won't be used often.

Just look what the cost of the crew has done for the game.

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problem: it is not worth the time...."trading"

Players learn this quickly, the "rate of return" on time investment is just too bad...compared to farm via rage boarding...

Basically, only low exp. players trade...or "you need to have a buddy" to play with...

Clans don´t do big transports, I have no incentive to share the transport margins

with another player....rarely will I get picked...actually "fleets" are a waste of crew....

"frustrated", nothing compared to the first few hours ingame,

when you really worried about your first "cash" coming home...

Well youre looking at it from a xp or gold gain pov. What about escorting a trader that has 2000 iron going to a port to sell and aid your nation in capturing 4 ports?

Players need to look past the tree to see the forest to make this game all it could be. Do players have this in them ?

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Jean LaPointe, I did mention earlier that I also use trader ships as well too. But again I plan my route travel at non peak hours. But I have lost large loads of goods to player's alone and who were fleeted with others. I'm okay with fleet of players attacking my trader. Part of the game. Sometimes I get another player to escort but mostly i'm alone. No one likes being gawked. But in this game if you travel alone it will happen with groups of players or clans out hunting. I accept this part of the game. I do it too.

 

But AI fleets for players is not acceptable with me. If this game is going to be big one day I would want players grouping up hunting traders or other combat ships. But not a player and his AI fleet. If you attack someone and a AI fleet sailing around is nearby fine, That is the breaks. But I feel each player needs to learn to operate his ship. play w/other group up etc etc. AI fleeted players are taking the fun right out of this game.


NO PLAYER AI FLEETS !!!!!

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Ojibwa, you and I have used much of the same tactics and strategies when trading on the high seas. I have tested the use of the AI Fleets and as they were first used months ago was probably was the best version of AI fleets. This was where you could get a fleet with either a lynx or cutter and could obtain a fleet  up to the 3rd rank (2nd Lt - USN). After which point you can retain what you have but cannot replace or obtain and new ships once reaching this rank. It was a huge help for the new person as you see how the fights are conducted. As you gain experience and lose the ability to have a Fleet you are weened off of the dependence and hopefully by this time in the game an individual has gained the experience both as a ranking officer and financial to sail solo without the crutch. 

 

With the change in the mechanics I was leaving port, a warship enters the world behind me. He spots and enemy AI warship and tags it, the next thing I know I am in a battle between the two ships. Sailing solo I was able to escape without a loss. Had I had a fleet with me I would have lost those ships to the battle. I would have lost any ship with 1 duro, lost a duro on any ship greater than one and would have to replace any crew killed in the action. I will be experiences like this where the new/solo person will have to learn to work around. Let alone deal with the expense with any or all replacements.

 

I believe there is a use for Fleets, but in a limited scope. Anyone worth their salt will learn in a short time a fleet is not what they think it is but a false sense of security. The only individuals that could benefit from utilization of a fleet is the new players where they are still trying to learn ship handling. As long as the new person is sailing in a cutter that does not cost him anything to man and repair, fleets are an inexpensive item. Once they start to buy other ships then the expenses start to increase causing the idea of Fleets to become not so appealing.

 

I have used fleets as a method to transport ships from one port to another. I was being lazy and decided to move more than one ship to a different port. I even got caught doing this. Since I was in a trader, I had no way to defend myself. The attack force was overwhelming for me to even attempt to try to escape. No matter the outcome I was going to lose it all, so I surrendered because it was the only way to keep all crew intact and cut the cost of the loss by keeping my crews. But in this case it was used as a tool for transporting ships from location A to location B which has nothing to do with using fleets as a fighting force.

 

But I am fully aware AI fleets for players is not acceptable for you, while I do see a limited, positive use for Fleets. I don't see AI Fleeted players taking the fun out of the game but see it as a reason to after them to "teach" them a lesson. I had seen a trader go by me once and had wished I was in a frigate, it would have been a fun battle. He was in a trader snow and had a Santi as a Fleet escort. The tactic would have been, sink the snow and then take the Santi piece meal. The cost in crew replacements would have been costly. And if he had use only the minimum 10 crews, it would not have taken much to cap that 1st rate. His loss would have been enormous.

 

So I do agree that we disagree on the subject. As there are many like us here on both sides. A compromise will need to be made in order to tolerable for both parties.

 

Great discussion by the way!

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I agree we disagree Jean but a lot of Pirates's work alone at times I for one. There has been a lot of talk about pirates in SOL's, frigate and other ships. A lot about pirates not being or acting like pirates. We travel in groups for PvP as some nations are looking to attack pirate groups and ports and the such.Other pirates like to work alone and hunt the trader. In history as we all know a many a trader traveled w/out escort. Such is the case of pirates looking for a quick haul. When this game came out a lot of us went pirate right off the bat. I for one. To hunt the trader when trading came to be and the trader player traveling alone. You had a pirate hunting a trader as in history a lot of times one on one. Now with AI fleets being available to a player. The devs have effectively taken out the lone pirate hunter. Now you may say I too have the option to have a fleet of my own. That would exclude me or other pirates being hunter's.

 

We accept the fact we may run into a group of national's hunting us as we have attacked there traders. We accept the fact we may be lured into a trap of what we think is a trader but in fact a decoy to be gawked, but we do not accept AI fleets with a player when we want to hunt alone. I want to put my skills to the test.I want to put my skills to a group of players who have gawked me trapped me hunted me when I was hunting their trader's I do not want to be hunted by a player and hi AI fleet. Why have pirates then in this game.

 

Might as well take us pirate's out of it.

 

Dev's, Please remove the player AI fleets.

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It comes down to risk management as well. I will not let greed get the best part of things andd risk my neck to a coastal guard patrol waiting outside of battle.

 

Was in that spot a couple days ago. Three Snake were outside waiting. I got a full loaded prize snow... and my pirate ship. There's no way I could get away with the full prize so I took what I could fit in the Hyena, therefore managed to hit and most important, run.

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Ai fleets;

  • Encourage AFK fishing...
  • Encourage larger Gank-fleets
and...
  • Discourage traditional, historically accurate piracy.
#NoFleets!

just say I don´t like AI fleets, simple

all this so called "reasoning" and nothing thought to the end...

Removed unnecessary antagonism.

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I am confused by this last part.

 

Discourage traditional, historically accurate piracy?  So what you want the pirates to go around door to door, selling cookies? 

 

No need to be confused. You know a trader either sailed alone or asked for help, as in the human communication sense, by pleading, for crying out loud HELPME !!, or by request to the Navy Boards of the several clans.

 

Sailing alone, because traders are always in a rush to do everything fast, carries danger.

 

That's what pyracy carries when we go about History - menace to trade.

 

Now which part of everything are you confused about ?

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There is a lot of misinformation going on. By the last decade on the height of pyracy, western world, prizes were even put ablaze with horrific consequences. Was the age of the war with the world, sadly.

 

Earlier buccaneer and even after the split of crews between Jamaica and Haiti were way more soft.

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I tell you the fun is going from this game. PPL with AI fleets take the fun out of it. I was what I thought was an essex against a firgate. Me essex other other a frigate. It didn't show he had a AI fleet. Got into a battle he had a fleet. WHY!!! Why do people feel the need a fleet. You want to beat me. Beat me one on one or in a player fleet then. But if you have to have a AI fleet WHY WHY WHY are you in this game. GET RID OF THESE AI PLAYER FLEETS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Did you even think of any AI fleets/ships around when you tagged him?  I just hit a Trader Snow cause I was board and wanted to test out a new ship build.  I got into battle and there was a Navy Brig in the battle too cause he was close by.  Not every battle that has AI is cause of a player fleet.   The exact same is if that other ship was a player you didn't see.  Now you aren't just playing against one player and AI you are now fighting two players.  What is the diffrence?  To me I would prefer to fight the one player and an AI than two players cause the AI tends to not be the smartest ship on the sea with it's actions.

 

ofc, but clans dont care, they have an "internal" system of provision...

 

We do care.  We use LVG's and Indiman all the time to haul cargo from one area to another.  Should of seen our fleets the night we switched from US to Pirates, some one could of been a very happy camper, but we ran with others as escorts until we got out in the BLUE WATERS.  Just how do you think we get that "INTERNAL" system of provisions?

 

Fleets count for BR difference :(

 

At the very very very bottom line I would like for the fleet BR to be ignored.

 

They should.  What is the difference from you hitting one ship and two AI's or hitting three players?  Nothing other than what controls that ship.  You don't want to hit something with a high BR that you can't fight than don't hit it and pick a more easy target.

 

I am confused because of his wording.  Discourage historical piracy.   Historically pirates targeted easier cargo ships of value.   They tried to capture these ships and take them and their cargo as prizes, or would just take the cargo if the ship was to large or just deemed not worth the time.   It was astoundingly rare for a pirate to actually sink a ship, especially if that ship was a cargo ship. 

 

 

So this is my confusion.  By using the word DISCOURAGE, he means to deny or refuse, the ability or act of piracy.   So  he doesn't want pirates to be pirates?  

 

Pirates waited for a prime easy target to take.  They didn't rush after every escorted ship.  So if you see a Trader with two escorts (AI or Player) will you hit him cause you are out matched or will you wait for the solo player and easy target to come along.  Sounds like you don't want to wait and just want the easy target.  You need to stop thinking of just the player but the ships as a whole no mater if they are run by player or AI.  Wait for a more easy target or get some friends to help you if your out number.  There is nothing stopping you from using AI or even getting...>GASP< other players to help you.

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There is a lot of misinformation going on. By the last decade on the height of pyracy, western world, prizes were even put ablaze with horrific consequences. Was the age of the war with the world, sadly.

 

Earlier buccaneer and even after the split of crews between Jamaica and Haiti were way more soft.

Not to mentioned most pirates where just Privaters for one country and was listed as Pirates for others.   Yah  the only time you really saw a prize come back was in the Navy as they will ransom or refit them for service. 

 

This is why I think Nationals should have a send to Admiralty that only sends it to be sold.  you never see  it and you get your prize crew back when you get back in port.   As for others they need to take that ship back to there home port to refit it, scrap it or sale it.   It shouldn't be a click button and it's sent back home and you keep saling like nothing happen.  I would love a surrender option that you can ransom off a payment to keep some of your cargo and crew after a battle instead of loosing every thing.  Since the winner would have to haul the ship back himself or as an AI that would mean they would be more willing to let you go after such ransom and pickings of your cargo.

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Maybe so. I think the option will always be down to the player BUT only with the crew he brought from Port. The rest of the crew pool should be untouched and unreachable until we make port again.

 

Fleets, if they are to stay must at least be reviewed.

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just poor b*******

 

just say I don´t like AI fleets, simple

 

all this so called "reasoning" and nothing thought to the end...

 

My "so called" reasoning is based on scientific fact as it regards to the field of Motivational Psychology, which I do have a degree in, Cum Laude.

If you want me to educate you as the WHY this is the case, better put on a pot of coffee, as this will take a few hours to explain. The Extremely short version is; people want to win,They prefer to do it one on one (the ones with courage anyway) But if Solo Victory becomes unlikely (that is to say 50/50 ) the still want to win, and if that means they have to gang up to do so, they will. Ai fleets make grouping a necessary condition for increasing the perceived probability of victory.

 

Also.. don't ye DARE lecture me that I don't know what historical pyracy were… I think me reputation on the subject be beyond reproach. I even F-ing spell it correctly. So Nah! :P

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just poor b*******

 

just say I don´t like AI fleets, simple

 

all this so called "reasoning" and nothing thought to the end...

And as for calling me names… Ima gonna call ye out.

 

 

I am a Bad Ass pyrate with an infamous reputation, well earned. I am feared and respected by many. What you are doing is trying to cut me down to size by saying something mean about me… just like a catty school girl in the hall with her friends. That's what yer actions show ye to be… Now live with that for all here to see!

 

 

Bwhaahahahah!  :lol:

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I am confused because of his wording.  Discourage historical piracy.   Historically pirates targeted easier cargo ships of value.   They tried to capture these ships and take them and their cargo as prizes, or would just take the cargo if the ship was to large or just deemed not worth the time.   It was astoundingly rare for a pirate to actually sink a ship, especially if that ship was a cargo ship. 

 

 

So this is my confusion.  By using the word DISCOURAGE, he means to deny or refuse, the ability or act of piracy.   So  he doesn't want pirates to be pirates?  

 

Nay laddie, wot i be saying is that the AI fleets make sailing the solo ship, wot to steal lone traders, next to impossible.

Ever seen a trade lynx AFK fishing with two conies as a fleet? That did not happen. 

If so many are complain that they want pyrates to act like real pyrates… then the AI fleets directly. I say  DIRECTLY prevent historically accurate piracy from taking place.

Aye, there were examples in history of pyrate fleets, but those are few in number and very rare indeed. Almost all pyrate vessels acted alone. And the same went for trade ships. Remember, these ship owners wouldn't even pay out for food that could keep the crew alive! :o Hence the need for Impressment.

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